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Betrayal at Krondor - overrated?

Wyrmlord

Arcane
Joined
Feb 3, 2008
Messages
28,886
This is by by far the CRPG I've played with the deepest and most complex story line, even outdoing the Riftwar books (Silverthorn in particular was a very basic story). I can't think of any other game that has combined such a complex story with such an open world, and with proper CRPG mechanics, like character development, skills, items and a decent combat system. Usually in games with emphasis on story the story is on rails, there is no exploration and the combat is too simplistic.
I know, right?

It's like the only combination of an exploration game and a complex narrative game.

The game is also so different. Like, if there were sub-genres of RPGs, we need a category for BaK.

That's surprising what you say about Gorath's death and its impact. But then again, you really do feel that he led one life of hardship. I really liked his conversation with his wife, where he tells her that the moredhel's obsession with war and vengeance has hollowed them and gained them no fruit. That combined with his memories of how his family was killed in Delekhan's conquest and expansion of other tribes, you find him a product of a really heavy life. He has a grey beard in this game, but then you realize that he is actually younger than Delekhan. Which shows how that life has really aged him badly.
 

PetrusOctavianus

Educated
Joined
Dec 20, 2012
Messages
98
I wrote a long review of BaK for GOG, but they seem to have some problems with their potatoware, so I'll post it here instead:


Betrayal at Krondor is one of the games I missed out on since it was DOS only when I still had an Amiga. So I played it for the first time and completed it recently.

Before playing the game I read all four books of the Riftwar Saga. I think that helps enjoying the game even more, when you see people and places you already "know".

The most unique thing about this game is how it combines a complex story line with quite an open world to explore, and proper CRPG trappings like skills, items and a decent combat system. Usually in games with emphasis on story the story is on rails, there is no exploration and the combat is too simplistic.
There is a quite a bit of ambiguity in this game, and there are no mwhahahaha!-evil enemies, even though some of them are definitely mustache twirling. Your enemies usually have an rational reason for doing what they do.

Many questions will go unanswered and you are bound to miss a lot on your first playthrough. As such it feels more "real". You never get all the answers in real life, either.
And don't be surprised if some of the "good guys" actually die.

The magic system is also quite unique, and only a few of the spells are explained in the manual.

So this is really a game of discovery.

But it's not a perfect game.

The graphics were rather dated already in 1993, and while the digitized pics of actors in costumes look rather silly and goofy, they are still much better than sickeningly "cute" artwork or anime.

My biggest annoyance with the game is of all the people you can meet in the wilderness only enemies not lying in ambush can actually be seen. NPCs with whom you can talk just pop up from nowhere and it's thus possible to miss some of them altogether, and miss part of the storyline. Sometimes you know enemies are lying in ambush if your Scouting skill is good enough, but you can never _find_ them. And if you want to fight them having good Stealth skill is actually a detriment, since it means you will try to sneak past the ambush. I wish there was a way of flushing out ambushes. After all, the enemies can sometimes detect the player's attemps at ambushes.

All in all this was an excellent game, and it's also one of the old CRPGs that have taken me longest to finish.
 

RK47

collides like two planets pulled by gravity
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Dead State Divinity: Original Sin
needs a remake...like a high AAA production value to show biodrones how fucking awesome a real epic plot can be.
in b4 owyn X gorath fanfic
 

PetrusOctavianus

Educated
Joined
Dec 20, 2012
Messages
98
BTW, interesting that the game feels more mature, realistic and "grey" than the books.
More protagonists die in the one game than in the four Riftwar books. Only two minor characters die in the books.
The Moredhel feels more like persons in the game than they do in the books.
Not everything is so neatly tied up at the end in the game as it was in the books.
 

abnaxus

Arcane
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Joined
Dec 31, 2010
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Fiernes
I maintain Tomas and the poisoned arrow is a lame cop-out. He could easily have been a party member in the Forbidden Planet chapter, and would've made the repetitve encounters with the Pantathians tolerable - one-shotting everything in one turn, as overpowered as he is. But in the final battle of that chapter his melee prowess would've been useless compared to Pug's magic.

Plus he could've offered some lore dumps about the Valheru and the ancient wars they waged against the gods. It's a missed opportunity.

in b4 owyn X gorath fanfic
no_riddle_by_blu3vibration-d4poeqn.jpg
 

Broseph

Dangerous JB
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Nov 24, 2012
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Globohomo Gayplex
Bought this on GOG a few days ago and I think I'm in love.

Such good stuff. Game is easy enough but occasionally challenging as well, and the fucktons of flavor text, well-written story, and awesome interface more than makes up for the incredibly dated 3D. I'm on Chapter 2 now after a fair amount of exploration. I'd say it took me about 6 to 8 hours to get through Chapter 1. I'm trying to be pretty thorough with my exploration.

I would definitely support a Kickstarter of a remake/spiritual sequel what-have-you of this game. :takemyjewgold:
 

Mother Russia

Andhaira
Andhaira
Dumbfuck Queued
Joined
Jan 6, 2012
Messages
3,876
Codex 2013
I maintain Tomas and the poisoned arrow is a lame cop-out. He could easily have been a party member in the Forbidden Planet chapter, and would've made the repetitve encounters with the Pantathians tolerable - one-shotting everything in one turn, as overpowered as he is. But in the final battle of that chapter his melee prowess would've been useless compared to Pug's magic.

Plus he could've offered some lore dumps about the Valheru and the ancient wars they waged against the gods. It's a missed opportunity.

Actually Tomas had powerful magical abilities as well as being the most powerful warrior on Midkemia, if not the universe. It's just that being Valheru, his magic was completely different than the higher/lower path magic of Tsurani/Midkemia that Pug and Macros the Black employed. In fact, I do believe in one of the books Pug thinks Tomas is actually more powerful than him, potentially at least.
 

Broseph

Dangerous JB
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Globohomo Gayplex
Okay, I've been trying to use the CD Music option in the GOG version but it unchecks itself every time I enable it in the preferences. Any bros out there who can help with this?
 

Kahlis

Cipher
Joined
Jun 23, 2012
Messages
408
Bumping this thread because we haven't talked about BaK in a while.

Okay, I've been trying to use the CD Music option in the GOG version but it unchecks itself every time I enable it in the preferences. Any bros out there who can help with this?
I always copy games from GOG into my own DOSBox directory (and run the original installer if possible) so I don't remember what commands they configured to launch their version, but in BAKCD\ there should be a bak.inst, which if you open in Notepad is actually a track listing pointing to all the .ogg files in BAKCD\music\. I've been using this, may not be the command the GOG installed version used but it works for me:

imgmount D bak~1.ins -t iso -fs iso

In the beginning I tried mounting bak.gog, the real disc image, to try and run the CD music without having the music directory kicking around but it didn't seem to work. On the other hand, there's some cool goodies on there like the Feist interview video.
 

DalekFlay

Arcane
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Oct 5, 2010
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New Vegas
It was my first RPG ever and I am sad to say my 14 year old ass was baffled and never finished it. I keep meaning to go back to it someday.
 

Rhuantavan

Arcane
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Developer
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Sep 25, 2012
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726
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Ergendon, Merrentar
Codex 2012
Since I was a kid I must have played it through like seven times and I keep coming back at it. On each playthrough you discover new things and each time is a great experience. That's how games should be made.
 

Kahlis

Cipher
Joined
Jun 23, 2012
Messages
408
I've always wondered what the deal was with the magical wooden chest in Chapter 7 - the one that momentarily lifts you into the air and provides the most technologically majestic 3 seconds in the entire game. It just seems like such a strange thing, I wonder if it was supposed to be for locating the Rift Machine. When I played BaK I'm pretty sure I was already told its location by one of the characters in the area long before locating it, though.
 

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