Felipepepe on the history of the term "CRPG"

[Vlajdermen]

Somebody quote me so the retard can see

I never ignored you, is fun to see you trying sooo hard to get attention.

Typical dialectic person vs rhetoric person dialogue. Luj is here to prove Felipe's point wrong. Felipe is here to make Luj seem uncool. They have no common ground to converse.

 

[Vic]

Using Dragon Age 2 to represent western RPGs....

 

[Zamn]

I thought we already solved this issue, CRPGs are all the game I enjoy because I only play prestigious, deep, philisophical games, pretty simple guys

 

[Darth Canoli]

The fact that most plebes (on the Codex as well) spend a lot of time debating definitions doesn’t make the point interesting

I don't expect anyone in the Codex to find it interesting, the old farts here lived through most of it. I wrote it and posted on the CRPG Book blog because so many people on reddit, twitter and discord know nothing about all this.

And that's exactly where you belong...

 

[octavius]

By the way, it is "CRPG", not "cRPG".

Anyone who uses the latter is an idiot.

OK, cRISPY.

 

[mondblut]

Also classic is not a vague term. You are just trying to justify your poor taste and deconstruct the norms.

Using classic to describe games like Baldur's Gate, Daggerfall, Fallout, Ultima 7, Wizardry makes it not particularly useful.

"Classy", on the other hand...

 

[Litmanen]

By the way, it is "CRPG", not "cRPG".

Anyone who uses the latter is an idiot.

OK, cRISPY.

He is a ComputerRoleplayIranianSPY

 

[Louis_Cypher]

CRPGs - computer games based on pen & paper RPGs

JRPGs - the same but with anime aesthetics

Just leave it as that, I reckon.

 

[Harthwain]

At some point I arrived at the conclusion that cRPG is too broad a term to be useful. Terms like "blobber" or "jRPG" give a much clearer picture of what you can expect. "PnP RPG" and "aRPG" also give you a better idea of the game's playstyle.

 

[Silverfish]

But is this really the kind of dialogue you want to have with people? Posting visual snark at one another until one gets tired of it?

If I didn't want that, I wouldn't have signed up to a message board.

 

[The Brazilian Slaughter]

Does the term JRPG even make sense, when you consider the fact JRPGs are strongly inspired by Wizardry and Ultima? That's like calling Falloutlikes East RPGs because they're often made in Eastern Europe.

Another term oddity: Falloutlikes. An eastern european term for RPGs like/inspired by the original Black Isle Fallouts. Ex: Metalheart: Replicants Rampage, The Fall, etc. It's pretty much an eastern european sub-genre, and most of them were seemingly developed in the 2000s, when games like the OG Fallouts fell in disfavour in the West, yet the franchise continued being HUGE in Eastern Europe.
(this makes me wonder: Are games like Underrail and Age of Decadence modern-day Falloutlikes? One could argue AoD is not, because it was made in Canada, but AFAIK VD is an eastern euro and development started in the 2000s)

Crowdfunded indies like ATOM RPG and Encased are the inheritors of the shovelware Fallout-likes of the 2000s.

Oh, definitively.

 

[Ol' Willy]

The more fitting term instead of "jrpg" would be "pedo-rpg"

 

[Vlajdermen]

Uhh it's not child porn, willy, it's 5000 year old dragon fanservice.

 

[Harthwain]

Does the term JRPG even make sense, when you consider the fact JRPGs are strongly inspired by Wizardry and Ultima?

jRPG has a fixed storyline and hero. And by that I mean completely locked down. You could argue that some non-jRPGs also have a relatively same storyline and a set hero, but even if the hero is predetermined, the player has some freedom of choice in his actions and behaviour (and class), which is completely lacking in jRPGs.

 

[Monk]

Given what he wrote, it started as a wargame with individuals like commanders role-played, and then competitors referred to what they did as fantasy role-playing in order not to get sued. Somewhere someone probably referred to it as a fantasy role-playing game, and then a role-playing game when more games did not involve fantasy. After that came RPGs as computer games.

So, given that and the Blackmoor documentary, it actually started as tabletop wargaming where they tried to simulate certain things about commanders, etc., and then that eventually took over and the wargaming element was dropped.

That means there are three meanings:

- role-playing individuals, where you develop character attributes and/or inventory, using pen and paper and/or miniatures and props;

- the same but you use computers; and

- the same, but as part of wargaming: for example, as you win more, you get to receive more advanced armaments for your army.

 

[Falksi]

So, if I'm getting this straight, what the article is saying...is that Zelda is an RPG?

 

[mondblut]

Does the term JRPG even make sense, when you consider the fact JRPGs are strongly inspired by Wizardry and Ultima?

If they are, they are doing their best to conceal it.

That's like calling Falloutlikes East RPGs because they're often made in Eastern Europe.
[

The word you're looking for is "eurojank"

 

[Butter]

JRPGs were originally inspired by Wizardry and Ultima. Now they're just inspired by other JRPGs. The entire industry is as hopelessly self-referential and creatively bankrupt as the anime industry. Calling those games RPGs at this point is just a tradition.

 

[Vlajdermen]

Yep. There is nothing wrong with the gameplay formula in and of itself. It can make for good casual RPGs. The problem is they're made by japs who are allergic to fun. They don't want to indulge their imagination, they treat everything like it's a middle school exam, they want to get a smiley on their report card for regurgitating all the correct things. The proof of that are games like expedition 33, that are made in the same style and reference the same games, but they can be counted on having something worth paying attention to. A mime that hits you with a pretend-hammer, for example. Hell even Undertale, the symbol of milennial weeaboo soy, still has things like Photoshop Flowey or Papyrus' funny battle theme, just by the virtue that the creator isn't a jap.

 

[mondblut]

So, if I'm getting this straight, what the article is saying...is that Zelda is an RPG?

This is what the article is saying:

 

[mondblut]

JRPGs were originally inspired by Wizardry and Ultima. Now they're just inspired by other JRPGs. The entire industry is as hopelessly self-referential and creatively bankrupt as the anime industry. Calling those games RPGs at this point is just a tradition.

You are not wrong, except that the "now" part has been going on for about 35 years now.

 

[aweigh]

always remember that infinitron considers feelapedo an incredibly important asset to the codex and a valued contributor, however ggs and kalin are perma-banned for making fun of atlet's brother.

 

[Vlajdermen]

The two jarpig franchises I've been obsessed with in the past are dark souls and pokemon (don't judge me, I'm autistic). Both have observably fallen victim to the teacher's pet disease. Demons' Souls was a mildly inventive dark fantasy action game with ideas that sometimes worked and sometimes didn't. As the series went on, it started coming out with all these tropes like the poison swamp level, the icy castle level, the library level, the knight duel boss, the dragon boss, yadda yadda. Bloodborne still attempted to do something worth remembering, it still had a bit of personality. But look at elden ring. So aggressively generic for anyone who has played the series before. Nothing on the same level of memorability as the Old Hero, or the Fool's Idol. No horror levels like the Prison of Hope. It's all generic fantasy with self-important ten-word boss names. ''Miquella, the promised consort of the forgotten overlord Gixtunque''. Oh and it expects you to care about the lore, another bible's worth of charmless AI-generated fantasy slop.

Pokemon started as this cool kids' series where you tamed wildlife and that would be your superpower, kids would speak the language of battling with animals. It's how they'd relate to each other. Ash to Paul, Paul to Barry, Ash to Gary, ash to Conway. It'd simulate a friend group with a common hobby, that just happened to involve shit every kid loves - action and animals. As the series went on it started introducing elements like going super sayan, moral quandaries, shippings and waifus, and fucking going to school. Are you insane? We kids would play pookeymanz to forget about going to school. Then you'd head down underground to stop an insurrection by an ancient robot who's a dark reflection of you because you're the chosen one and not just a kid with a dog. For fuck's sake. Now it's completely indistinguishable from every other japanese thing™ on the market. It's pokemon's loss of identity that first clued me in to the fact that japan sucks. Nier automata and persona 5 would later make that clear as day.

 

[Vlajdermen]

So, if I'm getting this straight, what the article is saying...is that Zelda is an RPG?

This is what the article is saying:

Yeah. Don't forget that after legitimizing japshit, the next step is delegitimizing everything else. If you think I'm bullshitting you, just look at what aweigh or reinhardt or rean or their ilk are posting about every day.

Weebs hate white people. That's been the force animating their religion (it's not a subculture. It's a religion.) since the very beignning. Anyone who says otherwise is lying.

 

[Just Locus]

Honestly, the article felt more like a history lesson than an attempt to argue anything.

And I disagree with the article's thesis in the first place, definitions don't "change" because enough idiots decided that using the wrong terminology was now the right thing to do. You and I both know what an RPG is, so we should be cringing when a normie walks up to us and calls Fallout 4 an RPG. In the same way that CRPGs don't stop being "Computer RPGs" because some were ported to consoles.

At best, you danced around the subject; at worst, you added nothing of value.