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Diablo Immortal - MMO ARPG for mobile platforms - massive butthurt at Blizzcon

somerandomdude

Educated
Joined
May 26, 2022
Messages
187
I see some old and new accounts defending the game, things at headquarters are that bad, huh?

The game is gutter trash. It's poor man's Diablo 3 with pay to win mechanics. IMO, it's a waste of bandwidth to even download it.

Nobody is forcing you to play Diablo Immortal.
Yeah but the fact that it exists and makes money sets a precedent that ruins everything for the rest of us. This don't like it don't buy it bullshit is tiresome, we've heard it since horse armor.

I don't think regulation is a permanent answer as Australia has proven countless times that even if you do have regulations they can still get around them. And in every involvement governments around the world have had with the games industry it has proven incredibly ineffective hence why the ESA exists (but honestly it shouldn't I hate the ESA (and its Australian branch the IGEA) with a passion).

In my opinion, there are becoming fewer reasons to even care at this point. The industry is lost. We've been priced out by a bunch of cashed-up yuppies. (as in our buying power no longer means anything when a whale can buy 100x that)

Smaller studios will still make some decent games, but the AAA stuff? Yeah, I'd expect to see more and more pay to win stuff, even in games people paid for. The really scummy practices started in Asian markets, and then got exported to the West. They get away with it because enough idiots pay it. We still got games like Path of Exile that are fair about it with MTX, so that's the best example of a way to do it that's reasonable, IMO. Put over 1000+hrs in that game before I gave GGG anything, and spend $60 or $80 on stash tabs and slots. I felt like they deserved me giving them something.
 
Joined
Feb 11, 2018
Messages
6,610
Location
Every fantasy game ever.
I don't like how POE puts all the cool cosmetic shit behind paywalls especially given how these sorts of games are driven by feeling and looking like a big dick savage.

Would rather just pay for the game once and get access to everything.
 

Hobo Elf

Arcane
Joined
Feb 17, 2009
Messages
13,303
Location
Nekataka dumpster
The root of the problem is blind box purchases as a whole. Ban them outright. Magic the Gather cards, Kinder eggs, Happy Meal toys, all of it no exceptions. If your business model relies on a game of chance for people to get the items they actually want while in reality selling people a bunch of shit that they don't want in the amount of hundreds of dollars, then your business model is flawed and shouldn't exist on mere principle.
As a side note concerning MtG, there's a big reason why everyone who plays the game competitively just outright buys the cards they want. Most even semi serious MtG players don't buy boosters because it is a waste of money. The only situation you'll use a booster in is in a drafting tournament and while those can be fun it's still kind of a sketchy concept that relies on buying a new set of boosters each time.
 

1451

Seeker
In My Safe Space
Joined
Jan 1, 2011
Messages
1,306
It's not fair to compare this to mtg because physical cards have a resale value.
The bits and bytes you purchase are worthless.
 
Joined
Jan 14, 2018
Messages
44,465
Codex Year of the Donut
It's not fair to compare this to mtg because physical cards have a resale value.
The bits and bytes you purchase are worthless.
This is actually an argument in the favor of lootboxes not being regulated like gambling: it fundamentally isn't gambling, it's more similar to flushing money down the toilet.
 

Myobi

Arbiter
Joined
Feb 26, 2016
Messages
856
It's not fair to compare this to mtg because physical cards have a resale value.
The bits and bytes you purchase are worthless.

Yet people spend a fuck ton of cash on accounts with legacy skins and shit, don't they?
 

ferratilis

Magister
Joined
Oct 23, 2019
Messages
1,148
Amazing track record. They reign supreme at the bottom of the user rankings.

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1451

Seeker
In My Safe Space
Joined
Jan 1, 2011
Messages
1,306
It's just the haters, the games are critically acclaimed and profitable! :shitposting:
 
Joined
May 6, 2009
Messages
1,873,815
Location
Glass Fields, Ruins of Old Iran
But my idea will actually work.
People who think regulations that even China is completely incapable of enforcing will somehow magically work have a 100% overlap with people who buy lootboxes, guaranteed.
Epic but I don't think Dale Gribble quotes will ever be accepted by the population as policy. This attitude is why the gun grabbers are slowly winning, by the way. If you refuse to provide a solution, your opponents will propose one and it will be accepted.
 

J1M

Arcane
Joined
May 14, 2008
Messages
13,066
Buy one guaranteed skin and get a complementary lootbox on the house!
I'm no wumao but I bet the CCP at least would have the balls to shut that down hard. It's the kind of argument that only flies in a western court with jewish lawyers and a jewish judge.
That's literally what they do in China.
The law also banned game publishers from directly selling "lottery tickets" such as loot boxes. In June 2017, Blizzard Entertainment announced that, "in line with the new laws and regulations", loot boxes in their game Overwatch would no longer be available for purchase in China. Players would instead buy in-game currency and receive loot boxes as a "gift" for making the purchase.[105]
My understanding is that a handful of European countries like Belgium have strict enough laws that Diablo Immortal didn't launch there.

I also wonder what the outcome would be if all apps had to have a minimum purchase price of $1 or $5.

F2P and loot boxes are great heuristics for easily determining which products to avoid, but I can't help but think I would be happier about the offerings of the industry if they were banned.
 

Myobi

Arbiter
Joined
Feb 26, 2016
Messages
856
https://screenrant.com/lootbox-gambling-microtransactions-illegal-japan-china-belgium-netherlands/

Japan - Japan was the first country to take regulatory action against loot boxes. In 2012, Japan's Consumer Affairs Agency declared complete gacha to be illegal. In their ruling, via Venturebeat, the agency said that complete gacha violated laws against “unjustifiable premiums and misleading representation.” Complete gacha, a monetization mechanic, is basically a loot box variant in which individuals pay to get some random reward. The contrast, and what makes it especially predatory, is that in order to progress in the game a set of rewards must be obtained, meaning players must continue to buy boxes, or whatever the package of rewards is called, until they acquire the proper set. Japan still allows for other types of microtransactions, but this particular model, once very popular in social games, has been outlawed.

China - In 2016, China passed a law that changed how loot boxes could operate when used in games played in the country. According to the law, games with loot boxes have to reveal not just the name of all possible rewards but the probability of receiving said rewards. The intent of the law was to make loot boxes more fair and transparent. Since then, China has added further restrictions and intensified the older ones. Now companies must give an exact drop rate for loot boxes items, giving players an idea of the maxim number of boxes they would need to be buy in order to ensure they get a certain item. Also, China has introduced caps on the number of loot boxes that can be bought in a certain day.

Netherlands - In April of 2018, the Netherlands Gaming Authority conducted a study of 10 unnamed games, and concluded that four of the games were in violation of Netherlands laws concerning gambling. To be exact, the study said (via PC Gamer), "that the content of these loot boxes is determined by chance and that the prizes to be won can be traded outside of the game: the prizes have a market value." In order to sell such items in the Netherlands a license is required but given the current laws, no license can be given to game companies, so "these loot boxes (were) prohibited." The loot boxes used in the other games were deemed legal because they lack "market value." According to the study, those loot boxes whose prizes wouldn't be traded constituted a low risk for gambling addiction, being akin to "small-scale bingo." The marketable loot boxes though, those which are banned in the country, "have integral elements that are similar to slot machines."

Belgium - Shortly after the Netherlands banned certain types of loot boxes, Belgium followed suit with even stricter regulations, declaring loot boxes to be a form of illegal gambling. Looking at various games, such as FIFA 18 and Overwatch, Belgium determined that the randomized risk/reward system innate to loot boxes is tantamount to gambling.

United Kingdom - The House of Lords Gambling Committee, a committee within the U.K.'s lower house of parliament, issued a statement in July 2020 calling for legislative action against the sale of loot boxes in video games. The committee concluded that microtransactions akin to loot boxes constitute gambling and fall under the legislative body's jurisdiction. As of yet, no laws have been made but given the committee's recent recommendation, it is probably only a matter of time.

Soon Germany & Spain, then the rest of Europe should follow too.


 

J1M

Arcane
Joined
May 14, 2008
Messages
13,066
China is a bad example because culturally they see nothing wrong with cheating or paying for an advantage in a game.
 

Myobi

Arbiter
Joined
Feb 26, 2016
Messages
856
China is a bad example because culturally they see nothing wrong with cheating or paying for an advantage in a game.

Well, this sort of aggressive monetization schemes originated in Asia, Korea & China have always been well known for this sort of dumb fuckery, throw in the fact that China’s regulation mostly consists on sharing the possible rewards and its probabilities, it does make this “BUT CHINA HAS REGULATIONS AND STILL HAS LOT OF LOOTBOX GAMES!” sort of silly, doesn’t it?
 

J1M

Arcane
Joined
May 14, 2008
Messages
13,066
China is a bad example because culturally they see nothing wrong with cheating or paying for an advantage in a game.

Well, this sort of aggressive monetization schemes originated in Asia, Korea & China have always been well known for this sort of dumb fuckery, throw in the fact that China’s regulation mostly consists on sharing the possible rewards and its probabilities, it does make this “BUT CHINA HAS REGULATIONS AND STILL HAS LOT OF LOOTBOX GAMES!” sort of silly, doesn’t it?
Yes, that's why I suggested looking at Belgium to see if companies have found a way around the letter of the law there.
 

Pulse

Literate
Joined
May 11, 2022
Messages
42
I thought that it's more deterministic - that if you spend 110,000, you will get a super strong character? So not so much of a gamble?
 

racofer

Thread Incliner
Joined
Apr 5, 2008
Messages
23,595
Location
Your ignore list.
Please update thread title accordingly: Diablo Immoral

Thank you.
 

Brickfrog

Learned
Joined
Aug 28, 2020
Messages
787
Even better than the press conference was blizzard devs telling the press that fans were being ungrateful. Huge red flag.
 

Brickfrog

Learned
Joined
Aug 28, 2020
Messages
787
It's cool that this game is so bad that people think it should be illegal though. Extraordinary innovation tbh.
 

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