[LP CYOA] 傳

[Esquilax]

Now, now, let's not go all Disney about this. It's a pugilist world and many people choose a life of wandering, adventuring and whatnot as a viable lifestyle. I don't see anyone arguing that Jing is being psychologically traumatised by not getting to play with boys his age. Cao'er may become depressed in the convent, or bullied, lose her taste for life, whatever - you can't really attribute that when she didn't seem to particularly suffer or hate life with Yao. I don't think we should infantilise her and say "hey this is good for you the world is too dangerous little girl".

I'm not saying she hated life with Yao. I'm saying that it's the only life she's ever known. It's easy to pat yourself on the back and say "well, here I am giving her a choice, look at what a great guy I am", when she's never met the Abbess in her life and Jing is the only person that she's ever been friends with because of her travelling lifestyle. Given the choice between heading off to a convent and heading off with Jing, she's obviously going to go off with Jing. And I feel that a lot of the reasons that The Brazilian Slaughter were giving felt like rationalizations; bringing her along for reasons that are beneficial to Jing, not reasons that are beneficial to her. Overall, it's safe to say that Emei is more beneficial to Cao'er than travelling with Jing would be.

But it's fairly clear from the initial description that she never developed any social skills due to Master Yao's lifestyle:

The Doctor
You are not a doctor - not yet - but you are a diamond in the rough. Under any other mentor in the world, you would become a promising healer, but you happen to be apprenticed to the Doctor of Death, an eccentric wanderer who has vowed to kill one person for every person he saves. Despite that, his skills are legendary, and he hopes to turn you into his heir. You wonder if that is such a good thing. Long periods of time spent in isolation with a kook have left you very socially awkward.

The world isn't too dangerous for her. It is the part of the world we chose to reside in that is extremely dangerous. With no school to back us up, the only safe haven for us is the Ashina tribe, and the Luoying Manor might also qualify. Everywhere else we are just an outcast.

At the moment, old Yao is far more of a badass than us, yet he barely made it out in one piece. He was able to protect her up until now because he was (a) a fucking great doctor who always kept his word, and (b) because nobody fucks with the Killing Physician. If Yao wasn't able to protect her at Qingcheng, what chance do we have? Eventually I am confident that Jing will surpass Yao in skills, but right now, we just don't have the ability to look after her.

 

[Nevill]

He was able to protect her up until now because he was (a) a fucking great doctor who always kept his word, and (b) because nobody fucks with the Killing Physician.

I'd add (c) because he didn't try to fuck with 8 major orthodox sects all at once.

 

[Nevill]

I also forgot to list a reason: I'm afraid Cao'er is taken in by the Emei, becomes their star discipline super-fast (she is VERY brainy and perceptive) and then we have to fight her. I don't want to kill her.

We'll just ask her really nicely and pat her on the head. She'll concede the win to us on the spot.

The Maniac shall be amused once the tales of our victory spread.

Eh, I'm pretty sure Cao'er coming with us was a foregone conclusion. She is a good friend, and it seems like a waste to put one on a bus just so they could have a happy ending. I'm just voting as a mean of self-expression.

 

[ERYFKRAD]

Also if you leave Cao'er with the nuns, they'll shave her bald. That'd traumatise her for a long time, man. Don't want her to think we're responsible for that. And I think that's the major reason why she won't go with the nuns.

Silly reasoning aside, I wonder if it's possible to have her tag along with us until we can work out a better arrangement. That might be a viable compromise, not the best, but still, I feel her skills are liable to waste in a monastery, just as Yao's might.

Speaking of which, treave, is Yao likely to practice medicine or teach it anymore?

 

[treave]

Yao was never a monk. He used to be a polite, shy country physician. Then he met the bandit queen.

As for romantic feelings, that's really up in the air. Spending a year together before this may be too fast for Jing to decide whether someone is his friend or lover or sister for good. Besides, at this age his emotions probably have not yet reached maturity. At any rate, none of the choices here involve romantic love, in his mind.

And from the perspective of the character, he isn't going 'I'm giving her a choice because I know she'll come with me.' If Codexers are choosing it because they're being manipulative, it's a statement about them, not the character.

Besides... why assume the answer she comes up with will be either A or B? C was meant to be a wildcard from the start (aka am I in a trolling mood and can I justify it?)

Edit: Yao can still do some medicine work, but he is barred from leaving the monastery once the Abbess dumps his stubborn old ass there, until she gives the say so. This stunt with Qingcheng has made her rather angry. He's to put his principles on hold and embrace Buddhism for now. But whether he'll genuinely do so is up to him in the end.

 

[Bloodshifter]

B>C

 

[Tigranes]

Besides... why assume the answer she comes up with will be either A or B? C was meant to be a wildcard from the start (aka am I in a trolling mood and can I justify it?)

Clearly she will get up, scream I NEVER LOVED ANY OF YOU and leave, not to be seen again for a decade when she resurfaces as the Killer Physician 2.0.

 

[Absinthe]

Voting C.

Points:

• It's her life and it should be her decision, even if the Jing is given the chance to choose.
  
• Any outcome should be fine.
  
• The guys complaining about Zhang endangering her forget that Zhang just gave Xing an entire year.
• Miecao did not ask you to choose.

 

[ScubaV]

Even if A is better for Cao'er, and some good points have been made that it is, I think ultimately everyone should be allowed to make their own decisions for better or worse. I don't tell people what to do in real life and I'm not going to do it in a CYOA either.

C

 

[Baltika9]

She has her professional development as a healer to consider. Being cramped on a mountain retreat will probably only have her saving the life of the heroine of a korean historical drama every once in a while, as opposed to having regular practice in dealing with shattered faces, everything, etc. if she follows us. If she decides that the safety at the mountain beats that experience, then that's fine, but it should be her decision to make.

The convent will give her training as well, in martial arts and inner harmony, that's what Buddhism is all about. Absolutely nobody can deny that she has had a difficult childhood and is completely screwed up in the head, so sending her to live among her peers, not ot mention her estranged sister, will definitely be better for her mentally than hiking around the world with Jing, the living embodiment of CHAOS! and Imperial double-agent. I can definitely see nothing but advantages for her in going to the convent, even professionally, we've seen the Emei going out on missions and undertaking tasks in the outer world and there will be no shortage of people coming to them for aid and healing. These are, after all, nuns.

3) She keeps Jing grounded and less liable to succumb to the MAXIMUM FUCK.

Sadly (not really), MAXIMUM FUCK! is part of our job now, as both Zhang's apprentice and Shun's agent, we will be dong incredibly risky shit in the future.

What's so bad about that? Dude, she's the most badass grandma one could ask for! Ex-bandit unorthodox badass turned asskicker nun, that's one useful person to know.

In fact, I want her to be our friend and someone we can come to at any time and ask for advice. This is very worldly person, getting her to see us as "lil' bro" will be very useful indeed. In addition to everything Esquilax said, this gives me enough reason to flop to A.

I can totally imagine Jing rolling up to the Emei convent one day to ask life advice,
"Grandmother, I have this situation and I really need some advice..."
"Again?" <sigh> "Tea?"

 

[ERYFKRAD]

P. Sure Grandma's advise would be to join the whatsit and repent.

 

[Baltika9]

Actually, treave, since they're having this relatively peaceful sit-down with not a whole lot of pressing matters to attend to, I want Jing to ask both of them about Master Zhang, what's his story? Yao seems to have some history with him,

“Words will not work on him, Jing,” says Master Yao. “If you do not know Zhang Jue well, I do. He is not a man that will take his eyes off his prize. If you do not agree, he will likely kill me, and Cao’er, and then all of the nuns here. Then, if you are still resistant, he will kill you.”

 

[ERYFKRAD]

Yeah, treave can we get some answers now while we still can?

 

[Baltika9]

Yeah, it shouldn't impact the vote at all. Unless Zhang is Cao'er's father. Which would be fucked up on so many levels.

 

[treave]

They've just crossed paths multiple times, which isn't really all that surprising. He's been in close proximity with Zhang enough to know that the man kills when and as he wishes. As far as the Southern Maniac's background, there isn't much to tell. He's studied with many different masters, including the current leaders of Wudang and Shaolin, and was cast out for his bloodthirstiness and recklessness in combat. At the age of twenty he made his name in the Huashan Summit, surprising and defeating many older competitors with his sheer brutality and killing a few notable names, including the former Southern Great.

Yao was also there when the Tieshen Clan, a school of warriors that were famed for their Iron Body Skill, challenged Zhang. The challenge was to be one-on-one, with Zhang taking on ten people consecutively, but when they realize that Zhang was striking to kill after the third person died, the school and the onlookers began piling on him to put the mad bastard down. Rumour has it that he tore apart a hundred fighters throughout the entire night, but in actuality Yao tells you no one bothered to count after the hundredth man went down, and some bodies have never been found to this day.

 

[Baltika9]

So he annihilated an entire school sect by himself?
He's my hero.

 

[Esquilax]

Even if A is better for Cao'er, and some good points have been made that it is, I think ultimately everyone should be allowed to make their own decisions for better or worse. I don't tell people what to do in real life and I'm not going to do it in a CYOA either.

That's a fair point. Cao'er is two years younger than Jing, so she's around fourteen years old right now. When Jing was kicked out of the Imperial Palace and sent off into the world with Prince Shun's help, he was the same age. We've debated over and over whether going unorthodox was the right call or not in hindsight (I think we've made a rather good go of it, personally), but he was the same age, and was provided the same choice of either joining a sect or making his own way in the world as a martial artist.

He had the freedom of deciding where it was he really wanted to go when he was the same age, so it would be hypocritical of him to say "No, you can't make it on your own. It's too dangerous." At the same time however, I could see Jing saying to her "look, just because I'm the apprentice to the Southern Maniac, doesn't mean you have to get involved in my crazy life. Fuck it, go to the monastery and sing a few hymns, forget this shit."

They've just crossed paths multiple times, which isn't really all that surprising. He's been in close proximity with Zhang enough to know that the man kills when and as he wishes. As far as the Southern Maniac's background, there isn't much to tell. He's studied with many different masters, including the current leaders of Wudang and Shaolin, and was cast out for his bloodthirstiness and recklessness in combat. At the age of twenty he made his name in the Huashan Summit, surprising and defeating many older competitors with his sheer brutality and killing a few notable names, including the former Southern Great.

Wait, so the Huashan summit is only a few years away? It's typically held every twenty-five years, Master Zhang looks to be around forty, so it seems like it's not too long till the next one is called, right?

Also, considering that Zhang is such a bad motherfucker, how the hell did the Central Tao manage to put him down? I understand if we might not be privy to this. I don't think Zhang would tell us how he lost... let's just say he seems like a sore loser.

 

[treave]

The next one is in roughly three years time. As for the Central Tao, his Taiji Fist and Swordplay is said to be ineffable. You may get further details if you fight him, or at least watch him fight.

Zhang himself hasn't taught you any specifics about Wudang outside the particular technique to counter them. He seems to want you to experience all the sects' moves for yourself without any bias.

 

[Grimgravy]

I wouldn't be so sure Cao'er will choose to come with us. She just found out she has real family. She has a grandmother and sister she never knew. If she goes to Emei, she has the chance to know them and they her. I'm pretty sure Cao'er will at least consider it.

 

[Kashmir Slippers]

C because why the hell not. Cao'er likes us, and she does have a talent that even we lack. Her story is hers to make. We can help her if she needs.

 

[treave]

ERYFKRAD - C
Smashing Axe - C
Grimgravy - C
Zero Credibility - C
Nevill - A
Ifeex - B > C
TOME - C
m4davis - C
Kipeci - C
Azira - B
XenomorphII - C
The Brazilian Slaughter - C
Baltika9 - A
Stygian Lurker - C
Esquilax - A
Tigranes - A
Jester - C
Bloodshifter - B > C
Absinthe - C
ScubaV - C
Kashmir Slippers - C

***

Current tally:

A - 4
B - 3
C - 14

 

[Baltika9]

The next one is in roughly three years time. As for the Central Tao, his Taiji Fist and Swordplay is said to be ineffable. You may get further details if you fight him, or at least watch him fight.

So we can win the tournament as the White Wolf, defeat the Eight Students as Jing and then show up to the Summit as our alias, only to reveal our true identity in a climactic final fight. Yes, that would be suitably dramatic.

 

[ERYFKRAD]

The next one is in roughly three years time. As for the Central Tao, his Taiji Fist and Swordplay is said to be ineffable. You may get further details if you fight him, or at least watch him fight.

So we can win the tournament as the White TigerWolf, defeat the Eight Students as Jing and then show up to the Summit as THE TIGERWOLF KHAGAN, only to reveal our true identity in a climactic final fight. Yes, that would be suitably dramatic.

Fix.

 

[Nevill]

Besides... why assume the answer she comes up with will be either A or B? C was meant to be a wildcard from the start (aka am I in a trolling mood and can I justify it?)

She is in love with Jing, whom she thought to be deceased until just recently. Now that she miraculously has him back, I just don't see her choosing to part with him again. That is not how people's feelings work.

Even if A is better for Cao'er, and some good points have been made that it is, I think ultimately everyone should be allowed to make their own decisions for better or worse. I don't tell people what to do in real life and I'm not going to do it in a CYOA either.

That's a fair point. Cao'er is two years younger than Jing, so she's around fourteen years old right now. When Jing was kicked out of the Imperial Palace and sent off into the world with Prince Shun's help, he was the same age. We've debated over and over whether going unorthodox was the right call or not in hindsight (I think we've made a rather good go of it, personally), but he was the same age, and was provided the same choice of either joining a sect or making his own way in the world as a martial artist.

Excellent comparison. Might I remind you that we were besieged by bandits and left for dead in the first week of our adventuring career? Do you want something like this to happen again? You are now older and wiser than her, you are in a position to at least give her the advice.

Besides, to go with you or not is her choice to make, but to accept her as a companion or not is your choice. Do not try to point fingers and shift the blame to her "because that was her decision". She doesn't know just how perilous the path you are walking is, and even if you tell her, chances are, she doesn't care if it lets her be with you. Love can cloud the reason. Right now, you are the one who can think clearly. Whatever happens, the responsibility is yours, and yours alone.

On an unrelated note. treave, can we ask Yao and Lihua about Cao'er's parents? I am extremely interested in her father, and it would be nice to know what exactly happened to them. Maybe we can reunite the family one day if they are still alive.

 

[treave]

She is in love with Jing, whom she thought to be deceased until just recently. Now that she miraculously has him back, I just don't see her choosing to part with him again. That is not how people's feelings work.

Love is a strong word to use, and people don't make decisions based solely off their emotions.

Edit: As for her parents, they're dead. No doubt about it, Yao diagnosed them himself.