DamnedRegistrations said:
Can you guys give some concrete examples of verisimilitude breaking stuff in japanese games? Preferably ones mentioned here as being good, instead of going back to the 3D FF games for the fiftieth time that everyone agrees is shit anyways? A self coherent unique world is what generally draws me into jrpgs I like. I can't recall any moment in Chrono Trigger, for example, where I thought: 'Wtf, that makes no sense at all in this world.' The worst offenders are probably a few jrpg staples like being free to ransack chests in people's houses (Plenty just tell you to take whatever you need anyways though, implying everyone is complicit) and characters sudden inability to do things like climb over knee high barriers to facilitate some puzzle gameplay.
These things don't strike me as being any more fucked up than, for example, the total inability to you a raise dead spell on any plot relevant character in a DnD setting, or stupidness of random encounters and the logistics they imply present in either kind of game.
You want me to give a fully detailed list of any games whose gameplay is reduced to shambles because of inconsistent approach to its game-world. Tough call, my brother. For two reasons.
1) I have never stated that lack of consistent world is downright gamebreaking. It may be (as per 3D FFs). I did assert, however, that botched setting and art design prevents best jap games from ever reaching the levels of their best western counterparts (as approved by Codex's gods
).
2) There is also declined Codex's favourite meme: "its good for what it is". No matter how hard I will try to prove that such and such game is shit because of moronic setting, you will fallback to tired old argument: "yeah the setting's fucked but none of what you mentioned is gamebreaking and I see no way the things you point out break gameplay. Your arguments are moot so LOLOLOL you stupid faggit." You can't fight human nature where your convictions are at stake
I have been around Codex for too long not to know how it might end up
Nonetheless, I will attempt to illustrate my first point by scrutinizing one of the best jRPGs there are and my personal favourite in this category.
Chrono Trigger. Surprise, surprise. Admittedly a fine specimen of a good game design out there. If I remember correctly, it has around 16 possible endings. Many options, many secrets. Very high replayability value. Nice visuals (as anime visuals go), clunky but creative battle system (joining up attacks into a combo). Some great c&c out there. Honestly, had jRpgs gone this path instead of FF7, the
might have never hit us so severly. It is a mighty good game... when you are 9-16 (max). For when you are older the good 'ol "it's good for what it is" hits the fan.
The art style in CT, the game-world, the characters are not designed to cater for more mature audiences. That's fair enough. The assumed mode befits a fairy-tale with a twist in it. I have nothing against my 11 old cousin playing and enjoying it. I also respect people who come here and highlight the CT's strong point for they are strong indeed. However, I will call any person over 18 who considers this to be sophisticated - a kidult.
Please compare this to Betrayal at Krondor, Dark Forces I or Discworld (games I played at about that age) and tell me with a straight face they are equal in terms of setting credibility.
One could argue that the things that made CT so great can be transplanted into a superb jap game with believeable characters and consistent universe dealing from more mature issues as a nice bonus. Yes!! By all means! This is exactly what I've been waiting for! A fine contender beating the shit out of not only Final Atrocities but also some of Codex approved games. I want that! (Sengoku Rance... you were so fucking close [hentai])
But you just know it's not gonna happen (Perhaps in some way it already happened - Planescape:Torment).
... but my objection was very limited and specific all along, so its significance is limited.
