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I don't like Planescape: Torment that much.

Discussion in 'General RPG Discussion' started by DragoFireheart, Jun 26, 2011.

  1. Surf Solar cannot into womynz

    Surf Solar
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    It's a good question, I don't even really know why. For one, the pacing in Torment was much faster, fights didn't last that long. I didn't have to use that much "buffing" before each battle, didn't have to rest so often. The animations were faster, the tohit chance was higher (I think?) the feedback was better. Yes, there was a lack of different encounters, but just from the "feel" PST felt much better and responsive. BG I/II felt always forced and I had to "suffer infinite torment" through the endless combat encounters there which just became boring, especially if you already loathe tiresome RtwP combat. Thousands of low level trashmobs just placed to annoy you while you are on quests with no real difference how you solve them. Sorry no, this is just not my game. :/ Torment had very little combat, but I somehow always enjoyed it. The only rageworthy fight was when TNO came back from the underground Prison and could fight this daemon creature at the west of ruined Curst. I sat hours upon hours to defeat the beast.
     
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  2. Excidium P. banal

    Self-Ejected
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    I see. And I have to agree that PST combat is better than BG1/2 because there's less combat. :lol:

    But I liked the IWD combat. Not enough to finish it, though.
     
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  3. piydek Cipher

    piydek
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    ToEE was unplayable for me because of completely retarded dialogues and absolutely no story. I know those aren't supposed to be its strong points, but i need at least something in that department to want to play the damn game.
     
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  4. Imbecile Arbiter

    Imbecile
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    I found arcanums combat to be bloody awful. In fairness this is compensated in other ways, but if good combat is a focus, I'd avoid it.
     
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  5. Phage Arcane Manlet

    Phage
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    I personally thought the dialogues/concepts in the final area of the game were part of what made it to incredibly memorable.

    Of course, the build up is what made it work so well.
     
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  6. kingcomrade Kingcomrade Edgy

    kingcomrade
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    Combat in PS:T is terrible and I used cheats. Infinity Engine combat was always really boring and clunky, just ignore it.
    Every time I think about playing ToEE again I go "oh wait hommlet"
     
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  7. Serious_Business Best Poster on the Codex

    Serious_Business
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    Bad combat? More like bad game. This arbitrary distinction between combat and "the rest of the gameplay" that is supposed to save certain games needs to stop. It's good combat or it's shit, because rpgs are wargames. Conclusion : rpgs are shitty games. Wake up codex edit : /mondblut convert
     
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  8. J1M Arcane

    J1M
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    I would suggest you merely patch ToEE and play through it without the mod that changes the things you won't notice have been changed because you have no frame of reference.
     
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  9. J1M Arcane

    J1M
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    Sure, whatever, but for those people who wanted a 3rd edition D&D game that wasn't real-time bullshit there isn't really another option. And ToEE did that very well.

    Any game that lets me build a spiked chain fighter for tripping and light spider webs on fire to damage enemies gets a free pass in a few other areas. I will also note that unlike most games, I actually used its crafting system because it wasn't homo gay.
     
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  10. SCO Arcane In My Safe Space

    SCO
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    Right and there was nothing worthwhile with the deposed priest of the air temple you find lost in one of the nodes, who you can help in his vengeance, or infiltrating the temple for one or the other or both factions, ambushing them both, or making them fight themselves eachother, or that lolth priest dude betraying you or if you didn't went for his shit, getting two greater spiders when you exited (just when you thought you were safe) or if you were even more unlucky, getting the evil monk and barbarian to ambush you with 10 other dudes if you mentioned the moathouse to them but didn't take them on (after all the fights mind you), or nothing worthwhile in getting a ogre companion or nothing worthwhile in condemning a annoying noble to become a vampire, or bypassing the whole temple (almost) by secret passages going directly to the skull and the last level etc etc etc.

    Go eat a bag of dicks, and i say this as one of the biggest torment fanboys around (played it seven times no joke).
    ToEE is >>> IWD2
     
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  11. kingcomrade Kingcomrade Edgy

    kingcomrade
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    More like bad combat.
    Why? It makes sense in a lot of cases.
    Who is being arbitrary now? Is this something you just decided?
     
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  12. I thought PST was overrated too. Some of the quests are quite good, and there's a lot of good dialogue, but the combat is atrocious and I'm sorry but the way the main story line develops is really bad. The last few areas are just BG-style maps full of mobs you have to kill (I'm thinking of Curst and the outer planes). I can't believe some people think this is the best RPG ever.

    It doesn't have anything on Fallout or Fallout 2.
     
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  13. MicoSelva Prestigious Gentleman No Gods No Kings Patron

    MicoSelva
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    Codex 2012 Codex 2013 Codex 2014 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Make the Codex Great Again! Grab the Codex by the pussy Insert Title Here RPG Wokedex Strap Yourselves In Serpent in the Staglands Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Divinity: Original Sin 2 Bubbles In Memoria A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Kingmaker
    The strongest point of PST is its creativity overload. There are so many cool ideas everywhere that You never really know what You will find around the corner. When I played it for the first time, I felt excited every time I was about to talk to someone new - and it rarely ended up in a disappointment.

    Also the way all these ideas interconnect with each other is amazing. It's easy to make a "creative dump" and leave it like that, but here it's all made into a coherent whole that is hard to grasp all at once. Many layers can only be noticed on a second playthrough, when You aready have the big picture in mind.

    Not everybody will be equally amazed by this, I guess, and for people who are not, the game might seem rather dull most of the time. To be honest, I actually liked the gameplay a lot too (mostly because of that "what will I encounter this time?" feel) and combat did not bother me. It did feel a bit clunky, even compared to Baldur's Gate, but I still was able to make my characters do what I wanted from them. Most of the time.

    Anyway, if You don't enjoy the gameplay, You might still want to force Yourself to finish the game just to know what all the fuss is about. Or watch an LP. I'd say the story alone is enough of a reason to play on.
     
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  14. Bitcher Educated

    Bitcher
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    lol fagcomrade got trolled hard
     
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  15. Azarkon Arcane

    Azarkon
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    Curst had a satisfying conclusion. Not sure about the outer planes since I don't even remember them. My memory of PST is like Lower Wards -> Upper Wards -> Ravel -> Curst -> Trias -> Fortress of Regrets.

    PST is a game of memorable moments. The rest are forgettable hack-n-slash garbage. The most poignant moment for me was TNO's talk with his other incarnations in the Fortress, with the clincher being his realization of who he was (an extremely well-done moment, having just the right balance to leave an emotional impact without straying into melodrama).

    After that the game could really do no wrong, but it did manage a great finale, too, though the climax of the game, at least for me, was in the conversation with the other incarnations.

    Knowing how stats affect the game, I think PST is a game meant to be experienced several times, with the player discovering something new each time. If you go through it the first time, as many people recommend, with a mage maxing out on INT and WIS you get a "complete" experience but without the sense of the game's intricacies. Some degree of accomplishment is lost in being spoiled in that manner.

    PST really is a game that should have set the standard for RPG aesthetics. Instead it was the first and last game of its kind, at least up to this point.
     
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  16. el Supremo Augur Patron

    el Supremo
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    [​IMG]
    Confusing... the recent trend is...
     
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  17. Lee_Stavros Novice

    Lee_Stavros
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    When PS:T was released it was quite unique in terms of RPGs. It is like you said heavily focused on dialogue and questing. Although i didn't find the combat too horrible.
    A long time ago, this was one of the best RPGs of all time, but like most of the older classics, it has not aged well. Playing a game simply for the pleasure of nostalgia isn't the same thing as playing a game because you want to be entertained. And needless to say, the writing isn't deep nor intellectual in any way.
    I myself would call this a very mediocre game, it had enormous potential but failed to deliver.

    I would recommend TOEE instead of IWD.
    They are both dungeon crawlers, but while the latter used the tedious pause mechanism that is IE,
    TOEE is actually one of the best T-B tactics game ever released.
     
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  18. oneself Arcane Shitposter

    oneself
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    Couldn't finish PST. Nice story, dull gameplay.
     
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  19. 1eyedking Erudite

    1eyedking
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    What this man said.

    I think I will replay it soon, it's been long since I played a game with both good art direction and gameplay.

    I can also understand why some people dislike PS:T and The Witcher. There's not much gaming in either, but they're solid entertainment for their other assets.
     
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  20. sirfink Scholar

    sirfink
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    First Arcanum and now this?! Next week's thread: "I dunno dudes, Fallout kinda sucked."
     
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  21. Clockwork Knight Arcane

    Clockwork Knight
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    Yeah, I shudder to think about someone not sharing the hivemind's opinion.

    But enough of that. Let's go to Gamefaqs and mock some people for not accepting the fact that someone doesn't share the hivemind's opinion.
     
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  22. Wyrmlord Arcane

    Wyrmlord
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    Stop asking our opinions on what games to play and search something yourself.

    Anyway, why the story slash dialogue in your post? You feel the two are one and the same? Many RPGs advance the story not through dialogue but object/clue finding.

    Examples include finding a chess piece hidden in somebody's backyard, finding a door underneath a waterfall, finding a chessboard near that door, using the chesspiece on that chessboard, unlocking a whole subterranean fortress, finding a letter where a man admits to having the hots for his sister.

    I won't reveal which game it was (do some game hunting yourself!), but each step of the above is much harder than just perusing a set of dialogue lines to find the right branching path. Had this been the model for RPGs rather than dialogue trees, we would have seen a much different and a much more superior genre.

    By the way, you know which was the last RPG which often used object/clue finding as much as or moreso than dialogue to advance the plot? Torment.
     
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  23. SCO Arcane In My Safe Space

    SCO
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  24. Ninja Cartographer Novice

    Ninja Cartographer
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    These two are Co8 :) (the latter hinted in the p&p module)
    Lareth actually has another scenario in the mod, really blew my mind when I first discovered it.
     
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  25. DragoFireheart all caps, rainbow colors, SOMETHING.

    DragoFireheart
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    -Why should I not ask the opinions of others? Just because someone gives me their opinion doesn't mean I'm going to follow it.


    -Can a good story have bad dialog? If it can, then aren't we in a sense implying that dialog is not an aspect of the story?

    -Sounds like Myst.

    -I agree with that point


    -Which is something I do enjoy about the game.
     
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