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Games without which everything would be different

Discussion in 'General Gaming' started by luj1, Jun 30, 2020.

  1. luj1 You're all shills

    luj1
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    Just something I had on my mind recently. I know some of you have strong opinions about Darklands




    Goldeneye - signaled the transition to realistic shooters, introduced location based damage. Counter Strike before Counter Strike

    Morrowind - saved Bethesda from bankrupcy and (despite being good itself) paved the way for huge declines in the form of Oblivion and Fallout 3 (which almost single handedly caused the decline of the RPG genre)

    Quake - if John Carmack hadn't licenced the Q2 engine to Gabe Newell we wouldn't have Half Life, Counter Strike, Call of Duty, etc. (link) and around a 100+ Source games (link)

    WarCraft III - developed the hero concept now responsible for a new genre including 50+ MOBA titles (link) and 20+ Hero shooters (link)

    Diablo II - huge influence on system design to this day, don't even know where to start. The itemization, the enemies, the red and blue mana "blobs"

    EverQuest - never played it but I hear WoW copied everything from it (from the HUD to the class trinity) and everyone else copied WoW (maybe anvi can tell us more)

    WoW - the "everything is colorful" palette which plagues art direction to this day




    EDIT: and let's stick to a more reasonable timeframe, modern stuff only (so no Pong and Pac Man)
     
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  2. GrafvonMoltke Learned

    GrafvonMoltke
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    PONG
     
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  3. ERYFKRAD Barbarian Patron

    ERYFKRAD
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    Serpent in the Staglands Shadorwun: Hong Kong Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire
    Realms of Arkania HD
     
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  4. Mister Familiar Learned

    Mister Familiar
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    Resident Evil - Responsible for the popularization and codification of it's particular brand of Survival Horror and it's focus on inventory management and tight map design. A philosophy that would inspire many attempted successors and influence the gameplay in the Horror Genre for years to come.

    Team Fortress 2 - Obviously the rise of Class-Based Hero Shooters and the Ilk endemic to them. But it also set a high standard for Versus Multiplayer games with it's utilitarian design (before the bloat) and demonstrated how effective a unified art style designed specifically to gel with gameplay can work to great benefit, as opposed to greyed attempts at realism. It and the rest of the Orange Box are also what helped to make Valve an industry titan.
     
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  5. ValeVelKal Arcane

    ValeVelKal
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    Those are not necessarily the best games, though usually they would be memorable.

    So games which invented FPS => Wolfenstein 3D, Doom.
    Games which invited Real Time Wargame =>
    Centurion (turn based movement on the world map and real time battle you could interract with
    Ancient Art of War (with real time movement on the world map AND real time battles you could interact with)
    Before that it was turned based or "let's copycat that TT Wargame"
    Adventure games => Zork, King Quest
    RTs => Warcraft, Dune 2
    Strategy Game => Imperialism, Civilization I
    RPG => I am sure you will know the examples but Wizardry and Ultima I have to be here.

    Then there are the games that are famous for popularising a genre, and they are not always the same one as those creating the conversions (think C&C vs Dune 2, the first Total war vs Ancient Art of War, ...)
     
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  6. Mister Familiar Learned

    Mister Familiar
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    Daikatana, and for the better.
     
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  7. Unkillable Cat Prestigious Gentleman LEST WE FORGET Patron

    Unkillable Cat
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    Codex 2014 Make the Codex Great Again! Grab the Codex by the pussy
    'k, bye newfag.
     
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  8. Viata Arcane

    Viata
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    I don't get the point of the topic. If there was no Goldeneye, soon or later someone would made a game like that. Just like if Einstein didn't exist, we would still discover all his theory.
     
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  9. Mister Familiar Learned

    Mister Familiar
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    It is! Another testament to the primeval basis Quake has provided for games across the years.
     
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  10. luj1 You're all shills

    luj1
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    Yeah I recently read about Catacomb 3D (the precursor to Wolf) which apparently was the first 3D first-person game

    [​IMG]

    Fucking Carmack pretty much created shooters it seems :popamole:
     
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  11. ValeVelKal Arcane

    ValeVelKal
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    First games in a genre create conventions that stay around. Typical examples is that the "average range" in FPS (in terms of size of the average screen) was codified by Dune II. The combat tank range was the same as the tank range in C&C for instance, and carried on until the death of the genre. Similarly, nuXCOM created the "1 movement and 1 action, or 2 movements" convention that was copied and copied again in recent tactical shooters.

    There are more hidden stuff. The size of a "tile" in a diablo-like was for a long time the size of a tile in Diablo, which took it from ... UFO Defense. The color code of random items (green / blue / purple / gold) also comes from Diablo I believe. Controls on FPS stabilized around the convention created by the first Call of Duty I think (or maybe Unreal).

    And then there are genre created by a game - PUBG created a new genre (or popularized a genre created from DayZ) which could very well have existed in the early 2000, and created the "beginning in a parachute" convention.

    Without seminal games whole genres would not exist nowadays, and when they are eventually invented they would look & feel different.
     
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  12. ValeVelKal Arcane

    ValeVelKal
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    yeah I heard about Catacomb but never played it. Maybe another case of "Catacomb invented the genre, Wolf3D popularized it"
     
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  13. ValeVelKal Arcane

    ValeVelKal
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    Let's say that you are important if you :

    - Create a genre, or
    - Define (or redefine) the conventions of a genre, or
    - Popularize a genre
     
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  14. luj1 You're all shills

    luj1
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    Crazy stuff


    Well put mate
     
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  15. DraQ Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    DraQ
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    Baldur's Gate - spawned PS:T using its engine, but inflicted literally decades of "I want to be a warcraft" RTWP fucktardry on RPGkind.
    Diablo - invented H&S/roguelite. Whether or not it was a good thing is debatable.
    Diablo 2 - invented shitty item treadmill MMOlite. Whether or not it was a good thing is bloody fucking obvious.
    Oblivion - declined everything, single handedly.
    Halo - introduced gaypad wielding consoletards to FPS mainstream.
    DOS - resurrected TB.
    Elite - invented open world 3D space combat/trading genre.
    Operation Flashpoint - proven that getting realistically shot in the face is fun for sufficiently large target audience.

    Q1 engine, actually.
    Starcraft did it earlier.
    Warcraft III, actually.
     
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  16. luj1 You're all shills

    luj1
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    And Warcraft II did it even earlier. But it wasn't until Warcraft III that this hero concept was fleshed out and began to influence everything

    Yup, you're right

    Highly modified Q2 engine. But because Valve had acquired various Quake licences back in the day its possible they used bits and pieces from Q1 and other quake engines too

     
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  17. Falksi Arcane

    Falksi
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    The Good

    Baldur's Gate - Perfectly timing to take RPG's into the Golden Era. Refined a lot of older mechanics, and surrounded it with great roleplaying. Made me buy a PC.

    X-Com - Bullied turn based combat to the front of the queue

    Double Dragon - Yeah beat 'em ups were already out there, and Kung Fu Master definitely nailed their mast to the donkey, but kids cruising the arcades knew when this hit it was BIG. Suddenly all the BEU elements were taken to another level.

    Street Fighter 2 - World changing. Not only did it revolutionise how BEU's played, but it suddenly made mass competition on arcades a real thing. We had to literally fight to get a go at the cashade.

    GTA Vice City - Took pop culture from being a backdrop in gaming, to being a screaming, in your face core part of it.

    Super Mario Bros - Proved gaming could be as addictive as smack


    The Bad

    Pokemon - Took JRPG's away from being fantastical adventures, to fucking stupid merch-fueled collect-quests.

    The Sims - Warped a generation into think life exists on a machine, and changed the perspective that instead of having a break from reality, it was now about creating a new one.

    Mortal Kombat - "Forget gameplay, here's real life graphics." Cursed gaming for 10-15 years after.


    The Ugly

    Final Fantasy series - Not only popularised JRPG's amongst gamers, but broke them through to the mainstream too with FF7. Whether that's a good thing or not I'm not sure.

    COD - Bought FPS to the forefront, and watered them down to mongsville in the process

    Metal Gear Solid - Amazing PS1 game gave rise to a ton of absolute self indulgent bullshit cut-scenes in various games of this ilk, including it's own sequels.
     
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  18. Danikas Magister

    Danikas
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  19. AArmanFV Savant

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    Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire
    I can't think of RE without Alone in the Dark, but I agree that the massification and popularization of the formula was due to resident evil.
     
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  20. Carrion Arcane Patron

    Carrion
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    Rainbow Six, SWAT 3 and Hidden & Dangerous don't count, or are you just thinking in terms of multiplayer?

    It's actually a damn shame that pretty much no one has made a serious attempt at beating OFP in its own game. Even Bohemia didn't, as they never bothered making a decent SP campaign for any of the Arma games.
     
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  21. Bad Sector Arbiter Patron

    Bad Sector
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    Highly modified Quake 1 engine actually, there is very little Quake 2 code in it. Here is an archived article with two programmers who worked on the engine saying that it was based on Quake 1:

    http://web.archive.org/web/20080228162611/http://collective.valve-erc.com/index.php?doc=1028244478-62628500

    Also the file formats for the maps, etc are closer to the Quake 1 and even in Source engine you can find remnants of Quake 1 that were removed in Quake 2.
     
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  22. Yldr Literate

    Yldr
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    Entire genres were poisoned by their ancestors, with no regard that these early birds were largely experimental themselves and that not every single thing they did was good or worth keeping. Some genres died or almost did because of a slavish obsession to mimic whatever achieved cultural osmosis first, like point-and-click adventure, 1v1 combat, or city builders.
     
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  23. dawcio Learned

    dawcio
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    Pokemon Red/Green
     
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