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Kipeci

Arcane
Joined
May 22, 2012
Messages
3,027
Location
Vicksburg
I wonder if that Guye Aluba is one of the Tujue.
 

Esquilax

Arcane
Joined
Dec 7, 2010
Messages
4,833
There are plenty of reasons not to go with C, Lambchop19. It's important to keep in mind that while you and Baltika9 find the idea of training under Zhang to be exciting - hell, so do I - our character sees it as near-certain death, so from that standpoint, it doesn't make much sense to go with Zhang. We're rather protective of Cao'er, so leaving with her and looking after her is consistent with that character.

Yao knows that he will die, and he's chosen to lay down his life for us and Cao'er. He knows exactly what awaits him here and I think it's rather telling that he's willing to die for us just so we don't fall into his clutches: Yao truly believes that Jing and Cao'er would be better off if he is dead and his apprentices are roaming the world without a Master and the Southern Terminator Maniac after them, rather than risk having us with Zhang. He's playing the Obi-Wan card here: "strike me down, Zhang, and I will become more powerful than you can ever imagine". Quite noble, really, and it's why I'm fond of the old coot.

The important thing here is that Yao knows way more about Zhang than we do, and if he says "don't go with Zhang" we ought to fucking listen. Yeah, we'd be going with the intent of saving the lives of both Yao and Cao'er because we drew Zhang's attention in the first place, but remember that the road to hell is paved with good intentions.

Although, with 5 speech points Jing will be able to negotiate something, I'm sure. A1 sounds like the best alternative and yet it still places Yao in mortal danger. I don't like that one bit. And I really want to learn from Zhang, I think you guys are underestimating Jing's backbone.

You're absolutely right about Jing, the boy has a ton of heart and it won't be so easy for Zhang to mould him despite his youth. The ultimate idea that drives Jing is his loyalty to the Prince, so in that sense he's already been "moulded" to serve as the Prince's hand and to die for him if need be. So in that sense, he's already been "programmed" already. However, there's no doubt going to be some trauma involved - I doubt that the Southern Maniac was always a maniac, he must have been sane at some point before delving into all of these techniques.

I believe that to maintain our sanity in the hellish training we'll receive, we have to place idealism above pragmatism: we have to value our mission and our character's strong sense of loyalty to Shun, and now Yao and Cao'er, above power. I know this sounds counter-intuitive given the danger here, but we need something to cling to so that we can stay on an even keel.

However, there's one aspect here that we've kind of ignored with C:

You reluctantly agree to go with Zhang Jue, attempting to negotiate your release from Master Yao’s service so that he may leave safely with Cao'er. If he agrees, you will swear an oath of personal debt towards the Killer Physician in gratitude.

treave, what would this oath of personal debt involve?
 
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treave

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Jul 6, 2008
Messages
11,370
Codex 2012
Jing will swear to himself that if Yao ever needs assistance, he'll find a way to help him if he's still alive, even if he's a half cripple from training under Zhang. Expect this to be more of a mindset, similar to Jing's loyalty to Shun. As in, if you get a message from Yao seeking help, the only question is how you help. There'll be no turning it down.
 

Baltika9

Arcane
Joined
Jun 27, 2012
Messages
9,611
Then that's another mental connection that will enable Jing to make it through, the dude hates failing his loved ones.
 

Esquilax

Arcane
Joined
Dec 7, 2010
Messages
4,833
Then that's another mental connection that will enable Jing to make it through, the dude hates failing his loved ones.

"So many vows. They make you swear and swear. Defend the King, obey the King, obey your father, protect the innocent, defend the weak. But what if your father despises the King? What if the King massacres the innocent? It's too much. No matter what you do, you're forsaking one vow or another."

This is another chain around our necks. In fact, this makes the argument for A1 more compelling. I like Yao, but we can't be loyal to Yao the same way that we are loyal to Shun - I think it's too much obligation. Let's just listen to our Master, find the Wudang, and make sure that his death is not in vain by growing up and taking vengeance. I've flopped to A1.

Nevill, XenomorphII, Grimgravy, The Brazilian Slaughter, LWC1996, if you bros want to join the A1 flop bandwagon, now's the time. I just don't think C is worth it now.
 
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Baltika9

Arcane
Joined
Jun 27, 2012
Messages
9,611
I'd rather they live, we'll figure something out later. Shun just needs us investigate the martial artists. Beyond that, we have no obligations.
 

a cut of domestic sheep prime

Guest
Jing will swear to himself that if Yao ever needs assistance, he'll find a way to help him if he's still alive, even if he's a half cripple from training under Zhang. Expect this to be more of a mindset, similar to Jing's loyalty to Shun. As in, if you get a message from Yao seeking help, the only question is how you help. There'll be no turning it down.
Well, that doesn't sound good - on multiple levels (half-cripple?).

Flopping to A1 for the time being.
 
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Baltika9

Arcane
Joined
Jun 27, 2012
Messages
9,611
It's called "exaggeration," used to illustrate just how binding this vow is. Whether or not we'll be crippled depends on us. Honestly, with the medicinal knowledge we learned I'm sure we'll make it through the physical portion.
 

treave

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Jul 6, 2008
Messages
11,370
Codex 2012
Hm, I certainly didn't mean to make it sound like it was on par with his loyalty to Shun. Jing's loyalty to Shun was so absolute that he'd cut his own throat if that's what the prince required without giving a reason. As Lady Ji implied, that may have changed a bit nowadays. But it still takes priority over anything. This isn't anywhere near as drastic. You're doing favors, not receiving orders.

It's similar to his relationship with Shun as in its something Jing sees as natural, that it's a given for him to do what he can to aid his former master, something he's doing willingly in gratitude, not an artificial oath he imposed on himself as a way to convince Yao to give him the cure.

half-cripple? ...flopping...

Pussy. :troll:
 
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Baltika9

Arcane
Joined
Jun 27, 2012
Messages
9,611
C- 13/14 with Grimgravy's flop.
Kipeci C
Baltika9 C
Azira C
Nevill C
Brazilian Slaughter C
Erefykrad C
Jester C
Kayerts C
LWC1996 C
Kashmir Slippers C
ScubaV C
Lambchop19 C
Esquilax C
m4davis C

A1- 5 with Ifeex's flop.
Smashing Axe A1>B1
Ifeex B1>A1
TOME A1
Bloodshifter A1
Grimgravy A1


XenomorphII B2
Let me know if I missed someone.
 
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a cut of domestic sheep prime

Guest
BALLS TO THE WALL, BROS! BALLS TO THE FRICK'N WALL!!!

YEEEEEEEEEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAARG!!!!


:flamesaw:



(overcompensating)
 

Esquilax

Arcane
Joined
Dec 7, 2010
Messages
4,833
:lol:

It's called "exaggeration," used to illustrate just how binding this vow is. Whether or not we'll be crippled depends on us. Honestly, with the medicinal knowledge we learned I'm sure we'll make it through the physical portion.

... or on our luck, but we can't make decisions around that. But yeah, risking death and injury is par for the course if you're going to be training under a dude like Master Zhang. I mean, his apprentices have the average lifespan of a mosquito, do you think he gives a fuck about one of them getting crippled? Really, huge risks like that are to be expected.

Okay, well, with that clarification, I think I'll flop back to C. We have the speech skill to act as an arbiter here, and I don't think that it's fair that Yao lay his life down for us like that after we had courted attention from the Southern Maniac.
 

Baltika9

Arcane
Joined
Jun 27, 2012
Messages
9,611
“There appears to be a slight misunderstanding here,” laughs Zhang Jue. “My last disciple lasted six months and three days, setting a new record.”
There appears to be a slight misunderstanding here, mosquitoes live for a maximum of three months, that means his apprentices have the lifespan of two mosquitoes.
:troll:
And I thought we agreed to shelve the "luck" argument.
 

Baltika9

Arcane
Joined
Jun 27, 2012
Messages
9,611
Seriously, though, I wonder why Zhang is looking for apprentices with an attrition rate like that? What does he need an apprentice for in the first place? Why does he want to even bother teaching us? This is exactly why I think there is much more to him than meets the eye.

I'm really regretting not taking the info on him in the Manor.
 
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m4davis

Scholar
Joined
Jan 20, 2012
Messages
557
C because quite honestly I think that if we pick any other choice there is very little chance of anyone getting out of here alive and cause quite simply it makes for a more interesting character
 

Nevill

Arcane
Joined
Jun 6, 2009
Messages
11,211
Shadorwun: Hong Kong
Esquilkax said:
This is another chain around our necks. In fact, this makes the argument for A1 more compelling. I like Yao, but we can't be loyal to Yao the same way that we are loyal to Shun - I think it's too much obligation. Let's just listen to our Master, find the Wudang, and make sure that his death is not in vain by growing up and taking vengeance. I've flopped to A1.
Dude, seriously?

You seem to forget that we would be doing this out of our own volition - not because Yao forces us to do so.

What you are effectively saying is that Jing can't befriend people, fall in love or otherwise feel obligated to someone because he is afraid that the responsibility that comes with having people he holds dear will clash with his allegiance to the prince somewhere down the road. What kind of reasoning is that? Why would you mutilate the character so? The prince himself would be disgusted with that kind of attitude. One of the reasons I chose the road instead of a monastery is to rid Jing of this mindset ("My life for the Empire! Glory to the Dragonwarden Prince!") and to give him something more to live for than his undying loyalty to Shun.

Yao isn't just some old man Jing found on a mountain. He didn't just help Jing across the road or become his drinking buddy - he saved his fucking life! Hell, without Yao, the very mission for Shun that you think Jing should prioritize at all costs would come to a premature and abrupt end. And for that, you want to leave him to certain death by the hand of the Maniac, because swearing eternal gratitude doesn't sit well with you.

One day we will have to choose our loved ones over our devotion, like we did in Ashina (granted, the reasoning was somewhat different then). I don't want that to be a no-brainer choice because we conveniently have never loved anyone.
 
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treave

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Jul 6, 2008
Messages
11,370
Codex 2012
treave, if we hadn't attracted Zhang's attention, would this update be merely us vs the nuns or would the confrontation come later?

The nuns would have tracked you down around this time no matter what you did - even if you had pawned the sword off.

Kipeci - C
Baltika9 - C
XenomorphII - A1
Azira - C
Grimgravy - A1
Nevill - C
Smashing Axe - A1 > B1
Ifeex - B1 > A1
Esquilax - A1
The Brazilian Slaughter - C
ERYFKRAD - C
Jester - C
Kayerts - C
LWC1996 - C
Kashmir Slippers - C
ScubaV - C
Lambchop19 - C
TOME - A1
Bloodshifter - A1
m4davis - C
Tigranes - A1
kazgar - B1

***

Current tally:

A1 - 7 (8)
B1 - 2 (1)
A2 - 0
B2 - 0
C - 13 (13)
 
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Grimgravy

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Sep 12, 2013
Messages
3,469
Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire
Clearly, someone sold us out to the old bitties. That or while the sword was masked as part of the bigger sword, some mystical lojak was blocked.
 

a cut of domestic sheep prime

Guest
The nuns would have tracked you down around this time no matter what you did - even if you had pawned the sword off.
Ha! Knew it!
 

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