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Spiderweb Avernum 4, am i getting too old for this or it's just not enjoyable?

Discussion in 'General RPG Discussion' started by HoboForEternity, Sep 8, 2020.

  1. HoboForEternity sunset tequila Patron

    HoboForEternity
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    i played geneforge 1-5, all 3 avadons, all 3 avernum remakes, and i enjoyed them with various degree of love. geneforge 1/2 being my favorite, the avernum remakes arent bad too, even avadon which i still mildly enjoy.

    avernum 4 is just there. . .

    the combat feels simpler than the remakes, melee char don't have abilities to use, so combat become as repetitive as having a tank just stand there doing damage when they can and the priests/mage carry the whole DPS/buff/debuff.

    the encounters are boring and you can spend 3 hours clearing a dungeon filled with trash mobs. i mean jeff vogel games are always full of trash mobs but this time it feels a lot more repetitive than the previous one. with some exception of games like geneforge 5/6 that's full of trash mobs with 700+ HP. i got to the castle, and this is where the plot pick ups finally, but at this point i just lost motivation.

    maybe i am getting too old for this kind of RPG that require you spending 2 hours fighting trashmobs.
     
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  2. OldSkoolKamikaze Arcane Patron

    OldSkoolKamikaze
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    Codex 2012 Codex 2013 Codex 2014 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Make the Codex Great Again! Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 BattleTech Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire
    I feel this way frequently. I think it's a combination of higher standards and less free time. The last few years I've been starting a lot of games and just not finishing them. It's not that these games are necessarily bad, I just get distracted by other things. I start thinking I'm just moving on from gaming, but then every once in a while I come across a game that just completely captures my attention and I make free time for it and burn through the game like nothing.
     
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  3. Hobo Elf Arcane

    Hobo Elf
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    You're not old, Avernum 4 is just a bad game.
     
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  4. HoboForEternity sunset tequila Patron

    HoboForEternity
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    is 5 and 6 the same?

    i feel like 1-3 has exhausted the plot for this setting and the whole themes is just combination of the previous games.
     
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  5. Hobo Elf Arcane

    Hobo Elf
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    Kinda, yeah. I like the A1-3 remakes a lot, but the 4-6 trilogy felt stale and dull to me. Like it was just made with quantity instead of quality in mind.
     
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  6. Comte Arcane

    Comte
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    Dude how old are you? You got any kids?
     
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  7. amurath Educated

    amurath
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    Avernum 4 is probably the weakest game in the whole series. Avernum 5 has an interesting premise, while Avernum 6 offers a nice conclusion to the series (although it's a bit too railroaded for my liking, but that's somewhat understandable given the nature of the overall problem you have to deal with). In general, all of Vogel's older games are long and filled with lots of trash mobs. I'm not sure I would want to replay them again today.
     
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  8. HoboForEternity sunset tequila Patron

    HoboForEternity
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    27 single, no kids, only a cat.

    but i don't have time for this crap anymore.

    dunno about the rest, but in 4 i already guessed who did it the moment you get out of the first town. avernum 1: fresh, interesting setting learning about avernum and its politics / races. avernum 2: finally learn about the stuff we're teased in the first game, the great cave with strong barrier, travelling to vahnatai lands. avernum 3: epic confrontation with the empire, vahnatai conspiracy, finally built bridges between surface and underworld.

    when i started avernum 4, i didn't know what i expected, but it's vahnatai again, with a mix of human conspiracy also. i actually like the continuous world map instead of the "overworld" like in the remakes, but he filled it with too much crap, not much C&C so far (maybe later in the end) and the setting doesn't wow me anymore. the format is similar with avernum 3 in a way that "Town X got trouble Y". he tried to make it interesting with more obvious over-arching conspiracy and the shades instead of generic monster invasion, but it's not enough. it's exhausting. i do like seeing the consequences of the original trilogy plays out, but yeah.

    i enjoyed all the geneforge game and jeff did something new and maybe the setting is still a lot more generic.

    avadon is . . avadon, it's wasted potential but the characters especially blackbeard made it for me despite a lot of the cultures being under developed, but the trash mob is pacified at least.

    queen's wish, well . . maybe that's what started my doubt towards jeff's game.
     
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  9. Yosharian Magister

    Yosharian
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    I could never get into Avadon, the world just feels really bland and didn't excite me. It's in some weird no-man's land, doesn't have the polish of games with bigger budgets or more people working on them, but doesn't have the wild creativity of underground games like Nethack or whatever. It just didn't appeal to me at all.

    As for the getting old thing, as a person much older than you, my theory on this is that we become less willing to accept mediocrity as we get older because our tastes become more refined.
     
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  10. Black_Willow Arcane

    Black_Willow
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    That's a proper age to be moving into retirement home, not playing video games.
     
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  11. Falksi Arcane

    Falksi
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    All the Avernum games are a slog, mostly for the reasons you list.

    Great in theory, but dull as dishwater in practice.
     
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  12. Avarize Educated

    Avarize
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    Euthanasia isn't off the cards either.
     
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  13. Pope Amole II Prestigious Gentleman Nerd Commando Game Studios Developer

    Pope Amole II
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    5 and 6 are the peak of the series and they're probably Vogel's best games combat-wise - G 1-2 are probably better but not due to combat, more because of exploration/choices/narrative. TBH, it's very stupid of you to play all his nu-shit without playing them first because all his new shit is nothing but Avernum 5-6 cut and severely diluted. They're also his only games (outside of Geneforge and mb Nethergate) that are built on the really interesting ideas.
     
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  14. V_K Arcane

    V_K
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    You've just played too much Vogel, and he's not a terribly versatile designer.
    Personally, I've played A4 only having played Exile 3 and Geneforge 1 before that, and enjoyed it for what it is - a relaxed exploration-focused game, a sort of turn-based Morrowind. It's also probably the most open-ended Avernum game.
    On the contrary, I didn't like either A5 or A6. A5 is too linear an formulaic - arrive to a new area, find some factions, side with one of them, rinse and repeat. A6 is just boring.
     
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  15. xuerebx Augur

    xuerebx
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    I got burned out on Avernum 3: Ruined World, too much of the same and the over world isn't as engrossing as the underworld. I bought all of Vogel's games in a steam sale a few years ago but I don't think it's worth playing the original Avernums since I've played the remakes.

    Looking forward to the new Geneforge game though, hope he delivers (unlike Queen's Wish, which was mediocre).
     
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  16. Terra Savant

    Terra
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    Loved the Geneforge games (especially 1 & 2) and Avadon is alright for a single playthrough, but I just struggled to get through any Avernum game. Not a fan of the full party creation aspect, I would rather just be controlling my PC & monsters ala Geneforge rather than the game giving me 3 more characters that never speak and exist purely for combat. I like the idea of Avernum, but it's just never held my attention like Geneforge did. Queen's Wish evoked pretty much the same reaction when i tried to slog through that game too. I'll just stick to ones I like rather than trying to force it.
     
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