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So I ended up YouTubing RE:Chain Of Memories and I fucking loved it. It was riveting. Was on the edge of my seat the whole time. I understand now why people say it's easily the best-written of all the Kingdom Hearts stories, and it was a nice surprise to see the Organization members presented as actually interesting individuals instead of just clowns who look out of place.
It was a really sweet story and I'm glad I decided to YouTube it instead of trying to play the game as I can now finally move on to KH2, something I've been anticipating quite a lot. I want to say that I don't think RE:Chain of Memories' gameplay is bad, It's just not something I want to play right now, and the prospect of trudging through world after world while wishing it was over with so I could get to KH2 just became oppressive and I just decided to just YouTube it instead.
The core gameplay seems quite well thought-out but the game itself just didn't have what I enjoy doing in the KH games I've played; KH games were more than the sum of their parts with jumping, exploration, puzzles, action combat, story, gimmicks exclusive to each world, etc... but RECOM offers only some very specific things to the exclusion of others. Maybe I'll come back to it and learn to play it fully someday, once I've gotten all the Kingdom Hearts out of my system, give the game its due, but for right now I'm real glad I YouTubed it and can go on to KH2.
in all fairness I just hate card battle systems so I hate having to go through CoM every time I feel the urge to replay KH but I'm too stubborn to just YT a story myself. Least you're ready for KH2 tho, enjoy!
in all fairness I just hate card battle systems so I hate having to go through CoM every time I feel the urge to replay KH but I'm too stubborn to just YT a story myself. Least you're ready for KH2 tho, enjoy!
Am just about to launch KH2, but meanwhile I was ruminating over some stuff I learned from playing through KH1 and finishing it for the first time. Last time was 16 years ago and I only played up to about Agrabah before dropping it (though tbf I think it was because it was rented).
I dunno, as a younger person I just wasn't ready to accept the power of the KINGDOM HEARTS into my HEART!
It always just seemed childish and nonsensical and with "shitty action combat", but now I am so glad that as an adult I ended up giving the KH series a real try because I've grown to really enjoy these games and have found a whole new appreciation for their charm and their aesthetic, and even an appreciation for their story and characters (especially the characters). I dare say it's made me reconsider my opinion on Tetsuya Nomura too, someone I despised before because I associated him with the downfall of Square games and of their quality, but frankly speaking Kingdom Hearts series is fucking great. I used to think "oh no Nomura's gonna inject more Kingdom Hearts nonsense into each new Square game/remake", but now I think "fuck yes inject some of that awesome Kingdom Hearts gameplay into it please!".
Anyway some random musings:
- KH1 was all classic Disney and was a very straightfoward story. I really appreciated that and It really gives the series an indelible character and personality that has stayed with it.
- KH1 combat was, to my surprise, VERY enjoyable. Everyone described it as clunky or slow but I found it very fun, and I liked the slow and even sometimes slightly methodical approach, I like how grounded it felt and how each keyblade swing felt weighty. That said I am definitely ready for it to get flashier and faster now after having beat it, bring on the combat improvements.
- Related to the combat but also to the overall design of each area and boss: KH1 was fucking hard. I was definitely not expecting this going in and now I fully understand why people say the series has gotten too easy. Don't get me wrong though, I found KH1 was unnecessarily punishing at times and I am ready for a more gracious and forgiving experience, I do *not* wish the other games were like KH1, however I can still appreciate the difficulty spikes and boss encounters in KH1.
The final area Boss Gauntlet at the end of KH1 was fucking maddening I must have died around 10 times before finally squeaking out a win. I even briefly considered just using Cheat Engine to mop up the final form but I just bulled through and beat it. It did not feel satisfying though. It felt badly designed, frustrating, and I'm glad the future games moved away from dumb shit like this.
***Also the first boss in Wonderland filtered me quite a few times, lol.
Some musings about KH story and concepts:
- KH1 was classic Disney but after watching RE:Chain Of Memories (and watching the secret endings to KH1 on YouTube which I of course did not get because I didn't 100% it) you can obviously spot when Nomura started changing towards a more Shonen Jump anime style of storytelling, and you know what I'm here for it.
- Also LOVED the early-2000's EDGINESS of the Secret Endings for KH1. HELL YES.
- RECOM barely features any Disney material and is basically wholly original and it was very well written (for what it is).
- I now finally understand some of the core concepts: I understand what Nobodies are, and why Twilight Town is called Twilight Town... it exists in the twilight between Light and Dark, the two opposing powers that make up the Heart of people. That's why Nobodies are drawn to Twilight Town.
- RECOM showed non-Disney human characters "killing" each other for the first time in anime-style duels. This is also mostly why earlier I said RECOM introduced a shift towards more "Shonen Jump"-style of action, it literally felt like I was watching a 3 hour episode of some good shounen anime which just happened to be telling a mystery arc at that time. I dunno hard to explain.
- The Organization's uniforms also got an admittedly-sensible explanation.
It's interesting now, in hindsight, how the series has managed to straddle the line between action-anime and Disney content. Oh well, anyway, on to KH2 now.
BTW, seems like Nomura may be a Dickens fan... maybe:
“That was a memorable day to me, for it made great changes in me. But it is the same with any life. Imagine one selected day struck out of it, and think how different its course would have been. Pause you who read this, and think for a moment of the long chain of iron or gold, of thorns or flowers, that would never have bound you, but for the formation of the first link on one memorable day.”
The specter of Jacob Marley entered Scrooge’s room. It had been seven years to the day since Marley died.
Before he sees them, Scrooge hears the clanking of the heavy chains his old business partner now carries with him.
Scrooge asks how it is that Marley became thus fettered.
“I wear the chain I forge in life,” replied the Ghost. “I made it link by link, and yard by yard; I girded it on of my own free-will, and of my own free-will I wore it.”
Maybe it's a stretch but the RECOM chars make a direct reference to how memories form a chain that bind us, something Dickens liked to wax philosophical about a lot in a very similar manner.
Camera no longer auto-centers itself when you move it up or down and start walking (!!!), plus I love that it finally has a pivot-based camera where if you move it upwards you get a pseudo-overhead view, and if you bring it down it will start going under characters, like a pivot swinging up and down. This is my favorite and preferred kind of third-person camera.
Movement is also tighter and also, surprisingly, much better than the floaty movement in KH 3. Anyway, this has got to be one of the most beautiful looking PS2 games ever (obviously I'm playing the remaster but it's still a PS2 game). It really cleans up well and the character geometry is excellent. I also suspect one of the reasons they made Roxas not wear gloves is because they were showing off that they could do fingers.
Oh, another KEY addition to KH2 is that now you can freely move the camera during Keyblade attacks, something which cannot be done in KH1. Seriously, if you haven't played it in a while go and check it out, in KH1 the camera is locked during the moments of a Keyblade swing, it cannot be moved. However in KH2 you can now freely move it around during a Keyblade swing and I think this probably has a lot to do with why so many people immediately feel KH2 combat "flows better". It's something some people might never even notice.
Personally I remap the controls and use Right Trigger for attacking (trigger-stop lock on my 3rd-party controller makes this feasible, though if I didn't have that I'd just use Right Bumper). Since I always have free use of the right analog stick while mashing the Attack button I immediately noticed in KH1 that the camera became locked during Keyblade swing animations and found it very off-putting though I quickly got used to it.
KH1 can either be really fucking hard or casual if you neglect what you put your starting stats in, easy modo is buffing magic while whatthefuckareyoudoingmode is nerfing defense. Strength is not worth it while buffing magic is worthless in KH2 with the way magic works past the first game.
yea i'm kinda retarded because i typically play KH1 and 2 on critical mode while taking STR and leaving DEF in the intros. somehow i manage, early game is a bitch but by mid to late game it's a lot easier
KH1 can either be really fucking hard or casual if you neglect what you put your starting stats in, easy modo is buffing magic while whatthefuckareyoudoingmode is nerfing defense. Strength is not worth it while buffing magic is worthless in KH2 with the way magic works past the first game.
lol yeah i went full Sword/STR, i foolishly kept thinking maximizing STR would serve me better. Also, after reading some material on KH1 (guides, forum posts, etc), it seems I actually missed out on one of the game's best abilities, the 3rd level magic spell of Aeroga which gives you an offensive 'wind tackle' ability.
Anyway playing KH2 now in full and my god, it is ORGASMIC. Camera feels buttery-smooth, I love the pivot-based camera, I love that the FOV is also wider for the game, the movement physics let you start and stop Sora on a fucking dime that's how good they feel. Clearing up enemies is just a joy. If I have one complaint so far it's simply that the situation commands flash by too quickly sometimes, something a little flashier like in KH3 would've been better, in KH3 they also let you know that situation commands are building up too though that wouldn't really have much to do with what I'm referring to since the ones that 'flash by too quickly' for me are all contextuals one that you wouldn't be able to build up towards.
Oh and drive forms are very cool but I think I can understand, design-wise, why they decided to move away from these (at least I can't remember any in KH3 or the little bit of DDD that I played). They kind of rail-road combat options a little too much, though I'm still in the beginning portions of kh2 so I'll hold off on opining more until I got more of the game done.
EDIT: Yes I know Sora has Rage Form in KH3 but it's not really comparable. Not the same concept.
The keyblade-specific transformations from KH3 are pretty much the closest to what drive forms were in KH2. Rage form is a whole separate thing which actually...well, you'll see
Bruh. Why doesn't anyone bring up how fucking GODLIKE Kingdom Hearts combat can be? This shit is dope. Fun fun fun. Sure it ain't as complex as a Platinum game or whatever the fuck but this shit is way above most other games that pretend to have good action combat.
It depends on if you're in the mood for flashy anime combat or not, I'm not really the target audience for this kind of game. I like Bayonetta, not especially anything else from Platinum.
Bruh. Why doesn't anyone bring up how fucking GODLIKE Kingdom Hearts combat can be? This shit is dope. Fun fun fun. Sure it ain't as complex as a Platinum game or whatever the fuck but this shit is way above most other games that pretend to have good action combat.
Although KH2 gameplay is objectively better than KH1, Unknown and Sephiroth from KH1 are still my favourite boss battles throughout the series. Also, to me, the clunkiness of KH1 controls really add to the gameplay immersion.
Although KH2 gameplay is objectively better than KH1, Unknown and Sephiroth from KH1 are still my favourite boss battles throughout the series. Also, to me, the clunkiness of KH1 controls really add to the gameplay immersion.
What's great about KH1's combat is its encounter design. The game teaches you gradually how to play and uses its to its fullest in its best battles. The usage of additional tech points for successful blocking/ reflectingand thus geting better is imo one of the best motivators I've seen in an action game.
That's why KH2 felt disappointing for me first minute, because blocking became useless and any learning curve was non-existant, replaced with pure flashiness. I got into it with time and the game makes excellent use of its battle system towards the end, but yeah.
The way KH1 teaches and utilizes its combat system is near unmatched imo. Even if it is simple and can be clunky.
Yeah judging by what I've played of KH2, and that first half of KH3 I played before pausing it, it seems like KH1 is the only game with a proper power curve where you slowly get new abilities and the game slowly introduces obstacles for you to overcome with said abilities.
I'm actually finding KH2 very similar to KH3, which is to say that I'm surprised how much like KH2 they made KH3. Lack of real power curve and all. Also I find myself really missing that "puzzle-ish" feeling that rooms had in KH1 where you'd enter somewhere and the first order of business was needing to figure out 1) how to most efficiently get all treasure chests and collectibles while, 2) finding the correct order of room navigation to progress.
Surprisingly KH2 has had very little of that feeling, it's (like KH3) fairly straightfoward at all times in how you progress or get treasures, with the occasional floating puzzle piece floating too high to reach.
Mind you I'm not saying KH1 was some sort of labyrinthine experience or that it had actual puzzles or anything, it had neither of those things, but it felt like it had an taste of that and could sometimes really make you stop in your tracks and at least think about how to do something (usually how to do a jump). This actually mattered because of the game's difficulty, it made upgrades worth getting so you actually did care about getting all of the chests, but so far I've never had that feeling replicated during KH2 (or the half of KH3 I played).
Of course that doesn't mean I'm not enjoying KH2, far from it I'm fucking LOVING it. It's incredibly fun to play at every moment. Just trying to pin down how it differs from KH1, and also wanted to express my surprise at how much like KH3 it is, or rather how much they made KH3 like KH2. It's a good thing they did too, imagine if they tried inserting "modern design" into KH3? Oh god, could've been a huge catastrophe. Better to stick with PS2-era design ideas when gameplay was better than it is now.
EDIT: Also there is already the introduction of "too much crap you can rely on" syndrome already present in KH2 what with the Summons, the Drive Forms and the Party Attacks, plus random Reaction Commands that do a ton of damage.
Personally speaking... I think I would've cut out the party attacks and instead made them buffs or extra abilities that a Guest character provides instead, and cut out all the Reaction stuff.
Was gonna write a whole thing but too lazy now... basically:
I don't think KH2 is that good, tbh. Kingdom Hearts 1 is a classic, it was an amazing game, but I find myself struggling to motivate myself to finish KH2 now that I have to re-visit every world. It has too much filler, and too many worlds have un-fun gameplay.
I also think KH2 has too many badly-designed bosses, like the mid-game battle with the Water Form guy from Organization 13 where the battle has retarded time limits and the second Port Royal boss against the coin-sucking Grim Reaper. Absolutely awful, awful fights that really soured me on my general outlook of KH2.
KH1 = Absolute top-tier classic of a game. Amazing work. Endlessly replayable.
KH2 = Great storytelling moments and very refined general combat and movement system but suffers from too many weak worlds, bad gameplay gimmicks, badly-designed bosses and too much padding and filler.
I think what I played of KH3 is much better than KH2, a huge improvement over the 2nd game's general gameplay.
A frequently used bait image about Kingdom Hearts
The games really can be great fun if one is willing to give them a chance and does not try to actively find flaws. Because if one does they can be found a plenty.
But a good action rpg, with interesting hub based levels, impactfull stats, well designed and well written characters, a strong aesthetic and in some installments good level design is a rarity.
Idk if I wrote this already, but I couldn't get warm with the COM remake at all. And I like base COM. The games are fairly important to flesh out the Org XIII, and going from KH 1 to KH2 without knowledge of it feels anticlimatic as many of the best Org members (Marluxia, Larxene) are already gibbed before you even start.
The combat was not that bad on the small screen of a GBA. Positioning did literally not matter in random encounters, since the screen was so small. Even against bosses it was secondary. The game was all about doing your card combos properly, and winning by stechen (jab, prick? how is this called in English?) your opponents cards. And that was fun.
In the remake it felt like playing a worse version of Kingdom Hearts 1 with instanced combat where the card game aspects acted more like limiters keeping you from doing cool shit, instead of being the meat and bones of the game.
That said it is certainly not worth going back for a GBA replay of COM if you know the story already. Playing as Rikku is kinda cool, since there was no game that allowed you to do that back then, but now there is Dream Drop Distance...
Chain of Memories was fun for the time and on original hardware but by now it is mostly obsolete and it's awkward importance for the narrative makes it a lot harder to get into the series. Probably a good decision to only include it as cutscenes.
Just finished the 2nd visits of Agrabah and Space Paranoids and bruh... two more knocks against KH2. Terrible gimmicks. And I still got Atlantica rhythm game to finish and 2nd visit to the (awful) Pride Lands where you play as a shitty lion cub.
Yes I know most of these are optional but if you don't do them then you literally end up with a 20 hour game, so hard to really say "it's just optional stuff bro". Besides there is no reason the optional worlds need to be bad, you know... they could've just made them good.
Anyway I don't want to make it seem like I hate KH2, I actually really enjoy playing it, just kind of surprised that it's considered the "best KH game". KH1 is easily better and it was a fantastic game experience as a whole, and what I played of KH3 is basically 'KH2 but done better'.
Drive forms are cool tho, yes... annoying to level up though. I don't really see myself replaying KH2 any time soon.
Just finished the 2nd visits of Agrabah and Space Paranoids and bruh... two more knocks against KH2. Terrible gimmicks. And I still got Atlantica rhythm game to finish and 2nd visit to the (awful) Pride Lands where you play as a shitty lion cub.
Yes I know most of these are optional but if you don't do them then you literally end up with a 20 hour game, so hard to really say "it's just optional stuff bro". Besides there is no reason the optional worlds need to be bad, you know... they could've just made them good.
Anyway I don't want to make it seem like I hate KH2, I actually really enjoy playing it, just kind of surprised that it's considered the "best KH game". KH1 is easily better and it was a fantastic game experience as a whole, and what I played of KH3 is basically 'KH2 but done better'.
Drive forms are cool tho, yes... annoying to level up though. I don't really see myself replaying KH2 any time soon.
I kinda like Space Paranoids, despite the awfull gimmick. Defending the solar sails is neat and the boss fights are all fairly high quality. Also the optics.
But yeah KH2 Agrabah and Pride Lands are so awfull.
I think about doing/starting a Kingdom Hearts worlds thread, I wonder how far opinions differ.
Probably not enough interest in the subforum tho.
My favourites in KH2 were
Which are interestingly almost all very early or deep late worlds, I think the midgame of KH2 is its weakest part. Maybe another reason why the game has a higher reputation than the quality would deserve, for most people the beginning and the ending of an artpiece make up the majority of their opinion on it. So they are usually called the most important parts.
About why KH3 was so badly received a launch, for gameplayfags the difficulty was ass. KHIII launched without its highest difficulty, and on proud it just does not offer enough of a challenge to keep one interested. I died once on my first run on proud, against the final boss, and I was saved by a stupid kupo coin I bought in Rapunzel's world lol.
For storyfags I don't want to spoil any details, but it is a common sentiment that the ending does not give enough closure.
About why KH3 was so badly received a launch, for gameplayfags the difficulty was ass. KHIII launched without its highest difficulty, and on proud it just does not offer enough of a challenge to keep one interested. I died once on my first run on proud, against the final boss, and I was saved by a stupid kupo coin I bought in Rapunzel's world lol.
For storyfags I don't want to spoil any details, but it is a common sentiment that the ending does not give enough closure.
Yeah when I make my way back up to KH3 I'm still not decided on whether or not I should re-start the game on the hardest difficulty. So far I'm thinking yes, but also I don't know how burnt out i'll be on KH gameplay by then as I still have at minimum 2 more games to go in-between (BBS and DDD), assuming I decide to watch the movies for 358 and Re:Coded (which so far I'm thinking that's exactly I'm gonna do).
KH2 is also piss-easy though so I really don't know how SHOCKED all the so-called gameplayfags could've been with KH3, I find both of the games to be equally easy on each game's Standard mode.
KH2 is also piss-easy though so I really don't know how SHOCKED all the so-called gameplayfags could've been with KH3, I find both of the games to be equally easy on each game's Standard mode.
I think most people compared KH2FMs critical mode to KH3 proud mode. Also KH1 and KH2FM both have some beefy superbosses for whom you can delve deep into the systems, while the KH3 baseline superboss is one of the easiest in the entire series.
That said I remember KH2 on proud as a lot more dificult than KH3 on proud. I remember dying to stuff like the water guitarist in Hollow Bastion. Has been years since I played tho, maybe I just got better at vidya than as a dumb kid.
I died a shit ton of times to the Water form boss in Hollow Bastion because of the gimmicks to that fight but I don't consider that kind of thing to constitute "challenge", rather it's bad boss design.
