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Absinthe

Arcane
Joined
Jan 6, 2012
Messages
4,062
I'm fine with telling them Yang Xue is back. It's gonna be a problem in the near future anyhow. It's actually one of the subjects I wanted to discuss with them after we win the challenge.
 

Akkudakku

Arbiter
Joined
Mar 17, 2014
Messages
1,125
Floppity C>B - I still hope monks wont get mad... Also I hope the abbot doesn't have more than 8 inner strenght :D
 

Absinthe

Arcane
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Jan 6, 2012
Messages
4,062
Well, if we leech the elders, we will be temporarily surging at 9 or 10 neigong against the abbot.
 

Kz3r0

Arcane
Joined
May 28, 2008
Messages
27,013
Guys, stop trying to decide what Shaolin finds honorable or not, I have news for you, none of the choices is 'honorable' .

A-means going wild because the techniques we learned are not on par with theirs, so we have to make up with our raw strenght, high probability to injure someone, remember, in chaos mode, our natural state, we can't control the techniques perfectly.

B-another forbidden technique that the abbott dislike and distrust, the point here is to show that such techniques can be used honorably.

C-vampire skill, that put us right in despicable monster category until we will explain how we learned it, exposing imperial secrets in the process,ohohohohoh.

As I have already wrote, if you wanted so hard to abide to their laws and customs you shouldn't have take this challenge nor petitioned for Xuxian.
 

Tribute

Arbiter
Joined
Jan 18, 2014
Messages
919
B>A. I don't really see anything wrong with Shaolin finding out we have WQS considering the whole purpose of this trial is to get them on our side.
 

Akkudakku

Arbiter
Joined
Mar 17, 2014
Messages
1,125
Guys, stop trying to decide what Shaolin finds honorable or not, I have news for you, none of the choices is 'honorable.
A-means going wild because the techniques we learned are not on par with theirs, so we have to make up with our raw strenght, high probability to injure someone, remember, in chaos mode, our natural state, we can't control the techniques perfectly.

B-another forbidden technique that the abbott dislike and distrust, the point here is to show that such techniques can be used honorably.

C-vampire skill, that put us right in despicable monster category until we will explain how we learned it, exposing imperial secrets in the process,ohohohohoh.

As I have already wrote, if you wanted so hard to abide to their laws and customs you shouldn't have take this challenge nor petitioned for Xuxian.

C- fuck imperial secrets, it's the last cadence gov't anyway :D
B- why would be forbidden? Who forbid it to Jing? It's a legendary tech of immense power but it is not forbidden to us :D
A- it's the maximum fuck, what else would you expect :D
 

Tribute

Arbiter
Joined
Jan 18, 2014
Messages
919
As far as the Abbot's hate for the forbidden techniques, he hates the Nine Yang Divine Skill because of the effects it (inevitably, as far as he can tell) has on the practitioner's personality.

So far as we know WQS does not warp your personality, as it does not throw either yin or yang chi out of balance the way the Nine Yang Divine Skill or Nine Yin Divine Skill would.

He still might dislike it somewhat based on the fact that people tend to kill each other over learning any of these three skills, but this sort of violence is an inevitability given that we know WQS at all.
 

Absinthe

Arcane
Joined
Jan 6, 2012
Messages
4,062
C is also some serious trololol.

Esquilax, I think you've forgotten about the value of pranking your opponents in a fight. Did Jing go all HONORABURU during the Young Tigers Tournament? No! We trolled our way through most of that competition. Time for MTP to prove his skills, I say.

Besides, you know the Art of War? Did Sun Tzu say "You should fight your enemies honorably in the way you think they would like to be fought?" Hell no! Sun Tzu was all about undermining the enemy's expectations when profitable. Hell, he said the best victory comes from guaranteeing your victory without even fighting, and after that comes winning without any injuries. We already cleared 2 stages without lifting a finger. Now it's time to let the 4th stage clear its way for us. Lets make Sun Tzu proud, Esquilax.

Lets prove that Jing is not only a badass fighter, but also a badass tactician.
 

ChumBucket

Augur
Joined
May 16, 2010
Messages
349
Sooner or later word is going to get out that we have WQS. If we do it now we have a chance to prove we are worth to the shaolin.
 

Absinthe

Arcane
Joined
Jan 6, 2012
Messages
4,062
I prefer to use Wuxiang Qiankun against the abbot himself. C will temporarily give us the boosted neigong we need to use it for our final match.
 

ChumBucket

Augur
Joined
May 16, 2010
Messages
349
To that point I say which would the shaolin respect more: Someone who uses an underhanded trick followed up by a forbidden technique, or someone who displays their mastery over a foribidden technique, but resists the temption use it in the following match?
 

Absinthe

Arcane
Joined
Jan 6, 2012
Messages
4,062
Resisting temptation does not apply in B because we would be unable to use Wuxiang Qiankun on the abbot in that case.

And if you want to prove your ability to resist temptation, vote C because we might even win without using Wuxiang Qiankun this way.
 

ChumBucket

Augur
Joined
May 16, 2010
Messages
349
They would only know that we couldn't use it if they had some understanding of the technique already.
 

ChumBucket

Augur
Joined
May 16, 2010
Messages
349
Hahaha, you talk about deception when option C is employing just that. I was implying not even using the techniques we aquire against the abbot btw. Lets put my point another way; I don't like C because it doesn't fulfill both of these requirements: 1 displays WQS to them in a combat situation, 2. shows we can use honest nonlethal techniques to defeat a worthy opponent.
 

Absinthe

Arcane
Joined
Jan 6, 2012
Messages
4,062
C is tactical deception in a match. It's about as dishonorable as feinting is. You're trying to get into their good graces by lying to their face. Those are two very different things.

And as I see it, with C we can use Wuxiang Qiankun in a combat situation against the abbot, and we can keep our moveset limited to nonlethal moves this way because we don't need to worry about using our super lethal techniques.

Also, I just remembered that B involves using Wuxiang Qiankun to keep borrowing the Nine Elders' moves against the abbot, so really, you're not winning any points for proving your noble restraint of Wuxiang Qiankun.
 

treave

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Jul 6, 2008
Messages
11,370
Codex 2012
No neigong boost, as Kayerts figured. Unless you do a permanent drain. You won't be doing that.

Qi draining would improve, but not sufficiently to change the description. It'll be reflected in narrative and use.

The monks will accept a C victory. Given that it's Jing, they won't be surprised at trolling or tricking. It's part of the repertoire and they didn't ask you to behave during the trial anyway.

Anything I missed?
 

Absinthe

Arcane
Joined
Jan 6, 2012
Messages
4,062
Some folks are asking about draining the abbot's neigong after picking B.

Also, there's a huge stink being raised over how Shaolin will only reluctantly accept Jing with a C victory and mutter unpleasant things about his unorthodoxy whereas B somehow avoids this. Could you be a bit more explicit on differences in rep between the two?

There was also a question being asked whether a B vote would still involve qi leeching and be detected as such (this relates to arguments being made about whether or not we would be asked to explain our qi leeching ability with a B vote).
 
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treave

Arcane
Patron
Joined
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Messages
11,370
Codex 2012
There's nothing stopping you from trying to drain the Abbot.

And winning the fight with a surprise drain does earn you less respect. They'll respect your wits but not as much your martial strength, while to defeat them in A you'd have to showcase both qualities. They aren't going to actively hate your victory since you did no permanent harm to the elders' inner strength.

As for absorption in B, you only do it when you land strikes in chaos mode, in between using their own techniques. It's not noticeable at the start but skilled masters will be able to realize it as the effect adds up, sooner rather than later. How soon is that in this case, you don't know.
 
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Absinthe

Arcane
Joined
Jan 6, 2012
Messages
4,062
Ah, so they will know about our qi draining ability in the end anyway.

And, to be clear, they will respect us properly overall if we win with C, right? It won't be a "well you have the rights but we don't like you" response, yes?

Also, you mentioned they will respect our wits for C. What would they respect about B? Just martial prowess?
 

Baltika9

Arcane
Joined
Jun 27, 2012
Messages
9,611
Yeah, that's a part of our style, so they will know in any choice. The difference is in how we'll be using it. If we are going to be a dick about it (from their point of view, C) then they won't really be cool with it.

B is somewhat of a gamble: I'm down with taking the chance of showing them perfect control of WQS as a proof for Xuxian's stability and to download the full Shaolin curriculum, as Esquilax put it.
 

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