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Hydlide Series (Love it or HATE it)?

Discussion in 'jRPG Weeaboo Discussion' started by KeighnMcDeath, Mar 8, 2021.

  1. KeighnMcDeath RPG Codex Boomer

    KeighnMcDeath
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    Ever since I was stupid one day in Toys R Us and chose Hydlide for the NES instead of Final Fantasy I have had a sort of angst about this game. It certainly didn't warm me up all that well towards Ys either. Oh, I even called the Nintendo hotline once to finish the game due to the retarded wizards having the fairy if you hit both with wave spell. Funny, Nintendo said they couldn't help me. It was wasted money on a call and mere luck and deduction or me just wanting to hit both at once.

    I never played the second game and could hardly stomach the rom Super Hydlide. Now I know they were on other platforms and even had a 3D version. There are lots of videos on youtube on this game with vitriol usually but occasionally some love. Its an odd action based RPG and one that just didn't warm on me with this attack/defend mechanic. The music was awful. Those unfamiliar (though this is the jrpg section so I'm sure you are ALL familiar with this game can look here: Hydlide
    Moby Games - Hydlide Series
    Hardcore Gaming 101 - Hydlide
    Hardcore Gaming 101 - Hydlide II - Shining of Darkness
    Hardcore Gaming 101 - Hydlide III - The Space Memories or Super Hydlide
    Hardcore Gaming 101 - Virtual Hydlide

    Gamefaq - Hydlide
    GameFaq - Hydlide II - Shining of Darkness
    GameFaq - Hydlide III - THE Space Memories (Super Hydlide)
    GameFaq - Virtual Hydlide

    Hydlide Shrine
    VG Maps MSX Hydlide II - Shining of Darkness
    VG Maps (Super Hydlide down on S)
    Hydlide - Strategy Wiki
    Super Hydlide - Strategy Wiki

    That's all nifty but what shocked me recently was the little known PC release that what remastered and had original MSX versions (I guess its MSX). Here's a few videos on this:


    And here is the music which is NOT horrible.


    Here is the supposed patch that is supposed to fix the language barrier. RomHacking Hydlide Windows

    Show Spoiler
    Because I guess its a Demo its ok to give a few links. I got the iso from Adventure Legends. I don't like the site at it has a lot of shitware floating around. Still if you want to risk it until I can get this 400 meg fucker uploaded you can go there. If you want the package already unpacked from iso and you just have to hit the exe then get it from my own box *HERE* & for some reason the patch Again HERE. So, I guess DL at your own risk. I have webroot security and it didn't detect shit. Scan it I guess. The music can be ripped out of the files and most assets are in various files. The museum and manuals and shit are all in Japenese and they open even offline. I can't read them so fuck.

     
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2021
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  2. Humanity has risen! Arcane Patron Repressed Homosexual

    Humanity has risen!
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    Hydlide III was starting to become a good game. Hydlide I and II are too primitive and not very fun.

    I don't understand why T&E Soft never made sequels based on the gameplay and system of Hydlide III.
     
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  3. MRY Prestigious Gentleman Wormwood Studios Developer

    MRY
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    Hydlide was for sure the first game I was able to perceive as poorly designed, and it has remained probably the most poorly designed console game I ever played. (Arguably, Rise of the Robots for the SNES, which shipped with completely un-fun, constant lag, might vie with it, but I doubt it.) The basic controls were terrible, and the game's structure was unfun. I gather that if you were in Japan and played it in 1984, when it was first released on various non-NES systems, it would've been groundbreaking. But in the U.S., it was released on the NES three years after The Legend of Zelda, and the same year as Dragon Warrior, and it felt like a hideous mockery of those games.
     
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  4. Kruno Arcane Shitposter

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    Makes me puke!
     
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  5. Licorice Arcane Wumao

    Licorice
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    I heard that NES Hydlide is worse than the PC88 original and that accounts for it's poor reputation in the West.

    No idea if that's true but I'd be surprised if there isn't some quality in these games given that I recently played Dragon Slayer 2 (Xanadu) and was surprised by how good it was.
     
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  6. KeighnMcDeath RPG Codex Boomer

    KeighnMcDeath
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    From what I've learned on a few Ys fansites is that the NES hydlide is a special edition adding magic from Hydlide II; rather a new system actually. I guess the MSX versions of the first game has no magic. Indeed, in the windows enhanced demo, you have no magic so getting 3rd fairy seems to be troublesome.

    The second game looks sort of like a mishmash clone world of the first but more dungeons, NPC system with karma of sorts, and a few shopkeepers to buy (maybe sell), and level up attack and spells. Raw xp levelling only gives HP.

    Hydlide 3 is where they were starting to expand the game into a more recognizable rpg with classes etc etc.

    Yeah, gameplay is a little frustrating. 1 is simple, 2 is simplish (what I've played), and 3 I died so much it made 1 look good.

    I guess Hydlide II got an enhanced mobile port. Kind of odd the CD didn't get a better mode or that all versions weren't put on it for a complete collection.

    The enhanced does sound better and look more appealing imho. I couldn't stand thr NES music.

    I still can't get the english patch to work but played up to killer octopus which i don't recall nes having.
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    I don't need enhanced graphics but sound has to NOT make my ears bleed else I mute it all.
     
    Last edited: Mar 9, 2021
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  7. zwanzig_zwoelf Graverobber Foundation Developer

    zwanzig_zwoelf
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    I like Hydlide (PC-88) for its 'simple yet fun' attitude and it could work as a modern game if it had a portable version, but IIRC the NES version is not a good game. Haven't played 2 and 3, but I do remember than 3 has pretty good music.
    Virtual Hydlide is worth a try at least once -- it's a good concept, but the execution is rather meh, but in the end it still manages to be pretty fun.
     
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  8. KeighnMcDeath RPG Codex Boomer

    KeighnMcDeath
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    I want the AVGN character as my avatar in the Virtual version though. Maybe some cut screen expressions and naturally voice acting. Virtual Hydlide - AVGN edition.


    Some spoiler on the graphics
    Show Spoiler

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    Endgame pics
    Show Spoiler

    [​IMG]
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    I'm sure they were using some other game for inspiration here. Still, game 2 was more or less the original with no touch-ups. It was functional but I can't read the dialogue from npcs.
     
    Last edited: Mar 8, 2021
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  9. Licorice Arcane Wumao

    Licorice
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    Apparently Fairune is a modern take on Hydlide explicitly:

     
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  10. zwanzig_zwoelf Graverobber Foundation Developer

    zwanzig_zwoelf
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    Nice, gonna give them a try later. Thanks!
     
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  11. Licorice Arcane Wumao

    Licorice
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    Ok, so I just completed the first Hydlide. I also completed the PCE version of Druaga the other day and watched a nice annotated playthrough of the original arcade release too. Xanadu I haven't completed, but I played quite a bit recently and Zelda I completed a very long time ago.

    The games were released in this order Druaga, Hydlide, Xanadu, Zelda, between June 1984 and February 1986.

    Druaga was the first of these and established the "game".

    The game is:
    1. Travel from maze (like) area to area
    2. But first do X (where X can be anything) to reveal treasure, then get it
    3. Lest you have to go back

    There are enemies you can overlap with to damage at the same time as they damage you, you can block projectiles and and you can also break walls. There's a time limit for each area.

    Although the guy who made Druaga had played Wizardry, and he later worked on the Japanese Wizardries (ports of the Western ones only?), he explicitly set out to make the game of Druaga nothing like the game of Wizardry, even though he wanted to make a game out of the same thing -- an adventurer diving into a dungeon to complete some task.

    Specifically he wanted no (visible) stats, and he wanted the game to play something more like Pacman. On the first question at least he seemed to have changed his mind cause the later PCE Druaga has player allocable stats.

    Next is Hydlide.

    Hydlide is the exact same game, with some twists. Dropped is the wall breaking and the projectile blocking. You get stronger independently of treasure gain, some treasures are immediately visible, and you can move freely from screen to screen (but can't scroll) and enter separate dungeon areas. In Druaga, you could go back to earlier screens, but it's a matter of getting zapped by the boss to first missed treasure area. There's also no time limit.

    The biggest change there is how you get stronger -- by killing enemies for XP. Items too, but there's only 2 in the game that affect your attack and defense respectively. In Druaga, you mostly avoided enemies, unless you suspected they might be part of the trigger for revealing the treasure (usually involves killing them in some order, or killing some enemies while leaving others alive). Hydlide employs the same trick, notably to get the shield and regen ring, but the main impetus for attacking enemies is the XP they yield. In some more maze like areas, especially when trying to push forward onto new frontiers, enemies return to the role of Pacman ghosts.

    Xanadu is the most complex of these 4 games numerically, and also the largest.

    Again, it's the same game as Druaga, differing on the specifics. Same as Hydlide, there's no wall breaking or projectile blocking, you can't overlap with enemies, and there's no time limit. However unlike Hydlide, scrolling returns. The perspective here is different in the "overworld", which scrolls, and there's a jump button. Dungeons and combat however, are the usual "top down", and are by screen.

    In addition to XP making you more powerful, gold can as well. You buy stat increases, which determine your chances of success performing certain actions. Some treasures may also be bought. You level up explicitly at a temple, and choose between two classes. Leveling up is quite consequential as it quite significantly up your resource consumption.

    Like Druaga and unlike Hydlide, enemies come in limited number.

    Even though these changes are important, the most important, IMO, as it most affects the game which Druaga established, is the fact that all treasures are either already revealed, or revealed by the exact same rule -- minor treasures on every enemy killed, major on every last enemy on screen (unless killed with magic, in which case, no treasure). Gone are the cryptic triggers. Also (mostly?) gone is the cryptic relationship between treasure and the non-combat progress "gate" they unlock -- they're all keys and they're all (literal) gates.

    Finally, the other big addition is that now navigation is much more complex, but remains rules based. There are many teleporter puzzles that play on screen symmetry and world wrapping, as well as one way tiles and tile patterns that you pass through using specific platforming techniques. It's no longer just 4 cardinal directions with some tiles blocking.

    Zelda sits somewhere between Druaga and Hydlide, with some elements from Xanadu.

    Like in Druaga you can block projectiles, and bombs are sort of similar to the pick axe, but mainly used against outer not inner walls.

    Like Hydlide, there's no time limit, and you traverse freely from screen to screen.

    Like Xanadu, you proceed through dungeons with the help of keys, and you assign an item to an item use button.

    Treasure triggers are less cryptic than in Druaga, they mostly follow a pattern, but even so are well hidden e.g. many are found by bombing a tile, but which tile? Even Hydlide's fairies were at somewhat unusually behaving scenery e.g. trees with wasps.

    Zelda takes Hydlide's kill enemies to power up system, and combines it with Druaga's power up by revealing treasures system, by making some treasures shop keepers, and enemies sometimes drop currency. This is the logical AND to Xanadu's logical OR.

    The Lost Woods is effectively a teleporter puzzle.

    Its other innovation is an attack button (rather than, I guess, mode, as in the other games).

    One thing I prefer in Zelda in comparison with Hydlide and Xanadu, is its more varied (and aggressive?) enemy behaviors.
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2021
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  12. Falksi Arcane

    Falksi
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    Reading about this series always makes me wanna watch Commando.....

    [​IMG]
     
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  13. KeighnMcDeath RPG Codex Boomer

    KeighnMcDeath
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  14. KeighnMcDeath RPG Codex Boomer

    KeighnMcDeath
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    Oh... and this:

     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2021
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  15. Tweed Professional Kobold Patron

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    The only one I ever played was Super Hydlide on the Genesis. It was okay, the food and rest system meant having to plan ahead and having a banking system was neat and helpful considering how everything weighs something. Pretty good soundtrack too.
     
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  16. Humanity has risen! Arcane Patron Repressed Homosexual

    Humanity has risen!
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  17. Humanity has risen! Arcane Patron Repressed Homosexual

    Humanity has risen!
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    Wow the PC-8801 version had some great music too:

     
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  18. KeighnMcDeath RPG Codex Boomer

    KeighnMcDeath
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    I need to try out the 3D hydlide.
     
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