ELEX ELEX II - Jax is back

[Jinn]

Yeah, I don't know, cvv. ELEX II does a number of things worse than ELEX, as HoboForEternity illustrates in his post. And there's even more. They couldn't even stick to the formula well. The factions sucked and felt shallow, the game is ugly as sin, especially compared to some of the beautiful scenery in the first game, exploration feels much less rewarding as a whole, character and equipment progression is much more flat and ineffectual, and even the writing isn't as good. ELEX II is pretty much objectively worse than ELEX in most ways, and PB doesn't seem to care in the least. I have no hope for ELEX III. Someone else has to take up the mantle if we're going to see any more good games of this type in the future.

And yes, Chronicles of Myrtana is much better than ELEX, not to mention ELEX II. Blows my mind people like Roxor can hate on it despite it clearly being superior in almost every way. It's more of a PB game than PB has made in like 15 years.

 

[HoboForEternity]

PB Have always weird creative process where they throw away everything except the very core concept then adding on something popular or something that impressed them from other media that makes it feels like they take a 1 forward step, but 2 steps backwards.

But honestly it's more like this:

Game 1 has 4 design pillars. 2 of them good, 2 of them bad.

Instead of reiterating and reflecting on the pillars that doesn't work they threw it all out and shove whole new permutations.

So game 2 either can have 4 pillars, with 2 of them good, 2 of them bad or 3 bad one good, etc, etc.

What i think they still retain over the years is the very core of gothic open world formula covered with different organs and meats that are sourced from whatever ideas they have like frankenstein's monster.

Tho i will fight that their world and level design are generally still at the very least above average (not a high bar, but still) even risen 2's islands are still well designed. Risen 3 not as much mainly due to thay huge invisible wall on the island with volcano that feels so jarring.

Everything else, the plot, combat, story, progression all feel like they undergone this awkward creative process.

Lastly, why i think archolos works so much is because the iteration process. Maybe the act of self analyzing your work is harder than analyzing and reiterating other's work. Maybe bjorn are way over their own heads and does not know their strength, or obsessed with "innovation" or changes, but i think archolos works because it essentially it took gothic formula and analyze what can be improved, what to shave off and add.

Granted, some of the criticism toward archolos is valid, like the numbers of unkillable NPCs(that to PB's credit, they kept essential NPCs quite minimal in elex)

 

[thesecret1]

Lastly, why i think archolos works so much is because the iteration process. Maybe the act of self analyzing your work is harder than analyzing and reiterating other's work. Maybe bjorn are way over their own heads and does not know their strength, or obsessed with "innovation" or changes, but i think archolos works because it essentially it took gothic formula and analyze what can be improved, what to shave off and add.

They made another Gothic 2, brought many of the base game's vanilla mechanics to their logical conclusion (like what they did with cooking, for example) and gave it loads of attention to detail. That was it. It's really no rocket science.

 

[MadMaxHellfire]

so much changed, i swear on launch you people were saying this was the best thing ever.

 

[thesheeep]

so much changed, i swear on launch you people were saying this was the best thing ever.

We were mostly saying one thing:

ELEX!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

... but that doesn't really do much to numb the pain of the game just being straight worse than its first installment.

 

[harhar!]

The long-awaited ELEX II review by The Nocturnal Rambler is out

 

[Cohesion]

Who is he and who was waiting for his review?
Never asked for this. Especially video. Text review or GTFO.

EDIT: 2+ hour video review. Fuck this zoomer insanity. Where is proper written journalism? I'd waste 2 hours watching this shit if I was paid. You're doing it for free and boosting his channel and making him money. SMH.

 

[Nikanuur]

They actually made all the assets from the ground up iirc. That's a mistake imo. The problem isnt the map design (believe or or not they are still pretty good, but lacking the variety elex 1 had)

However the art direction is a step down from elex. Everything is higher fidelity and detail, but (including the nightmare faces) they look like a downgrade from elex

The main problem is the technical issues it released it, more shallow faction and interaction. They sell it as having more choices and going independent like new vegas, but the factions are shallower than elex 1.

The story direction is completely fucked up too. They never had high brow story but the beats of elex 2 is awkward.

The combat is actually shallower than elex 1. It's my main beef with the game. In elex, jank as it is, the combo timer system is interesting, as it build up, allow you to perform powerful finishers, etc. Elex 2 use the tap for light attack, hold for heavy attack and stopped there. They took the most interesting thing about elex 1's combat instead of improving it.

Combat is now more along the lines of the streamlined light hit, heavy hit, dodge, block, etc.
We can use different jet pack abilities to add more variety.
Everything is way more responsive than in any other PB game prior to Elex 2.
One can dance around the enemies successfully with fast weapons, hit and run, depend on ranged kitting and jet-packing around, bait enemies into momentum, and follow with a heavy hit. In short, there's a great variety of combat approaches in general.

Verdict: A critique focused on how one thing taken away (the combos, which more often than not ended in thin air due to the clumsy-funny direction lock) made the combat shallower.

 

[Alienman]

Who is he and who was waiting for his review?
Never asked for this. Especially video. Text review or GTFO.

EDIT: 2+ hour video review. Fuck this zoomer insanity. Where is proper written journalism? I'd waste 2 hours watching this shit if I was paid. You're doing it for free and boosting his channel and making him money. SMH.

It's a good video though. Glad I never wasted my time on it, after really liking Elex. The retcons are crazy by themselves.

 

[PorkyThePaladin]

Yeah, I don't know what Piranha Bytes issue is. None of the theories I have heard so far sound completely correct.

They can't make two good games in a row: Gothic 1 and 2, and NotR.

All the talent left after G1/G2: Risen is really good, and so is ELEX.

It's really sad, maybe some german speaking codexer could go and yell at them at their forums. Such a waste of talent, because whenever they do manage to put it all together, there is no one else who makes open world games like that.

 

[Serious_Business]

The Pirana Bytes cycle is some low tempo shit. You just kind of limp around in these games with your dick in your hand, pick up some flowers in some sordid corners and whatnot, then join a group of low-energy fucks who all speak in a monotone and have the one-thousand yard stare. Then you get tossed in some dark hole and have to fight your way out to the final boss in a long sequence that will permanently damage your cognitive faculties : you get out and get smacked on the head, loose all your experience, become level one again, and here you go again bucko, just fucking go at it. Gobble that shit right up. It never ends. It's a rough ride, but I hear that in the new games you have romance options. You can just expand yourself in there I bet, I mean it's fucking exhausting to have sex when you're so tired. With maximum cold are you even capable of having sex? It's a serious question. Well, just rub something somewhere I guess

 

[NotSweeper]

The Pirana Bytes cycle is some low tempo shit. You just kind of limp around in these games with your dick in your hand, pick up some flowers in some sordid corners and whatnot, then join a group of low-energy fucks who all speak in a monotone and have the one-thousand yard stare. Then you get tossed in some dark hole and have to fight your way out to the final boss in a long sequence that will permanently damage your cognitive faculties : you get out and get smacked on the head, loose all your experience, become level one again, and here you go again bucko, just fucking go at it. Gobble that shit right up. It never ends. It's a rough ride, but I hear that in the new games you have romance options. You can just expand yourself in there I bet, I mean it's fucking exhausting to have sex when you're so tired. With maximum cold are you even capable of having sex? It's a serious question. Well, just rub something somewhere I guess

When you put it like that, the game really does seem like a simulation of what it's like being German.

 

[Dedicated_Dark]

So, wtf! Elex 2 has fucking level scaling now!! And not even threshold leveling like Skyrim, it's fucking Oblivion levels of garbage! Wtf happened.
Every fucking thing is fucking

 

[Ravielsk]

So, wtf! Elex 2 has fucking level scaling now!! And not even threshold leveling like Skyrim, it's fucking Oblivion levels of garbage! Wtf happened.
Every fucking thing is fucking

There is a mod to disable it but it still speaks volumes about that they even included it in the first place. The lack of level scaling and solid progression was always a hallmark of PB, them essentially nuking both from their latest game only further proves why THQ would want to shut them down.

 

[Dodo1610]

PB's main problem was that they did not understand their target demographic. They actually thought they were still competing with other mainstream popular Open-world RPGs from Ubisoft, Sony and Beth and had been making games for the casual audience. PB wanted to make games for people who would never buy them and the people who wanted games in the old Piranha Bytes style were alienated by their design decisions. Just look at Elex 2 atrocious father-son story somehow Björn thought their games needed to become a Nu God Of War knockoff.
There was also zero chance that this would change with Elex 3 Björn said in his video after ELex 2 release that he still believed Elex 2 was one of their best games and that they will continue this path.

It's really sad, maybe some german speaking codexer could go and yell at them at their forums. Such a waste of talent, because whenever they do manage to put it all together, there is no one else who makes open world games like that.

We have been doing that since they announced Risen 2, without any noticeable effect, I mean even their CEO was pretty active there for years.

 

[Nikanuur]

PB's main problem was that they did not understand their target demographic. They actually thought they were still competing with other mainstream popular Open-world RPGs from Ubisoft, Sony and Beth and had been making games for the casual audience. PB wanted to make games for people who would never buy them and the people who wanted games in the old Piranha Bytes style were alienated by their design decisions. Just look at Elex 2 atrocious father-son story somehow Björn thought their games needed to become a Nu God Of War knockoff.
There was also zero chance that this would change with Elex 3 Björn said in his video after ELex 2 release that he still believed Elex 2 was one of their best games and that they will continue this path.

We have been doing that since they announced Risen 2, without any noticeable effect, I mean even their CEO was pretty active there for years.

Maybe you are right and maybe you are using a hyperbole in a futile attempt to give something at least a little bit of meaning. Who knows, right?

At any rate, not many movies or games use the trope of a 12-year-old son sacrificing on his own free will for the sake of the whole world and the father trying to come to terms with it. Come to think of it, I actually haven't seen it anywhere prior to this game.

 

[Tuco Benedicto Pacifico]

So, wtf! Elex 2 has fucking level scaling now!! And not even threshold leveling like Skyrim, it's fucking Oblivion levels of garbage! Wtf happened.
Every fucking thing is fucking

"You know that one single thing we used to handle better than almost anyone else, "progression" in a RPG? Why not throw it in the garbage bin and start doing the worst possible alternative, instead?" - Modern Piranha Bytes, probably

 

[otsego]

I finished ELEX and enjoyed it and put 60hrs into it, even though near the end it was just clapping easier tasks just to close the story off so I could finish the main.

The start to ELEX 2 was reallllyyy rough and I found I spent more time looting random items from random locations for hours instead of advancing the plot.

Now that I've stopped doing that and have opened up each faction I feel the game is a lot better than it was at the start (typical for PB games) but something feels stripped out... I realize a lot of people on the Codex didn't really like ELEX but I thought it had a bit of soul similar to Gothic 1 and 2, and ELEX 2 feels like the soul is stripped out in some attempt to appeal to more people... which only served to appeal to nobody.

I'm enjoying it for what it is, and I'm sure I'll dump 60 hours to finish it, but it is clear that they learned nothing and lost their way with this one.

PS. What the FUCK is this inventory?

 

[Zlaja]

I realize a lot of people on the Codex didn't really like ELEX

Those infidels are in the minority. Plenty of us Elex bros in here. Anyway, you're right that the sequel feels somewhat uninspired. It's still a fairly competent action-rpg, but the game feels both too samey and worse in numerous ways. I will list below what dissapointed me during my playthrough:

- At first it seems factions are deeper thank to the opportunity to backstab them, but PB didn't do much with this and the end result was the opposite.

- NPCs are worse both graphically and personality wise. Didn't care for a single one.

- The way they included scaling and enemy respawns doesn't belong in a PB game. Stick to the fucking formula for this.

- Main characters infection and his endless whining about it. How more people haven't mentioned this is puzzling, 'cause it's infuriating.

- Most beasts and all human enemies are too slow with their melee attacks, which makes fighting single opponents way too easy.

- Putting together a resistance camp, independent of your faction choice, was a boring rehash of what you did in the first game.

- All companion quests were fucking terrible and repetitive.

There's some other minor stuff, but those are my main gripes with it.

 

[Nikanuur]

Anyone who doesn't like Elex 2 has bad judgement.
I have it from the highest authority of such matters–me. Therefore I am right.
There, you can rest in pieces.
Muhahaha HEHEHA HA HA EHEHEH!

 

[Cryomancer]

Yep. Basically people who don't like Elex 2 either wanted a Gothic 1/2 tier great game or don't like the setting. The game is great.

 

[Konjad]

"Great" is an overstatement, but it's decent.