Is KoToR worth playing?

[Brayko]

If you really like Star Wars go for it but I really couldn't recommend it otherwise.

 

[Tommy Wiseau]

I thought it was pretty good at the time. Think I should replay it sometime to see how it holds up.

 

[Orma]

Definitely.

You must play it if you are a Star Wars fan.

 

[Comrade Goby]

KOTOR and KOTOR 2 are 2 of the best rpg's I've played

But I'm also a huge Star Wars nerd so there is that caveat

 

[Deleted member 7219]

KOTOR is very good. The story isn't very original and the writing is nothing like as good as KOTOR2's, but for Bioware standards, it is very good. Bioware don't do analysis very well, they're more like George Lucas or Steven Spielberg - they just put stuff on screen, and they do it well. Having said that, some of the characters are more than one-dimensional Biobots. The characters I liked the most were the 'grey' characters, the ones who didn't really fit light or dark, like Canderous and Jolee. The conversations with those two were well done.

There's some nice choices towards the end of the game where you get to kill off several party members. That's something Bioware have always done well - being able to massacre the people you really don't like. There's also extra options available if you're a male and romanced Bastila, or a female and romanced Carth. Don't let 'romance' put you off, romance in this game isn't like the Gaider romance in the Dragon Age games. There's not much to it other than talking, and following the romance paths simply means you get to kill or redeem them as you see fit. I liked having those options.

It is also important to point out that if you don't play KOTOR 1, you won't understand KOTOR 2 at all, and anyone who likes RPGs owes it to themselves to play KOTOR 2.

 

[tuluse]

It is also important to point out that if you don't play KOTOR 1, you won't understand KOTOR 2 at all, and anyone who likes RPGs owes it to themselves to play KOTOR 2.

That's not true at all.

 

[Deleted member 7219]

It is also important to point out that if you don't play KOTOR 1, you won't understand KOTOR 2 at all, and anyone who likes RPGs owes it to themselves to play KOTOR 2.

That's not true at all.

It is true. You won't understand the Mandalorian Wars - probably the most important thing that happened before KOTOR 2. You won't understand the Jedi Civil War. You won't understand Revan.

 

[Rahdulan]

KOTOR is very good. The story isn't very original and the writing is nothing like as good as KOTOR2's, but for Bioware standards, it is very good. Bioware don't do analysis very well, they're more like George Lucas or Steven Spielberg - they just put stuff on screen, and they do it well. Having said that, some of the characters are more than one-dimensional Biobots. The characters I liked the most were the 'grey' characters, the ones who didn't really fit light or dark, like Canderous and Jolee. The conversations with those two were well done.

There's some nice choices towards the end of the game where you get to kill off several party members. That's something Bioware have always done well - being able to massacre the people you really don't like. There's also extra options available if you're a male and romanced Bastila, or a female and romanced Carth. Don't let 'romance' put you off, romance in this game isn't like the Gaider romance in the Dragon Age games. There's not much to it other than talking, and following the romance paths simply means you get to kill or redeem them as you see fit. I liked having those options.

It is also important to point out that if you don't play KOTOR 1, you won't understand KOTOR 2 at all, and anyone who likes RPGs owes it to themselves to play KOTOR 2.

I've been replaying K1 recently and DAMN is Carth annoying, so much so that it makes me wonder whether I really was that stupid back when I first played the game and totally missed it or if I repressed my memories of him as a character. Trust issues and angst about family are shoehorned into literally every discussion you have with him. But then again I guess this is Bioware we're talking about and they never were big on subtlety or ambiguity unless it was accidental.

 

[Deleted member 7219]

KOTOR is very good. The story isn't very original and the writing is nothing like as good as KOTOR2's, but for Bioware standards, it is very good. Bioware don't do analysis very well, they're more like George Lucas or Steven Spielberg - they just put stuff on screen, and they do it well. Having said that, some of the characters are more than one-dimensional Biobots. The characters I liked the most were the 'grey' characters, the ones who didn't really fit light or dark, like Canderous and Jolee. The conversations with those two were well done.

There's some nice choices towards the end of the game where you get to kill off several party members. That's something Bioware have always done well - being able to massacre the people you really don't like. There's also extra options available if you're a male and romanced Bastila, or a female and romanced Carth. Don't let 'romance' put you off, romance in this game isn't like the Gaider romance in the Dragon Age games. There's not much to it other than talking, and following the romance paths simply means you get to kill or redeem them as you see fit. I liked having those options.

It is also important to point out that if you don't play KOTOR 1, you won't understand KOTOR 2 at all, and anyone who likes RPGs owes it to themselves to play KOTOR 2.

I've been replaying K1 recently and DAMN is Carth annoying, so much so that it makes me wonder whether I really was that stupid back when I first played the game and totally missed it or if I repressed my memories of him as a character. Trust issues and angst about family are shoehorned into literally every discussion you have with him. But then again I guess this is Bioware we're talking about and they never were big on subtlety or ambiguity unless it was accidental.

The option you get at the end of the game as a dark side female concerning Carth is one of the most satisfying I've had in a Bioware game.

 

[mediocrepoet]

Carth's still not half as bad as Aerie...

 

[Carrion]

Carth's still not half as bad as Aerie...

You can just slaughter the damn ogre in the circus. You can't escape Carth's bitching and whining.

 

[mediocrepoet]

Carth's still not half as bad as Aerie...

You can just slaughter the damn ogre in the circus. You can't escape Carth's bitching and whining.

True, I suppose even if you want to have a good playthrough you can just not take her or put her in a position to get gibbed. Carth doesn't actually bug me all that much but I can see how having him forced on you from the beginning sucks if you hate him. You can just not take him with you once you get Mission and Zaalbar though.

 

[tuluse]

Mission is really annoying too.

 

[Orma]

Mission is really annoying too.

Not nearly as Carth. I actually liked her.

 

[Rahdulan]

Mission is really annoying too.

Not nearly as Carth. I actually liked her.

I think my problem with K1 characters is that they're overall pretty much one-note in how they're presented. Going back to Carth, yes, there's the matter of his dead family and traitorous mentor, but the problem is that that's ALL Carth is. There is no real character under that angsty reaction to his backstory, even if you if take into account the mission about his missing son because it still goes back Carth's old issues. Fact that he and Bastilla are the two most important characters in the game and are both forced on you at one point certainly doesn't help it, at least not for me.

 

[sea]

Jolee was the only character who felt like he had multiple dimensions. Jolee's backstory is interesting and important to his character, but it doesn't completely define him either (and takes work to learn about), plus he feels like he is logically integrated into the game world (due to some of the people he knows around the planets you visit).

The rest are completely two-dimensional, in that Canderous is an "honor and glory" Klingon warrior, Carth is an emo, Bastila is a cute elf slave girl love interest, Mission is the plucky young kid, etc. Stereotypes aren't bad, granted, but they play to them so closely that they don't feel like real people at all.

Every time I think back on KotOR I have sort of these warm, fuzzy feelings... until I remember all the fucking boring endless corridors packed with filler combat, the complete lack of any interesting quests, the horrible intro on Taris, the stupid underwater section on Manaan, the boring Wookie planet with its over-scripted main questline, the comically quaint Sith Academy, etc. About the only decent part of that game in retrospect is Tatooine, because at least that felt like exploring a Star Wars world to me.

Typical BioWare, I guess. "Oh, I remember that game, that game was cool... wait, no I can't remember anything especially good about it after all."

 

[Deleted member 7219]

the boring Wookie planet with its over-scripted main questline, the comically quaint Sith Academy, etc. About the only decent part of that game in retrospect is Tatooine, because at least that felt like exploring a Star Wars world to me.

I definitely agree with you about Tatooine. It is probably the only planet I still enjoy coming back to in each subsequent playthrough (I'm aiming to complete KOTOR the requisite 7 times, or whatever it is). The desert areas are beautifully made. I disagree with you about Kashyyyk and Korriban, though. Both of those areas are quite rich in C&Cs. What you do with the wookiees and Czerka, and what happens in the Academy, all depends on what decisions you take and, in the case of Korriban, there are extra options if you decide to do it last (which you should, since Bastila can't go there anyway).

 

[Orma]

sea is kind of right, all of them were pretty shallow.

 

[sea]

I definitely agree with you about Tatooine. It is probably the only planet I still enjoy coming back to in each subsequent playthrough (I'm aiming to complete KOTOR the requisite 7 times, or whatever it is). The desert areas are beautifully made. I disagree with you about Kashyyyk and Korriban, though. Both of those areas are quite rich in C&Cs. What you do with the wookiees and Czerka, and what happens in the Academy, all depends on what decisions you take and, in the case of Korriban, there are extra options if you decide to do it last (which you should, since Bastila can't go there anyway).

I should clarify.

Korriban was a cool environment and the C&C was actually really well done (I liked how you could side with different instructors and pit them against each other in various ways, there must be like 5ish possible outcomes), however, the idea of the Sith Academy itself was pretty dumb in my opinion. The idea of the Sith as a huge powerful organization with outright training schools for their warriors fit the story, but it just did not sit right for me given the traditional portrayal of the Sith as master manipulators and only a handful of them at any one time. The idea of an "evil mastermind school" is just comical. If they had instead integrated the officer training, grunt soldiers, etc. into it and had them in far greater numbers, it would have made more sense.

Kashyyyk did have two possible outcomes based on who you sided with, however there are very few side-quests and the progression through the areas themselves is very, very linear from what I remember. It's basically just a dash from point A to B to C, with almost no exploration along the way - which is the opposite of Tatooine, with its spaceport town and large open desert areas with lots of little side quests and random encounters. The side quests it does have are things it places right in your main path and are impossible to miss.

 

[wwsd]

Korriban has brilliant C&C in KOTOR1, with lots of different choices... all of which result in you being forced to kill all the Academy inhabitants anyway.

 

[tuluse]

A sith school in general doesn't make sense. Even if you had a large number of Sith operating in the open they wouldn't have one. They're not interested in spreading their philosophy. They're just interested in power and control. It makes sense for a master Sith to have an apprentice because he can't do everything, but why would he share his knowledge and power with random strangers? Further more specifically strangers who are hell bent on acquiring as much power as possible and would kill him given 1/2 a chance and anything to gain from it?

It would have been better set up as something like Sith hermets living out in the wilderness that you have to seek out and convince them to teach you. Also spread it over all the other planets and just cut Koriban out, or have Koriban as just a really small area were you find the most powerful of the Sith masters.

Of course this would have destroyed most of the more interesting stuff Bioware made.

 

[Deleted member 7219]

Korriban has brilliant C&C in KOTOR1, with lots of different choices... all of which result in you being forced to kill all the Academy inhabitants anyway.

Yeah well it was Bioware C&Cs. Yeah you have a lot of 'choice', but it all ends the same way. Would have been nice to have been able to leave Korriban without having killed anyone, or at least without having killed all the students after the showdown with Uthar Wynn.

 

[Roguey]

Korriban has brilliant C&C in KOTOR1, with lots of different choices... all of which result in you being forced to kill all the Academy inhabitants anyway.

If you side with Uthar without doublecrossing him or side with Yuthura but don't convert her to the light side then the Academy students won't attack you on your way back.

 

[Deleted member 7219]

Korriban has brilliant C&C in KOTOR1, with lots of different choices... all of which result in you being forced to kill all the Academy inhabitants anyway.

If you side with Uthar without doublecrossing him or side with Yuthura but don't convert her to the light side then the Academy students won't attack you on your way back.

I seem to remember one of them saying, "Oh yeah, you'll have to kill all the students anyway". Can't remember who said it. Usually on dark-side playthroughs I kill them both because of how weak they are.

 

[Azrael the cat]

Those sections suck ass and often work against the game

That's your opinion. I liked these sections because, first of all, they gave screen-time to party members other than the Exile, provided variety in gameplay, and made the game more challenging, because obviously the Exile is going to be the strongest character with all the best items and buffs. They also gave a feeling that, while the Exile is the fulcrum around which revolves the plot and storyline of this game, his allies aren't mindless drones that stand in the corner when they aren't needed, and are capable of making decisions and actions of their own. This is one of the things that made Nar Shaddaa my favorite planet.

You get to control characters that aren't even in your party and might as well be your enemies

Huh? No you don't. We get to control Mira before she officially joins the party, but at that point it's pretty clear her interests coincide with that of the Exile - she went to confront Goto's right hand crime boss to keep him from snatching the Exile for himself, despite being a bounty hunter who's supposed to be hunting for the Exile. There's the short section with the protocol droid on Telos - but he was programmed to do something specific, plus the section was hilarious. And... that's about it. What exactly are you referring to?

You also get your ship full of companions that you don't need and don't really even have enough time to use before the game is over

Replay factor.

I'm not sure what Obsidian were thinking.

Making a good and intelligent sequel to a dumbass Biowhore game out of a crappy engine and a ridiculous setting in 12 months time?

They work well later in the game when the NPCs can start getting slaughtered Torment-style depending on your influence and whether you've trained them as jedi (e.g. the Atton v Darth Sion fight, Handmaiden v Darth Treya).