Sierra King's Quest series

[Jaesun]

If I recall correctly, the King's Quest series doesn't start to use MIDI until King's Quest IV? Of which they did do a remake of I using IV's engine, and added a new MIDI score to it.

Also I found an interesting suggestion for playing King's Quest I, II and III with DOSBox:

If you change dosbox.conf to set "machine=tandy" instead of "machine=vga" there will be 3 voice PCjr/Tandy music with a white noise channel.​

I actually tried this and it works great. The regular PC speaker BEEP BOOP BEEP music is at least a little more enjoyable.

I could not remember if I did actually play the 1st King's Quest game, so I'm playing it right now.

 

[Infinitron]

KQ1 SCI also has MIDI. Not sure if that came before KQ4 though.

 

[Sceptic]

KQ1 SCI came out after KQ4 (by a good 2 years I think). Hence the name actually - KQ4 was the first game to use the SCI engine, and also the first game to use the MT-32 as far as anyone can tell.

I think I've mentioned Tandy sound mode before. I don't use machine=tandy, I use tandy=on under [speaker] (don't set it to auto, it doesn't autodetect properly), that still lets me use vga for games that for some reason support vga graphics but still used the PC speaker (there were a few around 89-90, I think A10 Tank Killer was one of them). Tandy mode is very very noticeable in some games - it makes a world of difference in Sentinel Worlds.

KQ1SCI improves on several obtuse designs of the original (including a MUCH better parser - the original was terrible) but it also makes the game a lot more linear (in KQ1 you could get the 3 artifacts in any order, not so much in SCI).

The series is fun, it's not my favourite Sierra series but there's such an amazing sense of improvement with every entry, whether technical or design-wise. 3 and 4 are really good, 6 is great, the best by far. It goes downhill after this, but even KQ8, despite being a worse KQ than FO3 was a Fallout, is actually a pretty good game in its own right.

 

[Sceptic]

Oh yeah and while we're here maybe I should list the "ideal" sound mode for every game, just so you know.
Tandy: KQ1, KQ2, KQ3
MT-32: KQ1SCI, KQ4, KQ5
SC-55: KQ6, KQ7
All-digital: KQ8

There are a few things to watch out for. KQ5 CD has a General MIDI option, but it's a (bad) conversion from the MT-32. I'm also not sure if KQ5 supports the extras from the CM-32L but I don't think so. KQ4 is definitely an MT-32/old composition. KQ6 IIRC has an MT-32 option but it's converted (badly) off the Sound Canvas.

Some of the later games (I believe 5-7) have the option to play under Windows. Don't. All of 1-7 should be played under DOS.

 

[Infinitron]

Some of the later games (I believe 5-7) have the option to play under Windows. Don't. All of 1-7 should be played under DOS.

Hehe, that's Windows 3.1. Remember "WinG"?

IIRC, KQ6 for Windows had unique dialogue portraits you only saw in that version.

 

[Sceptic]

Hehe, that's Windows 3.1. Remember "WinG"?

Yes. I still have a WinG.zip file that I had to use throughout Windows 95, 98 and ME (ha ha) to get old 3.1 games to work properly (or at all). Fun times.

IIRC, KQ6 for Windows had unique dialogue portraits you only saw in that version.

I think those were for the CD version and appeared under DOS as well? I don't remember about the KQ6 Windows version in particular, but in general the Windows versions were very buggy, KQ5 had a game-stopping bug that simply prevent you from finishing (it's like nobody ever beta-tested) and of course saves were not comptaible with DOS version. Even if the Windows versions add some improvements (like those portraits) I'd still avoid them, but maybe I'm speaking from deeply-rooted trauma :p

 

[Infinitron]

think those were for the CD version and appeared under DOS as well?

Possibly, I'm not sure. It may have appeared in some versions of the DOS CD version but not in others - I distinctly remember playing the game with speech and the old portraits. It may be related to whether or not you had text enabled alongside speech.

 

[Dehumanizer]

Oh yeah and while we're here maybe I should list the "ideal" sound mode for every game, just so you know.
Tandy: KQ1, KQ2, KQ3
MT-32: KQ1SCI, KQ4, KQ5
SC-55: KQ6, KQ7
All-digital: KQ8

Nice list; this also applies to other Sierra series, as long as you think in terms of release dates (e.g. if it was released between KQ4 and 5, pick MT-32).

I'd actually suggest running AGI and SCI games on ScummVM instead of DOSBox: it's easier to configure (though DOSBox isn't rocket science either, of course), it fixes / works around some timing bugs and such, it defaults to Tandy sound for AGI games, and it's easier to configure the ideal settings for each game just once, and having it run perfectly every time afterwards.

Also, if you can be bothered (either by emulating the machine, or extracting the disk image's contents with an utility and using ScummVM), AGI games sound best on the Apple IIGS, having some digital sound effects (e.g. in Larry 1 you hear the taxi's brakes when it stops), and even new music unique to that machine.

 

[Sceptic]

Nice list.

Thanks. If there's enough interest I could compile one for all Sierra and LucasArts adventures. I already have all the information scattered all over the place, saved for my own use, so all it'd take is just gathering it together and figuring out a good format to present it.

I don't usually use ScummVM unless there's a distinct advantage to it (like getting the mixed MT-32 and OPL mode for MI2). I'm more used to DOSBox anyway, and I find making multiple configurations a breeze even without any front-ends.

 

[Dehumanizer]

Thanks. If there's enough interest I could compile one for all Sierra and LucasArts adventures. I already have all the information scattered all over the place, saved for my own use, so all it'd take is just gathering it together and figuring out a good format to present it.

In terms of Sierra, you could perhaps shorten it to:

AGI: Tandy (or Apple IIGS if you want to work a bit more)
EGA SCI / early VGA SCI: MT-32
Late VGA SCI: General MIDI
SVGA: digital sound (but you don't have to choose, that's the only option)

I don't usually use ScummVM unless there's a distinct advantage to it (like getting the mixed MT-32 and OPL mode for MI2).

Yes, and there's a few more cases like that; for instance, in Space Quest 3 you can get MT-32 and sampled speech, a combination impossible in the original. Anyway, nothing against DOSBox, I use it a lot, but in terms of point & click adventures I tend to find that ScummVM saves work and has typically better defaults.

 

[Jaesun]

In playing Kings Quest 1 (the original) I have finally gotten to see the worst fucking game design ever done in a video game (the beanstalk).

 

[Aeschylus]

In playing Kings Quest 1 (the original) I have finally gotten to see the worst fucking game design ever done in a video game (the beanstalk).

Not the worst, man. Not the worst.

 

[Jaesun]

Never played Iceman. I liked the intro music for it (and recorded it). That's about as far as I got with it.

 

[Sceptic]

The intro music is the best part of the game, so you stopped exactly where it should.

I once (only once) decided to play fair on that chase scene at the end. It was the clunkiest arcade section Sierra ever did - and that says it all.

 

[Correct_Carlo]

In playing Kings Quest 1 (the original) I have finally gotten to see the worst fucking game design ever done in a video game (the beanstalk).

Heh. Plus, good luck getting through it without a walkthrough.

Game is punishing and often cheap. There's at least one puzzle I can think of that just requires completely random and bizarre logic to solve. Which is a staple of most Sierra games, but the latter games were at least point and click, which made the random logic somewhat easier. KQ1 is all text, so guessing its random logic is that much harder.

They actually made a couple of the puzzles less hard in the remake, if I remember correctly.

That said, KQ2 is considerably easier. I think I got through that with no walkthrough, so much that I barely remember it.

KQ3 is one of my rare, "holy shit this is awesome" moments in video gaming, though, and maybe one of my favorite games ever. Not because it's necessarily still a great game by today's standards, but more because it expanded my idea of what games were capable of doing significantly the first time I played it. I played it as a kid and all the stuff with you sneaking around behind the Wizard's back at the start was totally tense and heart pounding for me.It kind of gave me the same feeling Doom did when I first played it, and, many years later, Amnesia.

 

[Jaesun]

I basically only used a walkthrough to nudge me in the area I could go to next. The rest I figured out myself, by basically trying everything. Except for the "gnomes" name, because I already knew about that (that's basically legendary, puzzle wise).

I think I may just move on to 2. I played 4 through 6, but somehow skipped these first 3.

 

[Sceptic]

Wait so you're stuck on the beanstalk? By moving away you mean you're abandoning KQ1?

 

[Jaesun]

Wait so you're stuck on the beanstalk? By moving away you mean you're abandoning KQ1?

To be honest, early games (because they are SO ancient) objects are so fucking difficult to see. Like this:

What in the fuck is that green blob? What in the fuck is it? Of course LOOK AROUND tells you nothing. That's probably the most important object in the game.

Also the remake Sierra did of KQ1 is GLORIOUS! With the LAPC-1 environmental sounds and music and graphics are awesome (compared to the horrible blobby original). I think I'll go be a GRAPHICS WHORE and finish 1 with that version.

Though with KQ2, it seems they did finally hire an actual artist, as things do actually look much better graphics wise (as much as you can with such a small resolution). The original KQ1 graphics are just fucking terrible. It is like WHATINTHEFUCKAMILOOKINGAT the game.

 

[Siveon]

I was a bit bored, so I went and beat the remake of the Sierra remake.

http://www.agdinteractive.com/games/kq1/about/about.html

I'm not sure how it compared but it was pretty fun, grabbing the condor was a bitch though.

 

[FeelTheRads]

Hah, can't remember what that thing is. I think you can usually get descriptions of those mysterious objects by looking at other things? Like say, "look at shore" or something like that. Maybe I'm wrong, though.

 

[Duraframe300]

I was a bit bored, so I went and beat the remake of the Sierra remake.

http://www.agdinteractive.com/games/kq1/about/about.html

I'm not sure how it compared but it was pretty fun, grabbing the condor was a bitch though.

Same

Shame they stopped at 3

 

[Unkillable Cat]

Silly fact of the day: There exists an AGI version of King's Quest IV.

 

[SCO]

Everyone here knows about the AGD interactive remakes ofc.

 

[Redlands]

Everyone here knows about the AGD interactive remakes ofc.

And lest we forget: Owl's Quest!

 

[Unkillable Cat]

Everyone here knows about the AGD interactive remakes ofc.

You're gonna have to be more specific here. Are you saying that the KQ4 AGI version I mention is a "AGD interactive remake"?