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mondblut

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Dice throws that you are clinging to were there out of necessity not because they are fundamental to rpgs. When gaming moved on from tabletop, we now have possibility to replace arcane dice throws with much less random and actual deliberate skillfull mechanics for encounters. Games like baldurs gate made dice throws only partially relevant in outcome of battle which was a stepping stone to engines and game mechanics evolving out of the random throws in its entirety.

To those not understanding why I am mentioning dice throws. It is because the rpgs through spreadsheets is based on the exact same arcaic system limited by pen and paper. It wasn't done because it was THE WAY to do it. It was done out of necessity of you not actually being a knight and the only available tools being pen and paper.

Behold the modern idiot gamer, gentlemen.
 

SkiNNyBane

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Grab the Codex by the pussy
I can't believe some codexers prefer braindead mechanics like level checks to system that allow you to use cognition and skill to win encounters. You really think that being able to finish the game on low level is a bad thing like in souls? It is a testament of a system being well designed to actually provide meaningful combat. Meanwhile we have recent games like divinity original sin 2 which cannot make it any more obvious that level checks are dogshit. Oh you want to go here? Too bad the game is too hard until your one level higher for completely arbitrary reason. So a system that actually give you a freedrom to go wherever you want is less rpg then a system that basically creates illusion of choice through level checks? Gotcha makes 100% sense would consult codex again.
 

Mikeal

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Man this Srouls fags are annoying.
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SkiNNyBane

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Grab the Codex by the pussy
Yea stick to spamming "retarded" and memes like other anti souls popamolers Mikeal that is defiantly not annoying at all. Lack self awareness much?
 

Mikeal

Arcane
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Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth
Primo memes are funny and Shitouls fags are annoying.
Secundo I am not popamoler and Srouls are popamole as hell.

Really it's get old very fast reading Soul fans jerking to things that are common in video games because it was made in Japan, has cool aesthetics and gamez journalists are jerking to it.
 

SkiNNyBane

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Grab the Codex by the pussy
Primo memes are funny and Shitouls fags are annoying.
Secundo I am not popamoler and Srouls are popamole as hell.

Really it's get old very fast reading Soul fans jerking to things that are common in video games because it was made in Japan, has cool aesthetics and gamez journalists are jerking to it.

God I hate popamolers like you who pretends its the "japanese" or "button mashing" some other irrelevant quality that is being praised here and not just the fact that I just want rpgs with depth of story like planescape and depth of combat like dark souls. I don't give a shit who makes it. I also think that PUBG is popamole and Quake combat is much better in fps. Neither of them is Japanse.

The one positive thing from this thread so far is that I can add all you popamolers who don't even bother to legitimize your viewpoints through argument without hyperbole memes or spamming retarded to my ignore list.
 

Mikeal

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Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth
God I hate popamolers like you who pretends its the "japanese" or "button mashing" some other irrelevant quality that is being praised here and not just the fact that I just want rpgs with depth of story like planescape and depth of combat like dark souls. I don't give a shit who makes it. I also think that PUBG is popamole and Quake combat is much better in fps. Neither of them is Japanse.

The one positive thing from this thread so far is that I can add all you popamolers who don't even bother to legitimize your viewpoints through argument without hyperbole memes or spamming retarded to my ignore list.

Oh sure, gone on, just don't choke on Miyazaki's dick.
 

Machocruz

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Hyperborea
Here's a hint to the concept of role-playing in the context of Role Playing Games: if the identity of the character you are playing is that they are physically adept, this should remain so even if the player has the dexterity of a paraplegic, can't press buttons in time, etc. Likewise, let's say a character is established as being profoundly physically inept, no amount of player ability in action games, no amount of dexterity with controller or keyboard should make the character physically adept. So all this talk of skillful mechanics, being able to do low level runs, roll timing etc has nothing to do with the genre and I'd say is even antithetical to it from a purist perspective. Even another Action-RPG, Diablo 2, got some of this right, like the character auto-blocking depending on THEIR dexterity, not the player's. Now, since video games are unable to fully simulate a true RPG experience, we allow for these things to exist on a scale, so one can correctly say like Diablo is a kind of RPG, and Dark Souls is some kind of RPGish thing, but they are far less RPG than Fallout 1. This is why we have subcategories, duh.

About low level runs in RPGs: In PnP games -which without the genre wouldn't exist in computerized form for wrong headed developers to bastardize - levels were meant to represent your character's ability/job experience, within the power scale of the game world. So a level 1 being is not supposed to have much of, if any chance in a head to head encounter with a level 10 being, especially with no party to support them, as is the case in many of today's video games. If you can circumvent this through "player skill", then you are then not role-playing a character at the bottom of the power scale and then levels become a difficulty slider instead of fulfilling their intended purpose as dictated by the foundational works of the genre.

Sorry, you cannot take tabletop out of the equation. If a video game is in defiance of core tabletop values, the fucking foundational values of the entire genre that video game developers are pillag-...sorry I mean emulating, then it is less and less of RPG. I'd go so far as to say video game developers don't have the creative authority to take something they're merely borrowing and change it to suit their whims and have it still be legitimately regarded as that thing.
 
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SkiNNyBane

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Grab the Codex by the pussy
Machocruz I understand all your points as constituting a TYPE of rpg. No argument there. There should definately be a subgenre name for what your describing. But to limit the entire parent genre of RPG to something this restrictive is absurd. This serves no possible semantic advantage except dogmatism. If I go to a website and search for RPGs and diablo 2, path of exile, dark souls, and WOW doesn't show up, there is something serriously wrong with categories.

You think fps games don't have a similar problem? We have games like overwatch in the same category as cs and quake. They are all radically different games but no one in right mind would argue that they all are FPS games. Sure we call quake arena fps, overwath a hero shooter, and cs a tactical shooter. But they are all FPS and as gaming develops even more type of FPS will emerge.

This is simply how language works.
 

BlackAdderBG

Arcane
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Little Vienna
Codex 2013 Codex 2014 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Grab the Codex by the pussy Codex USB, 2014 Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker
DS is in completely different genre than RPG, it's an action game. It has more in common with TP shooters than action-RPGs like Diablo and PoE.
 

Jason Liang

Arcane
Joined
Oct 26, 2014
Messages
8,336
Location
Crait
I love, Codex hate:
GTA V
Assassin's Creed Origins
Temple of Elemental Evil
Sid Meier's Pirates!
Invisible Inc
Ultima V

I hate, Codex loves:
Fallout
Fallout 2
Arcanum
Wiz 8
Baldur's Gate 1
Icewind Dale
Underrail

How you guys can love shitty Arcanum but hate Assassin's Creed Origins and love Icewind Dale but hate ToEE is beyond me.
 

deama

Prophet
Joined
May 13, 2013
Messages
4,352
Location
UK
I love, Codex hate:
GTA V
Assassin's Creed Origins
Temple of Elemental Evil
Sid Meier's Pirates!
Invisible Inc
Ultima V

I hate, Codex loves:
Fallout
Fallout 2
Arcanum
Wiz 8
Baldur's Gate 1
Icewind Dale
Underrail

How you guys can love shitty Arcanum but hate Assassin's Creed Origins and love Icewind Dale but hate ToEE is beyond me.
What? codex hate ToEE? Wasn't it on the 70s list and hasn't it been spoken highly of? And I heard good things on Ultima V from here too!
 

Jason Liang

Arcane
Joined
Oct 26, 2014
Messages
8,336
Location
Crait

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