How would you like your Vault Dweller?

[DarkUnderlord]

If you were never intending to execute people's opinions if they didn't agree with you, why ask them?

Please accept that you are not aware of every conversation that takes place nor the various options that Calis and I were considering.

Please be aware that that has nothing to do with what I just said.

We were willing to accept people's opinions. Sorry, poll failed the 66% 2/3 majority required.

 

[pkt-zer0]

If you were never intending to execute people's opinions if they didn't agree with you, why ask them?

Please accept that you are not aware of every conversation that takes place nor the various options that Calis and I were considering.

Please be aware that that has nothing to do with what I just said.

We were willing to accept people's opinions. Sorry, poll failed the 66% 2/3 majority required.

90% of the people voted on VD regaining moderator powers, though.

 

[Brother None]

Do you get it this time?

I got it the first time. I think I'm done with you, too, I really don't need to waste time with someone who is so weak he needs to resort to calling dissenting voices trolls for no clear reason. Have fun.

(your self-knowledge in referring to yourself as one of the "morons that can't reason, argue or even read properly" suits you well, though)

So there is not much choice anyway, and DU intends to continue his current plan. This topic has achieved its purpose: evaluation the public reaction. And as DU said, had the poll been "at 60% VD with an overwhelming number of comments like "Fuck off DarkUnderlord and Calis, what the fuck do you think you're doing? Vault Dweller 4 lief!" he would have reconsidered his current plan.

1. DU can do whatever he wants, but he doesn't need to pretend this vote isn't a statement of VD having more support than him, even if he also has some. As said multiple times, if he doesn't give a shit, he can say so, but he doesn't need to be hypocrite about it.

2. Someone should make that 4 Lief poll, if these results are declared ambivalent.

We were willing to accept people's opinions. Sorry, poll failed the 66% 2/3 majority required.

The last poll on this subject had an 84% majority in favour of VD, this one has 90%.

*sigh* "Maybe someone should start a less ambivalent poll on the subject"

(either way I'm done here. To be honest, as staff of sites that have close ties to the Codex, it's a bad idea for me to get too mixed-up in this. Sorry for messing with your turf, DU)

 

[Otingocni]

We were willing to accept peoples opinions. Sorry, poll failed the 66% 2/3 majority required.

90% want Vault Dweller back at least as an equal administrator, are you going to respect that majority?

Awfully nice of you to explain the rules after the game is nearly over. How about starting a poll with only Yea or Nay options, and clearly outlining the conditions this time?

edit: Well, any fool like me can point out the obvious. Not to good at this Dictator-Pretending-to-be-Democratic thing DarkUnderlord, you should try for Straight-Dictator as long as you are going to be one anyway.

 

[MasPingon]

If you were never intending to execute people's opinions if they didn't agree with you, why ask them?

Please accept that you are not aware of every conversation that takes place nor the various options that Calis and I were considering.

Please be aware that that has nothing to do with what I just said.

We were willing to accept people's opinions. Sorry, poll failed the 66% 2/3 majority required.

Lol, when did you said that 2/3 majority is required?? If it's 2/3 you would say 3/4

 

[LRP]

DU? IMHO? The more you post on this the worse you look.. Why don't you just close out this sham of a poll, you're making a total joke of it. I have always wondered what the term LUTZ meant.

MasPignon, 90 percent voted for his return, with a minimum of at least 'equal' priviledges, and the majority with a return to 'status quo'. Maybe they need a hundred per cent?

 

[Jasede]

DU, I hope that last post was for the lulz. Else...

holy shit. u cannot b sirius

 

[xedoc gpr]

This is so retarded.

People keep requoting DU's forum rules post where he says they can disregard poll results.

BUT DU keeps coming back here trying to say that the poll results support his view.

If VD looked bad for all his ban threats, you look even stupider for all this stupid "spin the poll" stuff. This is like some bad joke.

 

[Otingocni]

How long do you think until Vault Dweller is found with an ice pick lodged in his skull, and the question of if he should return is finally laid to rest?

 

[vrok]

What the fuck is wrong with you morons? It's not 90%.

A = VD over all. VD is the ultimate authority on who gets to stay at the Codex.
B = VD joins as editor, bans decided by rest of staff.
C = VD is equal to rest of staff, staff votes for bans.

Learn to fucking read. 60% isn't 90%. A isn't C. All options want VD back. Two of them agree that VD shouldn't be able to ban at his leisure.

Stop making fools out of yourselves, even if DU is kind of doing it too.

Edit: I think some illiterate tags are in order. Let's do a poll on that!

 

[LRP]

I think Xdoc is dead on! IMO? Just quit commenting on it, and close the sucker, DU. You're going to do what you want, but there is NO way, simply none to scew the view.

 

[Vault Dweller]

VD is apparently not open to negotiation, except in a "my way or the highway" way, heh.

Not this bullshit again. I was perfectly willing to have a discussion exploring all options. The spectacular manner in which this attempt failed has illustrated that the new system doesn't and will not work.

it takes some guts to swallow your pride and make a compromise.

The word you're looking for is self-respect. Not to mention that I tried already. What more do you want me to do? Keep trying every week? Let it go already.

 

[sqeecoo]

Make that 4.

Woohoo!

@Otingocni

That's a good point. And I like your avatar and name. But that's not how I understood the poll.

This is my interpretation:

A: VD comes back, gets to do whatever he likes.
B: VD is back but powerless.
C: VD is back, and has equal power as the other admins. This is what I voted for.

Note there is no option D: VD does not come back, we continue as it is now.
So DU did not make this poll to justify his course of action, but to see what the public opinion is. If the results had been overwhelmingly in favor of A, either in the poll or in the comments, DU would have considered a different course of action.
Of course, we only have his word for it, but I don't see how he could give us more.

I for one believe him: I think he is a good guy, even though I think he was overly aggressive in his criticism of VD.

EDIT: @VD
Ok, I won't mention it again. Sorry to see you go. I still can't say I understand why you couldn't post an article or two, or the self-respect stuff (I do understand that, I just disagree). But I'll drop it, ok.

 

[roshan]

DU? IMHO? The more you post on this the worse you look.. Why don't you just close out this sham of a poll, you're making a total joke of it. I have always wondered what the term LUTZ meant.

MasPignon, 90 percent voted for his return, with a minimum of at least 'equal' priviledges, and the majority with a return to 'status quo'. Maybe they need a hundred per cent?

I too agree that the poll should be read as 90% in favor of VD returning with at least equal status to other admins. In fact, the general sentiment is that people dont just want VD back, they also want him in charge of the forums.

 

[DarkUnderlord]

1. Vault Dweller outlined a very clear program which he wished to implement. He made it very clear that if the other admin's did not support him with this program, he would not come back onboard.

2. Calis, Shagnak, DarkUnderlord and baby arm did not support Vault Dweller's program (in that order).

3. The terms we were willing to accept for Vault Dweller to come back on staff were (and still are) as follows:

• Forum Admin Access:
  • DarkUnderlord: Site-wide Forum Administration / Technical Administation where required
  • Calis: Technical Administation
  • Ausir: Developer Tag Guy (is that all he does?)
  Site Admin Access (deciding who gets to post news / content etc... Also includes Calis and DU with site admin access):
  • Vault Dweller: Codex Editor-in-Chief
  • baby arm: TCancer Editor-in-Chief
  • Shagnak: TCancer Guy
  For technical reasons, the Editor-in-Chief and probably most newsies would likely need moderator status in the news forums. At least for the Codex as Calis' script doesn't auto-delete the comments thread like the code on TCancer does.
  
  All decisions to ban / tag someone can have the input of the 5 people above (excluding Ausir). All have an equal vote and nobody acts without that vote unless someone's spamming the forums up to buggery and some quick action is needed. I mean, there is the issue of judgement and at the end of the day, you either have good judgement or you don't, so we've got to be able to have people who are able to make a good snap decision on the rare occasion that it's called for.

4. Vault Dweller did not accept those terms. I don't care if it hurts his ego because he can't insta-ban people. Tough. Those are the terms.

DU? IMHO? The more you post on this the worse you look.

I am more than happy to deal with the consequences of my decisions. If there are people here who don't like that, you are more than welcome to leave. Sorry but nice reasonable DU time is over. We've all made our decisions. Accept that. If Vault Dweller wishes to establish his own blog like Briosafreak and 58% of the forum leave the Codex to join him, then we will bear those consequences.

 

[xedoc gpr]

1. Vault Dweller outlined a very clear program which he wished to implement. He made it very clear that if the other admin's did not support him with this program, he would not come back onboard.

I was perfectly willing to have a discussion exploring all options.

.......

The terms we were willing to accept for Vault Dweller to come back on staff were (and still are) as follows:

It seems ridiculous to believe that those are the terms you all agreed on when Calis and Shagnak wanted to prolong the discussion with VD, before you jumped in.

 

[Vault Dweller]

I still can't say I understand why you couldn't post an article or two...

Maybe I will when I have something to say. I'm sure that Fallout 3 news would motivate me to share my thoughts with you guys.

 

[sqeecoo]

Maybe I will when I have something to say. I'm sure that Fallout 3 news would motivate me to share my thoughts with you guys.

Great! That's all I was asking for with all my "swallow your pride!!" stuff.

 

[Helton]

VD does not come back, we feel out the current situation for a few months.

At that point, having tried the alternative, we are better equipped to make this decision. If things are totally fail and if VD still wants to come back, give him free reign and BJs. If things are not totally fail and VD wants to come back, make him a full moderator or full forum administrator (whatever deal is worked out) as well as site admin; but with agreement to be more discreet.

If VD does not wish to return as full or partial admin then we tough it out that way.

This gives everyone a chance to calm down, I mean to the point of detachment. It prevents a back-and-forth tug-o-war in management. It allows the Codex to evaluate how much it needs VD and lets VD evaluate whether he really wants to bother with the Codex.

In the meantime we stop prolonging the drama.

 

[Otingocni]

So I take that as another vote for a simple Yea or Nay poll, vrok, instead of this vote parsing crap.

Sqeecoo, B is what DarkUnderlord wants and has offered Vault Dweller, a less-powerful (to DarkUnderlords own place) content-providing position. Vault Dweller refused, but B remains the option which coincides with DarkUnderlords plans. Helpfully, DarkUnderlord just explained all that in more detail.

Sorry but nice reasonable DU time is over.

Still pretending it was ever around? Did you even pretend to negotiate, or did you deny Vault Dweller any chance to return when he didn\'t immediate acquiesce to your terms?

 

[Slylandro]

Edit: I think some illiterate tags are in order. Let's do a poll on that!

I think anyone who has been keeping track of your posting history would probably take this as an opportunity to put you up first and foremost as the candidate. By all means, hang yourself now since the Codex no longer has the power to do so. We still have a couple sticks on hand I think.

Edit:
I don't know whether to believe you or not DU, but assuming you were being honest, I think the polite assessment of this thread would be that you screwed up. You should always include a percentage up top if you are serious. Saying it has to be 66% now comes off as arbitrary, why 66? It could've been 3/4 (the percentage necessary for an amendment to the US Constitution), it could be 34% (plurality kind of majority), it could be anything greater than 50%, etc.

 

[Ratty]

DU, you really ought to hire a PR manager, because you kinda suck at this whole making people not hate you thing.

in fact, I did not see a single post of "this is the end of the codex!"

Look harder. I'm convinced this is the end of the Codex as a news/opinion site, and last week's scramble for news staff only reinforces that impression. Worse yet, absence of quality content is bound to lead to diminishment of quality CRPG discussion. We'll see in a few months' time if I'm just one of the batty doomsayers, though.

One more thing - anyone notice that decline of the Codex coincides with Peak Oil? If that's not evidence that the end is truly nigh, I don't know what is!

 

[vrok]

I think anyone who has been keeping track of your posting history would probably take this as an opportunity to put you up first and foremost as the candidate. By all means, hang yourself now since the Codex no longer has the power to do so. We still have a couple sticks on hand I think.

Are you saying you've been keeping track of my posting history? I'm flattered. Is it a hobby? Either way I've already admitted that my post history isn't shit free, so your e-hate campaign is largely irrelevant, just like you. Besides, I have no problem keeping my recent dumbfuck tag. The point was however that there's quite a few others deserving of negative tags.

Edit:

So I take that as another vote for a simple Yea or Nay poll, vrok, instead of this vote parsing crap.

Not the poll's fault some of you can't read. So no, you may not.

 

[Otingocni]

If things are totally fail and if VD still wants to come back, give him free reign and BJs.

At which point, when Vault Dweller receives 95% of the vote on a similar poll, DarkUnderlord will pipe up Sorry, but we all agreed it had to be unanimous. What, you dont remember? Well, unfortunately that thread was erased when we updated the forum software. Anyway, rule stands, Vault Dweller can\'t return to power.

 

[Helton]

At which point, when Vault Dweller receives 95% of the vote on a similar poll, DarkUnderlord will pipe up Sorry, but we all agreed it had to be unanimous. What, you dont remember? Well, unfortunately that thread was erased when we updated the forum software. Anyway, rule stands, Vault Dweller can\'t return to power.

In the meantime we stop prolonging the drama.