I thought Pathfinder was better...

[perfectslumbers]

Ending sucked because you Romance (man horrible writing) the Queen and then decide for the Greater Good to throw you self into the Wound shutting it forever. That's it. Afterwards you can help Areelu a bit and then it's the end your remembered as some idiot.

Huh? Every mythic path has a way to close the wound without sacrificing yourself, you just use Areelu. Although I haven't romanced the bitch queen so maybe she forced you to do it.

 

[NJClaw]

Ending sucked because you Romance (man horrible writing) the Queen and then decide for the Greater Good to throw you self into the Wound shutting it forever. That's it. Afterwards you can help Areelu a bit and then it's the end your remembered as some idiot.

There is no coming back to to be with the one you fall in love with etc. It was bad after playing for 300 hours.

Now I am out.

Man, you really wanted that 100-year-old grandma pussy, didn't you?

 

[dacencora]

The latter means a specific (sub)genre

The specific subgenre you’re referring to was essentially defined by Dragon Quest 1, which is an almost perfect (in my opinion, of course) combination of Ultima-style exploration and Wizardry-style combat (another game similarly a combo of Ultima and Wizardry is Wasteland, which I feel the same level of admiration for). Basically every RPG in Japan has something in common with Dragon Quest, at some level or another. In other words, SMT and Elminage belong to the same genre as DQ.

 

[FriendlyMerchant]

Romances should be removed from this game. They were always a bad idea.

 

[Carpincho Pampeano]

The latter means a specific (sub)genre

The specific subgenre you’re referring to was essentially defined by Dragon Quest 1, which is an almost perfect (in my opinion, of course) combination of Ultima-style exploration and Wizardry-style combat (another game similarly a combo of Ultima and Wizardry is Wasteland, which I feel the same level of admiration for). Basically every RPG in Japan has something in common with Dragon Quest, at some level or another. In other words, SMT and Elminage belong to the same genre as DQ.

They are just trying to cope to not get caught liking a filthy JRPG from that problematic island in the pacific with an homogenous population. Can you imagine liking a sub-genre without constant woke talking points? SMT alone perfected the Wizardry 4 formula.

 

[dacencora]

The latter means a specific (sub)genre

The specific subgenre you’re referring to was essentially defined by Dragon Quest 1, which is an almost perfect (in my opinion, of course) combination of Ultima-style exploration and Wizardry-style combat (another game similarly a combo of Ultima and Wizardry is Wasteland, which I feel the same level of admiration for). Basically every RPG in Japan has something in common with Dragon Quest, at some level or another. In other words, SMT and Elminage belong to the same genre as DQ.

They are just trying to cope to not get caught liking a filthy JRPG from that problematic island in the pacific with an homogenous population. Can you imagine liking a sub-genre without constant woke talking points? SMT alone perfected the Wizardry 4 formula.

Shin Megami Tensei is one of the best series of video games, let alone of a specific subgenre. Agreed with everything you're saying there. Of the ones I have played, I like IV's combat the most, even if the bosses were a little easy (though reacting to reflects with almighty attacks was awesome and I was disappointed that V did not include that feature, apparently).

 

[luj1]

I must say that Wrath's ending goes down as one of the worst endings since Chrono Trigger.

I played the Angel Mythic Path in my Game. Romanced the Queen(holy shit horrible writing) horrible exposition to a romance to anything really.

And through out this game sent suggestions after suggestion. I played the Alpha, I played the Beta and still, STILL!

The writing wasn't fixed. I did however write them another suggestion on how to have a better ending for the Angel Path.
I tired to help them with their music too...but who cares.

Why was Pathfinder a better game? Fear not I shall explain.

When playing Pathfinder you were slowly unraveling a mystery that was tied to you building your kingdom. The characters were better, the whimsical moments were better. I thought the tone was all around just more true to everything in that world.

In Wrath it was more of pointless bloat to an already very ambitious bloated game.

They could have done better every where. I think perhaps this game was designed for young teenagers. Are they not the ones
who purchase such games?

God what a horrible ending! Horrible orchestration! Yet it can be fixed and there is time enough to do the fixing. It's not the ending that must be, it's ending afterwards as final farewell that is horrible and should be fixed based on what you do in the game and the path you take and who you romance and why.

Pathfinder is really a disgrace, both of them

mandatory cringe companions + unrivaled system bloat + deviant SJW pozz

the only thing thats worse are the Pillars games

 

[Wunderbar]

Owlcat are bad at writing and design and they refuse to learn from their mistakes.

Owlcat weren't bad at writing and design, they were OK. It's just everybody else were so bad Owlcat received a lot of undeserved praise, that praise got into their heads.

 

[Sykar]

Romances should be removed from this game. They were always a bad idea.

Just ignore them.

 

[RIT_SKUA]

Romances should be removed from this game. They were always a bad idea.

Speaking generally, there's inherently nothing wrong with putting romances in video games (or any other form of media) if they're written well. The only problem is that most games in general (especially compared to other forms of media) have poor writing, so they usually are not written well. I have not gotten to WoTR yet, so I don't know the complete context of everything being discussed here, but dismissing them entirely is unfair.

 

[FriendlyMerchant]

Romances should be removed from this game. They were always a bad idea.

Just ignore them.

No. The writing staff spent time writing these romances and the animation staff spent time scripting everything. That time could have been used for something better like combat or making sure the writing in the questlines are at least decent.

 

[Justicar]

You actually finished this game? I got bored of the endless walls of text and exposition after 30h. Underrrail at least knew to keep this short and it had a bit better writing still droped it after I reached the locust infested expansion. The older I get the less patience I have for gaymes wasting my time.

 

[luj1]

Romances should be removed from this game. They were always a bad idea.

Just ignore them.

No. The writing staff spent time writing these romances and the animation staff spent time scripting everything. That time could have been used for something better like combat or making sure the writing in the questlines are at least decent.

b-b-but they could have made 10 more barebone minigames

 

[Maxie]

I must say that Wrath's ending goes down as one of the worst endings since Chrono Trigger.

I played the Angel Mythic Path in my Game. Romanced the Queen(holy shit horrible writing) horrible exposition to a romance to anything really.

And through out this game sent suggestions after suggestion. I played the Alpha, I played the Beta and still, STILL!

The writing wasn't fixed. I did however write them another suggestion on how to have a better ending for the Angel Path.
I tired to help them with their music too...but who cares.

Why was Pathfinder a better game? Fear not I shall explain.

When playing Pathfinder you were slowly unraveling a mystery that was tied to you building your kingdom. The characters were better, the whimsical moments were better. I thought the tone was all around just more true to everything in that world.

In Wrath it was more of pointless bloat to an already very ambitious bloated game.

They could have done better every where. I think perhaps this game was designed for young teenagers. Are they not the ones
who purchase such games?

God what a horrible ending! Horrible orchestration! Yet it can be fixed and there is time enough to do the fixing. It's not the ending that must be, it's ending afterwards as final farewell that is horrible and should be fixed based on what you do in the game and the path you take and who you romance and why.

you're part of the problem

 

[Serus]

The latter means a specific (sub)genre

The specific subgenre you’re referring to was essentially defined by Dragon Quest 1, which is an almost perfect (in my opinion, of course) combination of Ultima-style exploration and Wizardry-style combat (another game similarly a combo of Ultima and Wizardry is Wasteland, which I feel the same level of admiration for). Basically every RPG in Japan has something in common with Dragon Quest, at some level or another. In other words, SMT and Elminage belong to the same genre as DQ.

If you truly believe that Elminage games belong to the same subgenre of crpg that, the mentioned in this thread, Chrono Trigger then i have bad news for you...

 

[Falksi]

Owlcat are bad at writing and design and they refuse to learn from their mistakes.

FTFY

 

[Serus]

The latter means a specific (sub)genre

The specific subgenre you’re referring to was essentially defined by Dragon Quest 1, which is an almost perfect (in my opinion, of course) combination of Ultima-style exploration and Wizardry-style combat (another game similarly a combo of Ultima and Wizardry is Wasteland, which I feel the same level of admiration for). Basically every RPG in Japan has something in common with Dragon Quest, at some level or another. In other words, SMT and Elminage belong to the same genre as DQ.

They are just trying to cope to not get caught liking a filthy JRPG from that problematic island in the pacific with an homogenous population. Can you imagine liking a sub-genre without constant woke talking points? SMT alone perfected the Wizardry 4 formula.

Are those "they" the same ones that the main character of John Carpenter's In the mouth of madness mentions? When he is in a cell in an asylum? You are disturbed if you think "woke" is wanted on the Dex. Even the few woke folks we have don't seem the actually like it just don't mind. As to all the rest, have you even read any threads here about games made in the last decade. Especially the Pathfinders.

As to classifications. Chrono Trigger, mentioned here, imo had bad gameplay but the one original part was the story, namely time travel which is very rarely portrayed in crpgs. Maybe it is a more popular trope in jrpgs, I wouldn't know. Same with FF6, another one of the few jrpgs i played. And again bad gameplay but some interesting story and settings elements. Otoh, Elminages, i can't even remember any "story" despite playing those a few years ago. The gameplay however was engaging and very different.

Compare. A group of characters rolled at the start, classes that can be changed, without any backgrounds. Character building s important. Exploring and navigating maze-like dungeons. Fighting in 1st person as a "blob", with only basic story.
VS.
Several premade characters with (deep and engaging and obligatory tragic, lol) stories and specific "unique powers". Stories that along the main story make the one the main appeal of the game. Those characters level in a premade fashion. Both combat and explorations is in a... perspective that isn't a 1st person blobber. Those elements just part of the game instead of the whole of it. I probably forgot some more.

If those two types of games belong to the same subgenre then there is no sense to make any division of crpgs in smaller groups at all. Just mix: action rpgs, tactical rpgs, blobbers, dungeon crawlers, rogulikes, storydriven crpggs, etc... into one. Disco Elysium is the same as Jagged Alliance 2 is the the same as Skyrim is the same as Eye of the Beholder 2 is the same as Icewind Dale 2 is the same as QfG4. They are the exact same type of games, there is no point of making any sub-divisions to be able to compare games that are comparable. To be able to make threads where people are supposed to talk about some games and not the others, etc...
Sorry there is one division that apparently makes sense, crpgs made in Japan vs everything else.

 

[NJClaw]

mandatory cringe companions

Wait, companions are mandatory?! Nobody told me and I've been playing the game with custom companions all this time... is there something I can do to fix this?

 

[Serus]

mandatory cringe companions

Wait, companions are mandatory?! Nobody told me and I've been playing the game with custom companions all this time... is there something I can do to fix this?

You talk Kingmaker? You can play it with custom ones but it cuts you from some content* and you still need the "cringy" ones for the kingdom management mini-game. Unless, possibly, you put that on auto - but then you loose some other content. But thanks god, you mostly can play with custom ones.

*Some companion specific quests and their rewards IIRC. And no, I don't mean dialogues and romances.

 

[NJClaw]

You can but it cuts you from some content*

*Some companion specific quests and their rewards IIRC. And no, I don't mean dialogues and romances.

Companions' quest offer nothing worthwhile in terms of combat (apart from exactly two encounters with the Kineticists and Octavia/Regongar). The only reason to experience that content is if you enjoy the companions' writing and want to discover more about them. The loot you get from those quests gets lost in the myriad of items the game throws at you, and the other rewards are stats improvement for those companions, so no reason to care about them if you use custom characters.

you still need them for the kingdom management mini-game. Unless, possibly, you put that on auto - but then you loose some other content.

Using them for the kingdom management minigame doesn't mean that you have to bring them along for the actual game. You can just treat them as NPCs on the background. This makes them mandatory companions just as much as the guy who bothers you with problems to solve in the de'Arnise keep.

 

[Serus]

I mostly agree with you NJClaw. You CAN play with custom characters and things you miss aren't crucial. However there are more of those small ones. Another one is missing the boni from companions having special abilities during rest. Contrary to bad writing those are gameplay elements, even if they are relatively unimportant.
Imo it would be much better if Owlcat made it so custom characters have generic camp abilities for each class, possibly one generic quest per class and ability to create the party at the start of the game. The last part would even make more sense story wise, it would mean you already have some small retinue, which would make sense for a candidate to be a ruler as opposed to some hobo from nowhere.

 

[LannTheStupid]

Imo it would be much better if Owlcat made it so custom characters have generic camp abilities for each class, possibly one generic quest per class and ability to create the party at the start of the game. The last part would even make more sense story wise, it would mean you already have some small retinue, which would make sense for a candidate to be a ruler as opposed to some hobo from nowhere.

This would have been massively stupid, because people should pay for their brain damage. If one does not want to hear Jubilost, one has no right to decreased camping time. If one does not care about Ekundayo travails and tribulations, one has to carry full rations in dungeons, and so on.

Refusal of any part of the content should make the game not only worse (in a sense that a player does not consume what he has already paid for), but harder to play. The price of stupidity is too low these days; at least good games should (partially) reinstate it.

 

[Gargaune]

Refusal of any part of the content should make the game not only worse (in a sense that a player does not consume what he has already paid for), but harder to play.

"You WILL blow Regongar and like it, motherfucker!"

Imo it would be much better if Owlcat made it so custom characters have generic camp abilities for each class, possibly one generic quest per class and ability to create the party at the start of the game

You could link that to some sort of chargen background feature, but it's not that big a deal, really. You can always consider min-maxing a custom companion as a tradeoff for the camp benefits. My only gripe is how expensive Kingmaker's custom companions get, you're best off clenching your asscheeks and not levelling in the beginning, until you get to recruit a full backup party and keeping XP sharing on.

 

[ArchAngel]

I mostly agree with you NJClaw. You CAN play with custom characters and things you miss aren't crucial. However there are more of those small ones. Another one is missing the boni from companions having special abilities during rest. Contrary to bad writing those are gameplay elements, even if they are relatively unimportant.
Imo it would be much better if Owlcat made it so custom characters have generic camp abilities for each class, possibly one generic quest per class and ability to create the party at the start of the game. The last part would even make more sense story wise, it would mean you already have some small retinue, which would make sense for a candidate to be a ruler as opposed to some hobo from nowhere.

None of those bonuses matter. I have also done a full custom run and I would take one of the companions in my party go do their quest, mostly for XP so my customs can level up faster.

 

[ikarinokami]

Ending sucked because you Romance (man horrible writing) the Queen and then decide for the Greater Good to throw you self into the Wound shutting it forever. That's it. Afterwards you can help Areelu a bit and then it's the end your remembered as some idiot.

There is no coming back to to be with the one you fall in love with etc. It was bad after playing for 300 hours.

Now I am out.

Stay away from the Demonic Vaccine it's a bio weapon that will harm your body. Doesn't stop a virus or defend you against a virus.
You have a 100 trillion virus's in your body already.

Well you don't have to do that ending, you can romance the queen, save the queen, and then ascend with the queen and live as god's forever. you can also choose to say f it, not my problem and leave it open.