Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim Announced for release on 11/11/11

[commie]

Mastermind fails

That's all you needed to write.

 

[Mastermind]

Is the plot even focused on that not-happening-yet invasion?

Actually yeah, it is. It's the whole fucking point of the plot: to kill Dagoth Ur and prevent his invasion. If there was no Dagoth Ur invasion the entire point of the plot would evaporate.

no, it's focused on Nerevar, Azura, Tribunal, Dagoth Ur, and their relationships. Therefore Morrowind story is in fact not about an invasion.
Mastermind fails at logic. How ironic

It's focused on them because they're the fucking actors. Comparing the actors in the plot with the motion of the plot is

And actually, reading through this* it's pretty clear Dagoth Ur is not planning a "traditional" invasion, but his covert invasion is actually well underway. It doesn't look like it because he's not spawning oblivion gates all over the place, but an invasion's an invasion.

* http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Morrowind:Dagoth_Ur%27s_Plans

 

[Mech]

Wow 8 pages, you guys must be excited for this game to come out!

 

[Admiral jimbob]

Ah, was wondering when Mech would stop by.

 

[Forest Dweller]

Is the plot even focused on that not-happening-yet invasion?

Actually yeah, it is. It's the whole fucking point of the plot: to kill Dagoth Ur and prevent his invasion. If there was no Dagoth Ur invasion the entire point of the plot would evaporate.

no, it's focused on Nerevar, Azura, Tribunal, Dagoth Ur, and their relationships. Therefore Morrowind story is in fact not about an invasion.
Mastermind fails at logic. How ironic

It's focused on them because they're the fucking actors. Comparing the actors in the plot with the motion of the plot is

And actually, reading through this* it's pretty clear Dagoth Ur is not planning a "traditional" invasion, but his covert invasion is actually well underway. It doesn't look like it because he's not spawning oblivion gates all over the place, but an invasion's an invasion.

* http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Morrowind:Dagoth_Ur%27s_Plans

So you just contradicted yourself, but you still hold to your original statement? Okay.

But consider this: every story with a tangible villain has said villain doing or planning to do some bad shit that's going to affect people. Usually lots of people. So saying that someone is "planning in invasion" and then equating with a story about an actual invasion is pretty idiotic and pointless. You could use that same logic to connect anything.

 

[Lingwe]

Ah, was wondering when Mech would stop by.

I haven't seen his one liners since around the time Fallout 3 was released!

 

[Sceptic]

But consider this: every story with a tangible villain has said villain doing or planning to do some bad shit that's going to affect people. Usually lots of people. So saying that someone is "planning in invasion" and then equating with a story about an actual invasion is pretty idiotic and pointless.

Exactly. By that "logic" then every single TES is about an invasion. Even Daggerfall; the various factions Bay factions are trying to gain more power over their neighbors -> game is about invasion! Hell Redguard has the invasion of Hammerfell by Tiber Septim as its background -> it's about invasion!

 

[DraQ]

But consider this: every story with a tangible villain has said villain doing or planning to do some bad shit that's going to affect people. Usually lots of people. So saying that someone is "planning in invasion" and then equating with a story about an actual invasion is pretty idiotic and pointless.

Exactly. By that "logic" then every single TES is about an invasion. Even Daggerfall; the various factions Bay factions are trying to gain more power over their neighbors -> game is about invasion! Hell Redguard has the invasion of Hammerfell by Tiber Septim as its background -> it's about invasion!

If TES romantic comedy MW prequel revolving around PC siring then abandoning the future Nerevarine for lulzy and inane reasons should ever come out, it too will be about the invasion according to Messedmind's logic.

 

[Mastermind]

So you just contradicted yourself, but you still hold to your original statement? Okay.

Only in the sense that i didn't fully realize how wrong you dipshits actually were.

But consider this: every story with a tangible villain has said villain doing or planning to do some bad shit that's going to affect people. Usually lots of people.

Indeed. And in both Oblivion and Morrowind's case, that something is an invasion of tamriel. The only difference is that Dagoth Ur is more of a cloak and dagger kind of guy with considerably less power than a daedra prince who doesn't need to scheme much, already possesses a massive immortal army and the means by which to teleport them in all over tamriel.

So saying that someone is "planning in invasion" and then equating with a story about an actual invasion is pretty idiotic and pointless. You could use that same logic to connect anything.

Dagoth Ur wasn't just planning an invasion, he already started setting his plan into motion. The only difference (which is irrelevant to my original point) is that Mehrunes' invasion is overt while Dagoth Ur's is of a more covert tone. There's sleepers all over Morrowind from the start of the game. Sometimes they attack you depending on where you meet them. Other times they just start talking to you and say weird shit. But they're there and the first part of Dagoth Ur's plan (deny the heart to the Tribunal to weaken them) is already complete.

 

[Ruprekt]

I thought Dagoth Ur was more like the Tea Party? It's a patriotic movement which inspires individual dunmer to return to the core values of their nation.

It's definitely not an "invasion" e.g. something from outside.

 

[Sceptic]

The only difference (which is irrelevant to my original point) is that Mehrunes' invasion is overt while Dagoth Ur's is of a more covert tone.

No, the only difference is that Oblivion starts with the invasion happening and ends with the banishment of the invader. That's why it's about, you know, an invasion. Morrowind deals with thwarting the invasion while it's still being prepared - by the end it hasn't happened yet.

There's sleepers all over Morrowind from the start of the game.

There were also Soviet spies in the USA during the Cold War. OH NO THE USA WAS INVADED BY THOSE DAMN COMMIES!
(sorry commie)

the first part of Dagoth Ur's plan (deny the heart to the Tribunal to weaken them) is already complete.

Amazing, so Dagoth Ur invaded the world by... err... doing nothing and sitting on his ass? The Heart had always been in those Dwemer ruins.

TES romantic comedy MW prequel

It's definitely not an "invasion" e.g. something from outside.

Good point, but his plan was to eventually transform everyone in Tamriel into Ascended (or kill them while trying). That was the purpose of building Akulakhan IIRC. Of course this is so much in the far future that he never really gets even close to that step.

 

[Luzur]

Mastermind is prob Todd trolling us.

 

[Erzherzog]

In Morrowind Dagoth Ur has planted agents all over Vvardenfell, conquered many ancient outposts, has bases planted near all the major cities that are covertly attacking the local populaces, and some people want to argue that Vvardenfell is not being invaded?

Just because they're not identical does not mean that there is not an invasion plotline is present. Dagoth Ur is not planning to invade, he's already invading and planning the more advanced stages of his invasion. I mean hell, he already controls everything inside the Ghostgate and much that is outside of it.

 

[DraQ]

TES romantic comedy MW prequel

Reaction within norm. *takes notes*

In Morrowind Dagoth Ur has planted agents all over Vvardenfell, conquered many ancient outposts, has bases planted near all the major cities that are covertly attacking the local populaces, and some people want to argue that Vvardenfell is not being invaded?

Just because they're not identical does not mean that there is not an invasion plotline is present. Dagoth Ur is not planning to invade, he's already invading and planning the more advanced stages of his invasion. I mean hell, he already controls everything inside the Ghostgate and much that is outside of it.

Well, not really. Dagoth Ur does control much of what is within the Ghostfence, which has been erected specifically as a means of Containing Dagoth Ur. He also has several hidden bases around Vvardenfell and can leak some forces through Kogoruhn. THAT'S IT.

Other than that he only has destabilizing influence via telepathy and intelligence/smuggling networks. He is still not strong enough to start PWNing anyone openly outside of his reinforced territories and it will clearly take him quite some time.

In Oblivious, there are gates opening everywhere and daedra are spilling out, only to walk around them in boring, slightly confused gait because can't rob the player of the opportunity to collect some flowers for the MG.

Keyword - urgency.

This lack of urgency also helps MW focus on background lore, including why, how and WTF are you being a Nerevarine, what is actually happening and who might be pulling the strings.

In OB it's just FOR TEH EMPIREEE!!! FOR TEH SEPTIM BLOODLINEEE!!!!1

"But Sire, direct Septim bloodline was terminated just after-"

*wipes sword blade*
*puts on The Amulet of Kings*

FOR TEH SEPTIM BLOODLINEEE!!!!1
:kingfromoglaf:

 

[attackfighter]

An invasion is a military offensive consisting of all, or large parts of the armed forces of one geopolitical entity aggressively entering territory controlled by another such entity, generally with the objective of either conquering, liberating or re-establishing control or authority over a ...

 

[Erzherzog]

TES romantic comedy MW prequel

Reaction within norm. *takes notes*

In Morrowind Dagoth Ur has planted agents all over Vvardenfell, conquered many ancient outposts, has bases planted near all the major cities that are covertly attacking the local populaces, and some people want to argue that Vvardenfell is not being invaded?

Just because they're not identical does not mean that there is not an invasion plotline is present. Dagoth Ur is not planning to invade, he's already invading and planning the more advanced stages of his invasion. I mean hell, he already controls everything inside the Ghostgate and much that is outside of it.

Well, not really. Dagoth Ur does control much of what is within the Ghostfence, which has been erected specifically as a means of Containing Dagoth Ur. He also has several hidden bases around Vvardenfell and can leak some forces through Kogoruhn. THAT'S IT.

Other than that he only has destabilizing influence via telepathy and intelligence/smuggling networks. He is still not strong enough to start PWNing anyone openly outside of his reinforced territories and it will clearly take him quite some time.

In Oblivious, there are gates opening everywhere and daedra are spilling out, only to walk around them in boring, slightly confused gait because can't rob the player of the opportunity to collect some flowers for the MG.

Keyword - urgency.

This lack of urgency also helps MW focus on background lore, including why, how and WTF are you being a Nerevarine, what is actually happening and who might be pulling the strings.

In OB it's just FOR TEH EMPIREEE!!! FOR TEH SEPTIM BLOODLINEEE!!!!1

"But Sire, direct Septim bloodline was terminated just after-"

*wipes sword blade*
*puts on The Amulet of Kings*

FOR TEH SEPTIM BLOODLINEEE!!!!1
:kingfromoglaf:

Which brings us back to, it's not that there's a difference in concept, but rather execution that seperates Morrowind and Oblivion.

 

[attackfighter]

not really, the concept of Dagoth Ur biding his time and slowly infiltrating Morrowind over the course of thousands of years is quite different than the concept of Demons invading Tamriel overnight.

not to mention your "definition" of an invasion is loco

 

[Erzherzog]

All you've done is post a wikipedia definition of a term and if you can't see how Dagoth Ur's actions fit within that definition then you really don't have any place in this conversation.

And yes, what Dagoth Ur did and what Mehrunes Dagon did are different in some ways, pretty sure that's already been pointed out by a few people.

 

[Linden]

To lighten up the mood a little (don't know if this has been posted here before):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FgoIUu1evHA

It's an 8-bit version of the Morrowind theme. Somehow it ends up sounding delightfully demented and tragically noble at the same time.

 

[Ermm]

Godfuck Morrowind was awful in Quests. Thieves guild was just agonizing. For example, every quest in that guild, except for last two quests, was to steal some jewel etc. from a shop like 10 times. Maybe there was something inbetween, but omygod, I quit after that.
And combat was awful.

I prefer Oblivion. Some may consider it blasphemous, but no way it was so much copypaste in quests.

I like openendiness in Morrowind, but I hate that everything there was just so barren and lifeless, except for that Desert region which I liked.

 

[Sceptic]

herpderp

 

[attackfighter]

All you've done is post a wikipedia definition of a term and if you can't see how Dagoth Ur's actions fit within that definition then you really don't have any place in this conversation.

And yes, what Dagoth Ur did and what Mehrunes Dagon did are different in some ways, pretty sure that's already been pointed out by a few people.

ok mr. smarty pants, if you truely are as brilliant as you say you are then you will have no problem explaining how wikipedia's definition of an invasion doesn't exclude your little drug addled recollection of dagoth ur's actions

 

[DraQ]

I like openendiness in Morrowind, but I hate that everything there was just so barren and lifeless

Now that I think of it I regret not having trolled the 'dex back when
I joined by posting how I liked C&C in Fallout but hated that everything there was just so barren and lifeless.

What a shame.

 

[HiddenX]

The last 3 good games from Bethesda were


The Elder Scrolls II : Daggerfall
An Elder Scrolls Legend: Battlespire
The Elder Scrolls Adventures: Redguard

Oblivion is only good for playin' Nehrim.

 

[Luzur]

Oblivion is only good for playin' Nehrim.

oh yeah, i had forgotten about that, now that i am done with NV i will proceed to reinstall Oblivion (AARRGGG) and try out Nehrim.