Editorial 2005: The Year in Review

[Azura's Star]

-Less skills: I'll give you that...on the other hand, who ever used a language skill in Daggerfall?

Wouldn't it be better, in regards to gameplay, to make it so the skill would have opportunities to be used and useful, instead of it being removed completely? Sometimes features are cut from a game because they aren't appraised, because developers don't take the time to see how they could be improved and just remove them. Not saying that this is what Bethesda has done or does, though; but sometimes that's definitely the feeling we get.

Yes, that would have been cool. I can't really see how you could have made that many language skills all have opportunities tied to them, but it would have been cool to have a "linguistics" skill in Morrowind, which would let you get extra information, avoid fights sometimes, etc. However, I mentioned them as a way of saying that just because Daggerfall had more skills didn't necessarily make character creation deeper, because a lot of those skills were useless.

*edit*

Morrowind's enchantments were underpowered? Wow, I thought it was completely the opposite. It was very easy to exploit and fun in a munchkiny sort of way.

Correction: Constant Effect enchantments in Morrowind were underpowered. Cast When Used enchantments were way overpowered. Either way, I thought they were poorly implemented by degree, but not by concept.

 

[Jon]

Morrowind's enchantments were underpowered? Wow, I thought it was completely the opposite. It was very easy to exploit and fun in a munchkiny sort of way.

I thought it was broken. It was pretty easy to enchant all the spell effects you wanted davaluing the ability to pick locks, sneak etc.

 

[Vault Dweller]

-No climbing: True, but the addition of jumping and levitating that were actually meaningful (like, they could get you to interesting places, instead of just over stuff).

DF had both in very meaningful ways. Climbing was important because it was the alternative to levitation, plus a great skill for thieves, PLUS dungeons actually had air shafts and walls that could be climbed, thus giving alternative ways to get to things.

-Less skills: I'll give you that...on the other hand, who ever used a language skill in Daggerfall?

Sounds similar to "who ever used crossbows or spears", or "who ever joined the Nine Divines club". The language skills added flavor for certain builds like pure explorers and they gave you a chance to handle otherwise hostile encounters without combat. Great skills!

Besides, it's not the language skills only that've gone missing, but Medicine - alternative healing, Backstab & Critical Strike - great for thieves and assassins, Swimming, etc

-Less guilds: Perhaps less (I haven't counted the ones in Daggerfall)

30+

but way more varied

No

-Crappier quests: I disagree. There's no denying that Morrowind was heavy on FedEx/kill quests, but Daggerfall was even worse, with its randomized quest system! God, you thought those were good?

The variety and quality of those random quests were much higher than those of the handcrafted quests in MW: protect a guild, use your mage abilities, investigate appearance of a deity, find rare - not some flowers nearby - ingridients, etc

-Poor character system: Well, I do miss the advantage/disadvantage system, but I think Birthsigns are a reasonably decent replacement. And it's not like the advantages or disadvantages were in any way original or unique, like the ones in Arcanum.

They don't have to be unique, they simply have to be there to help you make any character you want. There is nothing unique about Climbing, but it greatly enchanced character options. Same here.

PS. Birthsigns sucked.

-Poor enchanting system - Morrowind's enchantments were underpowered (stuff just didn't have enough enchantment points), but I thought the basic system was superior to Daggerfall's.

Of course, it was. Without disadvantages, the system became totally awesome!

 

[Azura's Star]

[snip]

Well, I still disagree on some of those, but I'd also forgotten certain things (disadvantage system on enchanting, for instance, which was kind of important ). I agree that there were elements of Daggerfall which were superior to Morrowind; as it turns out, there were more than I remembered. However, I still don't think it's as simple as saying Morrowind was just a dumbed-down version of Daggerfall. And I still think guilds in Morrowind were better than the ones in Daggerfall.

 

[Vault Dweller]

Well, I was glad to help you remember things. A fun fact: you can still run DF on WinXP with DOS Box.

 

[Jason]

I'm still running it on XP without DosBox. Cause i'm special like that.

 

[Sabregirl]

I must agree with VD on the Daggerfall character system being superior to Morrowind's- birthsigns were NO substitute whatsoever. The original Birthsigns in Morrowind were just plain awful. Only about 2-3 of them were much of any use at all and generally they had no drawbacks, save the atronach and sort of the apprentice. The Lady was just ridiculously overpowered.

As to the quests, at least Daggerfall's WERE random. In Morrowind, every time you played through a guild it was the same identical fed-ex quests . . . although at least you were sure they wouldn't be broken . . . There were SOME reasonably inspired MW quests but not very many. Overall, though, I think I'd take the random quests over the same pick flowers and mushroom quest every time.

Everyone said that spears were useless too. I did enjoy the spear of Bitter Mercy and Hircine's spear. But no they were DEFINITELY useless. It's the same old deal, Bethesda implements something poorly and then instead of balancing or fixing it, they just up and remove it.

-S

 

[Elwro]

I guess BG is an old-style classic only if you were born in the 90's.

For old style, play e.g. Dark Sun (for a good RPG) or Dungeon Master (for a great dungeon crawler).

 

[kingcomrade]

That TES thread is gold.

I, being of RPGness, was greatly insulted by these [censored] crap-ass reviews, I am going to hunt them down tie them up, and pour fuel on them, And light up! I will offer their burnt bodies to Lord Dagon, :bowdown:

I can see the venom glistening on your fangs.........

Frankie reminds me of Volourn.

the FACTS are all over the place if you took the time to find them.

if bloodlines was the best rpg then they are right about 2005
but overall they are a buntch of negative SOBS that clearly hate RPg
" bet the y are a buntch of counterstrike pwnsors
that clearl dont have aclue
if they cant look at the bright side of oblivion tghen they should shoot themselves

RPG is evolvong with time and if u cant accept that then ur a "quote" a tard"
RPgcodex guys are rebels and prolly Dos rpg nerds who can accept the future of rpg`s

the fact that Morrowind and oblivion was and will be soled most on consoles is becous with consoles they know that people can play them after buying them

-

Seriously guys, I know its hard to accept but the days of dungeon crawling where half the screen is taken up by text and stats is gone. It's just one of those things. Let it go.

Because we have nothing but love for dungeon crawlers here on the Codex. Hooray for Dungeon Siege!

And here's my favorite:

How do we know they have?

Priceless.

 

[POOPERSCOOPER]

spazmo is right and all you guys who are debating are wrong.

 

[Nicolai]

Multiple endings are pretty fun and all that, but when it's one of a game's major selling points, you usually just get to pick between a bunch of vaguely dissimilar endings at the very end of the game. You can do all kinds of wacky stuff while playing the game, but you'll still get the same 3-4 endings to choose from when you're about to wrap it up.

Deus Ex comes to mind.

 

[Mech]

That TES thread is gold.

I, being of RPGness, was greatly insulted by these [censored] crap-ass reviews, I am going to hunt them down tie them up, and pour fuel on them, And light up! I will offer their burnt bodies to Lord Dagon, :bowdown:

I can see the venom glistening on your fangs.........

Frankie reminds me of Volourn.

the FACTS are all over the place if you took the time to find them.

if bloodlines was the best rpg then they are right about 2005
but overall they are a buntch of negative SOBS that clearly hate RPg
" bet the y are a buntch of counterstrike pwnsors
that clearl dont have aclue
if they cant look at the bright side of oblivion tghen they should shoot themselves

RPG is evolvong with time and if u cant accept that then ur a "quote" a tard"
RPgcodex guys are rebels and prolly Dos rpg nerds who can accept the future of rpg`s

the fact that Morrowind and oblivion was and will be soled most on consoles is becous with consoles they know that people can play them after buying them

-

Seriously guys, I know its hard to accept but the days of dungeon crawling where half the screen is taken up by text and stats is gone. It's just one of those things. Let it go.

Because we have nothing but love for dungeon crawlers here on the Codex. Hooray for Dungeon Siege!

And here's my favorite:

How do we know they have?

Priceless.

Holy crap, that is the most hilarious thing I have ever read in my life.
This was the best part:
"the fact that Morrowind and oblivion was and will be soled most on consoles is becous with consoles they know that people can play them after buying them"

That almost made me die from laughing.

 

[Volourn]

Except for the fact I LOATHE the ES series, and I LOVE The Codex.

P.S. Still doens't change the fact that the article lies over,a nd over again.

Heck, they couldn't even get the short blurb about me right.

I *never* said the Codex was stalking me. I said the Codex was stalking someone else who was innocent.

Morons.

 

[Whipporowill]

I *never* said the Codex was stalking me. I said the Codex was stalking someone else who was innocent.

So it's not like stalking you would be weird enough, now we're being blamed for stalking innocents? Innocent of what? Being YOU?

 

[LlamaGod]

I *never* said the Codex was stalking me. I said the Codex was stalking someone else who was innocent.

you wont even say what the hell is going on, so shut up already

 

[Spazmo]

Internet death threats? Awesome!

I, being of RPGness, was greatly insulted by these [censored] crap-ass reviews, I am going to hunt them down tie them up, and pour fuel on them, And light up! I will offer their burnt bodies to Lord Dagon, :bowdown:

This one is good, but it'd really be great if he said he'd pee on the ashes afterwards. I'm also awful glad he made sure to censor out that dirty word, because otherwise it might have been pretty intense! Man!

 

[LlamaGod]

half of these people that claim to be "RPG fans" are just a bunch of retards whos first "RPGs" were shitty Final Fantasy JRPG console games and then daddy got a Compaq so they played the CRPG equivelents on it (black isle, bioware and bethesda games).

 

[Drakron]

I think my first RPG was Lands of Lore.

I liked RPGs but disliked party based ones (I think because of "Descent to Undermountain" ), I got BG despite of that and enjoyed it very much ... I also like IWD.

I like RPGs but I know the diferences of a "JRPG", a action RPG, a "cRPG", etc ...

In fact if you ask me about Final Fantasy (I played VIII on PC) I will say the same issues that plage cRPGs are happening on consoles RPGs, were voice acting and 3d graphics are removing gameplay (heck just check FF IX spell list vs X spell list).

I will always disagree when people blame consoles for the downfall of computer games since the same downfall is happing on consoles for the exact same reasons.

 

[Volourn]

"you wont even say what the hell is going on, so shut up already"

Hey, don't blame, I didn't write the article! I thought it as a dead issue but I guess the Codex felt slighted by me so they had to whine about it some more since I dared to call them out on stalking.

R00fles!

 

[POOPERSCOOPER]

Well maybe since it was a List of People the codex pissed off and Exitium was on the list then you were most likely to show up on it. It was a big event when u left and it made grown men cry in joy and sadness.


Just because we found out your wrestling background does not make us stalkers. It makes us soldiers.

 

[Volourn]

The Codex didn't piss me off. They pissed off the person they were stalking, and that person pissed off me and then I pisse doff the Codex.

WE ALL WIN!

P.S. They still lied in the article which is nothing new for the Codex. That's what they do. :D

 

[POOPERSCOOPER]

No, they spazmo didn't really lie. He just gave people the gist of the whole year and didn't get into the nitty titty details that only the elite know about.

 

[Volourn]

Okay then...

 

[FrancoTAU]

What does "R00fles" mean?

 

[Drakron]

The Codex didn't piss me off. They pissed off the person they were stalking, and that person pissed off me and then I pisse doff the Codex.
...

And they made a game too ... sort of ...

http://www.hentaineko.com/html_peekv/pe ... iko3.shtml