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Wizardry Long Live Wizardry! (And The All-New Games By Ex-Wizardry Developers) - UPDATED: MARCH/07/2016

Discussion in 'jRPG Weeaboo Discussion' started by aweigh, Dec 25, 2015.

  1. Thac0 JRPG ambassador Patron

    Thac0
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    Etrian Odyssey is superb.
    Dungeons start of a bit weak, simple architecture and only FOE puzzles. FOEs being fat superbosses that move around in the dungeon like you, and if you encounter them you get a tough bossfight that should be unwinnable on your first time meeting them. Understanding the FOEs AI and avoiding them through clever movement is most of the dungeon maneuvering, later you can come back and farm the FOEs for tough battles and rare materials for weapons.
    Combat is not AC/Thac0 based but more generic JRPG stuff. It is really well executed tho, ailments and binds matter a lot.
    Overall the games live by the mixture of comfy atmosphere, with cooking and monster hunting for parts for weapons, and brutal dungeon crawling and difficulty.

    Where to start? There is a bit of discussion there as all games are relatively similar. To give a quick overview:
    Etrian Odyssey 1: Available in remastered (Untold) form, decent starting point with it. No real reason to play original over untold.
    Etrian Odyssey 2: Has an Untold version aswell, no real reason to start here.
    Etrian Odyssey 3: Last of the DS originated EOs. Has not had an Untold version yet. As such the most archaic of the EOs. I havn't gotten to it yet, I heard that it is quite deep however. Sometimes recommended as a starting point, I wouldn't do so since it lacks a lot of QOL changes.
    Etrian Odyssey 4: The easiest of the EOs but also the first on the 3Ds. Has a fuckton of QOL changes. Has some very interesting Might and Magic style overworld exploration mechanics, which they sadly later cut. Best starting point for casuals, as such it makes less sense for you.
    Etrian Odyssey 5: Probably the best starting point. Decent difficulty, good QOL, nothing too special about it. They introduced cooking mechanics as a new gimmick, harmless and adds to the atmosphere.
    Etrian Odyssey Nexus: Do not start here. Best of/mashup type game. Fuckload of content, as they just reused fan favourite maps from all the prior games. Also you can play by far the largest amount of classes in this one. It is however very long, and probably overstays its welcome if it is your first EO.

    TL DR: Etrian Odyssey 1 Untold for Historic Order, Etrian Odyssey 5 for best gameplay/QOL ratio, Etrian Odyssey III if you are fine with some archaism.

    I can't tell you that much about Dark Spire, but I know it is very traditional Wizardry. So EO if you feel like delving into something new, Dark Spire for the comfortable classics.
     
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  2. Matador Prophet

    Matador
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    Thanks for the detailed answer. Will try EOV.
     
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  3. connormgs Novice

    connormgs
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    I don't think I've ever seen this mapping software mentioned on the 'dex before: https://tyaya.net/graph-paper/

    Seems like a fully featured wizardry mapper with the added bonus of being able to navigate your maps in 3D as well as export them as .html for viewing anywhere. There is also a version of it with I guess just a bigger grid for Wiz V and a 600x600 grid version too.

    It's entirely in Japanese but he mentioned it was written in visual basic so I think it should be possible to decompile it and translate it to english!
     
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  4. aweigh Arcane

    aweigh
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  5. aweigh Arcane

    aweigh
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    I'd recommend Dark Spire. It's a proper dungeon crawler made explicitly in the style of Wizardry, has great art and a great aesthetic and a great musical score. The dungeons are also a highlight and easily put to shame what you'll find in something like EO or in an Exp Inc. game.

    I liked Dark Spire a lot, a great dungeon crawler that sadly got lost in the shuffle.
     
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  6. Pyreen Novice

    Pyreen
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    Do yourself a favor and play Dark Spire. It shits on any EO game aesthetically and has far better level design. It also features Wiz 5 style NPC and quest design, for better and worse.
     
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  7. Ysaye Savant

    Ysaye
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    For mine Dark Spire 9 times out of 10...and the tenth time as well probably....nice dungeon design, no hand holding, old style aesthetics, very good music, "wizardry humor" and a good (if a little basic) class system.

    If you are playing EO....depends but One (I suppose get the Untold version which adds characters and backstory; I liked both but there is an air of nostalgia with the original) feels the most like Wizardry, I know a lot of people like 3, and I sort of liked 4 for some nice (but overpowered) classes but there is just more to abuse in the later games. I didn't like 5, not sure exactly why but it just didn't feel worth the effort.
     
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  8. connormgs Novice

    connormgs
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    [​IMG]
    Does anyone else feel like Wizardry IV on the PS1 kills the difficulty a bit if you have graphics and sound on? Land of the Whirling Dervish especially because I could tell which direction I was getting spun to and that I was stepping on spinner/teleport tiles. That combined with the automap removed a lot of the difficulty that lies on top of the frustration and tedium of hoping RNG lines up for you to walk the path you need to get to your next goal.

    I had to consult a guide upon the end of Land of a Thousand Cuts due to "Have you forgotten something?" and me knowing damn well I hadn't forgotten anything but it still drove me mad (I still remembered stuff from the LP unfortunately) and at the Cosmic Cube because holy shit even with a labeled map that place is impossible to navigate but overall I think I have some wicked stockholm syndrome from this game. Playing the game really made me appreciate just how truly bullshit and evil this game's design is; I wish people could experience the dungeon design without having to slog through the bullshit that can make it hard to appreciate.

    This playthrough has me wanting to go for a Grandmaster ending on the Apple II version manually mapping; playing the game the authentic way!
     
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  9. NerevarineKing Educated

    NerevarineKing
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    When I played Wiz1 on PS1 recently, I just used the original graphics and sound. That was my compromise since I started on the DOS version, but just didn't want to deal with the UI and stat loss when leveling.


    I've been playing a bit more Elminage Gothic recently and been having a blast with the dungeons so far. The mines were a good starter dungeon, but the underground church really stepped up the complexity. I really had to check the map frequently and make detailed maps in order to make any sort of progress. However, I'm not really a huge fan of the tree dungeon so far. The upper floors were tedious to navigate, but the lower areas seem a bit more interesting so far. There has also been some pretty powerful enemies in this game so far. I remember one enemy in the tree dungeon in particular that double hit and each one had a chance of beheading one of your party members. Beheading was something you didn't even see until close to the end of Original. Overall, this game just seems much better-designed than Original and makes dungeon crawling dangerous and scary.
     
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2021
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  10. Irata Learned

    Irata
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    I just very recently finished Elminage Gothic and really enjoyed the game. I know nothing about this series' origins, but I have to say this is the first game where I fought a Santa Clause riding a giant pumpkin.

    I don't know if I'll stick around, but I also like that you can keep on playing after the end.
     
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  11. Ysaye Savant

    Ysaye
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    The main game starts after the ending.....
     
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  12. Whisper Arcane Vatnik

    Whisper
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    Any Wizardry-like games without features and looks of jrpg/anime/etc.?
     
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  13. NerevarineKing Educated

    NerevarineKing
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    Elminage Gothic and Original don't really look "anime" imo and they're both on Steam. Also, any of the fan-translated Wizardry Gaiden or Wizardry Empire games don't look "anime" either. The Dark Spire (DS) has a retro art style to it and you can even play in wireframe mode.
     
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2021
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  14. Whisper Arcane Vatnik

    Whisper
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    I was talking both about anime AND jrpg.

    Elminage Gothic is class jrpg.
     
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  15. Reinhardt Arcane

    Reinhardt
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    Infinite adventures. It's not animu and not japanese.
     
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  16. Hengki Kusuma Adi Learned

    Hengki Kusuma Adi
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    Sorry for late reply but looks good so far. BTW, I don't have time to play them because it's PS2, and still we don't have appropriate working PS2 emulator on my Android device as I'm really currently stuck without PC/Laptop gaming at the moment. (Unless Ko-Fi patronage)
     
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  17. Hengki Kusuma Adi Learned

    Hengki Kusuma Adi
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    • Nuke it from orbit Nuke it from orbit x 1
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  18. Dorarnae Arbiter

    Dorarnae
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    ohhh for mobile...meh
     
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  19. Diablo1_reborn Busin 0 Wizardry Alternative Neo fanatic Patron

    Diablo1_reborn
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    oohhh horrible weeb art style...meh
     
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  20. Efe Liturgist

    Efe
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    VA stands for elf waifu?
     
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  21. Matador Prophet

    Matador
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    Thanks. keep in mind that is a very amateur translation, and I couldn't get the quests texts translated because we couldn't find the way to find the location. Half the merit is for aweigh, who gave me a good hex editor and gave me some good indications for the translation process.
     
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  22. Reinhardt Arcane

    Reinhardt
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    Where?
     
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  23. Falksi Arcane

    Falksi
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    I've still never played a Wizardry game.

    Bought Wizardry 8 on GOG this week. Will be indulging soon.
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2021
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  24. Gamezor Educated

    Gamezor
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    I tried this one first and need to try another one. I generally like it but felt like the enemy movement in combat would have been better abstracted like in older games. I really should try another one or give this another go.
     
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  25. Strange Fellow Peculiar Patron Sad Loser

    Strange Fellow
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    Be sure to get Wizfast and the faster combat animations component of the Wizardry 8 Enhancements mod. Combat is too slow in vanilla, but with these installed you won't have a problem.
     
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