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Myth: A New Age CYOA

Discussion in 'Choose Your Own Adventure Land' started by Fangshi, Jan 15, 2014.

  1. Baltika9 Arcane

    Baltika9
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    Ai
     
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  2. Nevill Arcane

    Nevill
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    Yes, we crush the ghols and then we get caught on an uneven terrain with our forces spread out.

    Why if there so much focus on defeating the ghols when they are the bait and not the trap? What is there to be proud of about being able to take the bait?

    It is so by design. Or do you think that one of the necklace bearers vanishing from the Watcher's radar is not suspicious?

    That is what we are planning. It is not a surprise attack on the Watcher, it is separating him and the ghols. I don't get how is this an objection.

    Why would that outcome concern us? It was mentioned in the very update we've read that the Trow have genocided their slaves, but they still perished in the end. Are you showing concern for the ghols now? :lol:

    I don't know about other ghols, but Nanshe would go for it. She also claims to have control over her tribe - and it is very doubtful she is lying, since there is absolutely no sense in tricking us when she does not know of the plan. It would be akin to lying about her favorite color - utterly poinless, if you ask me.

    What makes me go for it is that the plan is so unorthodox and wonderfully mad, it is bound to catch the Watcher and his mage unprepared. They have fought the Light for too long. No servant of the Light would consider releasing a ghol prisoner and aiding them, no matter their goals. It just happens that we have the ingredients necessary to make it work. At least I think so.

    For the moment all I want to do is not to play in their hands and not spring their trap. If it all goes smoothly, we will not have to engage in battle at all.

    Yeah, right. The raid was planned by the Watcher's creature, there is a fuckton of crows around (isn't it customary for a raiding party to be accompanied by hundreds of crows? no? thought so. Even the army we faced before had less), and it's all harmless. Sure.

    We've seen the white mage, and I absolutely do not want to meet him again unless he is outnumbered 50 to 1. Our chosen school of magic is largely worthless against him.

    And I suspect it is the same creature, or at least someone of the same strength since there is a rumor about him being an immortal. It might be that there are several creatues so indistinguishable from each other that the others could never tell them apart, or he might be an actual immortal. Besides, him making the most upsetting report (Mazzarin's return, what else?) implies that he is still around. Either way, he is an immence threat.

    The magic signal only reveals its full power when he is casting, and we are quite far from his location.

    Jewgoldz. Jewgoldz never change. We are opposing a being of thrice the Spider Goddess power, with armies ten times the size of hers, and all we can worry about is money. :roll:
     
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  3. Nevill Arcane

    Nevill
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    Alright, so, the kunning plan (TM).

    The goal in not to come in contact with the ghols, but just have them leave the gold, pick it up, load it on the carriage, and then leave on the double.

    • I suppose it requires us to organize Nanshe's escape so that she could take command of her ghols quickly. This can easily be done with Lyssa's support by casting an invisibility spell on the ghol. None of our mercs are mages, so it would look like the sorceress snuck a spell in by herself. We might want to do this on a rough terrain where the chariots can't pursue her, or we might want to send the dwarves ahead.

    • Since the invisibility spell would be the only thing protecting her, our group without the dwarves still number about 20 people, and we are kind of striving for an alliance, there is next to no chance Nanshe will turn on us outright (it would be suicidal), but still it would be nice not to stand near her when she gets loose. On our part, make it a condition that she won't get anything from us if one of ours gets hurt because of her actions, or that of her people.

    • We should confirm that we will tell her how to neutralize the necklaces after we get the gold safely. We should also make sure she understands that if the battle comes to pass, her people will serve merely as a bait to be slaughtered by the force 1.5 times their size, for us to get caught. She does not want the battle to happen, and we don't want it either. Still, she has more to lose than we do if it happens, since her tribe is currently under a command of the high priest of the Watcher. Without her, they are forever the Watcher's slaves.

    • Plant the idea in Nanshe's head that it might be beneficial for her to let the other ghols know about the necklaces, as well as not get too active in the dwarven lands from now on. We have no real way of controlling her once we conclude the deal, so we can't pose it as a condition, but these would be sensible things for her to do.

    • I don't think we will have time to give her the gloves later, and they are kind of heavy to be transported by an eagle, so we just have to have her wear them. Tell your escort that their goal is to suppress magic. It's the truth, after all. That way, the only thing we'll need to send with an eagle is a message explaining how to use them and the construction of the lead collar.

    • The easiest way to confirm that our alliance is working would be for the ghols to change their course to the one that lets us intercept them the fastest. Fangshi, our eagles should be able to see where they are even now, correct? Bird's view, eagle eyes, and all that. Or is it too far even for them? Once Nanshe reunites with her crew - which should happen fairly soon, - we should be able to see what is happening through their eyes, and react accordingly.

      Now, I have no idea where the ghols should be going after that, except that I want them going towards the plains (because that's where the carriage can pick the gold up) and away from the odd magic signal. It might be faster to reach the plains if they head straight east, or they might head south-east and drop the gold for our mauls to carry it south, or even continue heading north-east if the chariots can get there in time and it would be fastest. But Nanshe should give us some kind of a signal in that case.

      She does not need to fear that we intend to trap her - none of our forces can outrun hers on a ragged terrain if the ghols drop the gold, and she should only be worrying about trusting us if she decides to part with the gold in the first place. If she decides to keep her allegiance with the Watcher and take the gold to him... we'll see what our options are then. Worst case scenario, the group of ghols will have one sorceress more, and we'll have one less problematic prisoner in our ranks to worry about. The chance of it working makes the risk worth it to me, though.

    • We should move east in parallel to the ghols. The dwarves should probably go ahead, as they have a long way to go if they want to get around the rocky terrain. We should establish an SOS signal, upon receiving which they will abandon everything they were doing and come back to us. I believe Uttu's flash arrow would suit this role. Fangshi, from how far away can it be seen?

    • If the ghols can reach the plains, they should drop the gold there and move away wherever they want. We'll signal the location of the gold to the dwarves through the eagles and have them pick it up. Have someone check the contents before you load it up. Because, you know. Ghols.

    • If we are lucky, we won't come in contact with the odd magic signal, as we would be constantly moving away from it.

    • Assuming the plan works, we'll have a reduced mobility, as the gold will need to be loaded on the chariots and the carriage. That means our grenadiers won't fit there anymore. The good news is, we might not care about it, as even in the worst case scenario we can ride ahead, leaving them behind but also drawing the attention away from them.

    Is there anything I missed? I'll call it Vera Bii.

    Alternatively, it might be better to limit ourselves to the statement of intent only and let Fangshi take care of the details, since the plan is static and factors might come up that turn it upside down. So my vote is Bii>Ai.
     
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  4. asxetos Augur

    asxetos
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    I like Nevill's plan but i see a flaw:
    We should not do this because Nanshe is pretty decent with Mental Spells and will figure it out easily or even resist it outright and be hostile.

    I am voting Bii > Ai as well but i hope nevill considers the above point.
     
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  5. Nevill Arcane

    Nevill
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    No-no-no. I did not mean it as a mind trick at all. What I meant was a summation of my previous statements.
    We should be honest with her, as far as that is possible, as our plan relies largely on the fact that she will know we can fulfil our promises, be it freedom or death.

    These two things benefit us, but there is merit in them for her, too. I want her to consider that.

    I guess I should be more careful with words when playing a mentalist. :)
     
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  6. Fangshi Arcane

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    Lyssa does not know Invisibility, none of the ladies do. She could project a fake image or scene (for example you 'killing' Nanshe) to give your prisoner a way out but she can not cast that particular spell.

    It is not very far for the eagles but the couple hundred crows between them and your target may pose a problem. It is likely that the crows will attack the eagles if given a chance.

    This can work but there may be a catch.

    She has the ability to send up a signal that you should be able to see however she will likely be reluctant to tell you in advance where she will drop the chests. Particularly if she decides to be helpful and leave them on open ground for you to easily pick up. She likely will be afraid that you will ambush them with your chariots and ride them down on the open plains so she will want most of her people safely away before she sends up the signal.

    About sixty kilometres or so. As previously mentioned it works a lot like a marine flare.

    Current Tally:

    Show Spoiler
    Kipeci: Aiii>Aiv
    Smashing Axe: Aiv>Aiii
    Jester: Ai
    Kz3r0: Bii>Ai
    Nevill: Bii>Ai
    archaen: Bii>Bi
    Sunnmøring: Aiv>Aiii
    Grimgravy: Ai
    Baltika9: Ai
    asxetos: Bii>Ai

    A)
    i. 3 votes
    ii.
    iii. 1 vote
    iv. 2 votes

    B)
    i.
    ii. 4 votes

    Post Flop:

    A)
    i. 3 votes
    ii.
    iii.
    iv. 3 votes

    B)
    i.
    ii. 4 votes
     
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  7. Nevill Arcane

    Nevill
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    I can't believe I keep confusing things. I thought for sure someone in our party could cast it, but it turned out it was Miosguinn. Damn.

    Faking Nanshe's death would not be ideal. It will raise questions if she turns out to be alive later - she is rather famous. Something to distract the guards (and justify our inaction) to give her time to cast that Iron Skin and run would be better. Our archers would not be able to shoot her, and none of our warriors can keep up with her in that case.

    But we haven't reached the crows yet. If the eagles can see the ghols from where we are standing (if they fly high enough), what's the problem?

    That's why I said she needs not fear a trap. She can leave the gold on the border between the rugged terrain and the plains, right where the plains start. We can't ambush her forces since our dwarves can not teleport out of thin air and there is nowhere for them to hide on the plains - at the first sign of trouble the ghols can always run away deeper in the rocky terrain where the chariots can't reach them.

    I loosesy define the 'plains' as 'a terrain passable for a chariot moving at a decent speed'.

    ^^~~^^~~^^\..................
    ~~^^~~^^~~/.................
    ^^Mountains^^X....Plains....
    ~~^^~~^^~~|.................
    ^^~~^^~~^^/..................

    Is there a reason why this can't work for her? The dwarves certainly can't give chase on foot, seeing how they are the slowest of our troops.

    I assumed that with eagles, we won't even need a signal from her for when to pick up the gold - we'll be able to see it regardless.

    And what is the distance between the location we are currently standing at and the place where the plains begin in the north? How much time it would take the dwarve to go around the mountains from their current position?
     
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  8. Fangshi Arcane

    Fangshi
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    They can't see the ghôls from where they are. Your scouts have been tracking them then falling back and sending you messages that way. The terrain is quite rough and ribbed through with gullies which the ghôls are traveling through. To get close enough to see them from the air would require getting past the screen of crows.

    In that case it can be done without too much trouble. She will probably deposit the chests somewhere on the north east corner of that diagram I added to the update since it would give her somewhere to run too if the dwarves catch her in the act. She will still want a good head start though (which should not be a problem). If she agrees to this then you will both want to keep your soldiers away from each other, if the ghôls or dwarves spot one another there could be a fight if one of the groups comes within range of the other.

    Twelve kilometres or so. The ghôls have maybe half that to go till they hit the north plains but they are weighed down and the terrain is rough. If you went directly at them and they did not stop, you would likely catch them within the hour. It will naturally take them longer to reach the eastern edge of the gullies and your chariots could get there before them if they left immediately.

    About an hour if they go all out and bring a good guide. They can get around and onto the plains quickly enough to make Aiii and Aiv work essentially. It would take them maybe two thirds of an hour to three quarters of an hour to get to the likely drop off point if Nanshe agrees to your plan. She will probably try and drop it somewhere in the north east corner of the map I gave you before slipping away.
     
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  9. Nevill Arcane

    Nevill
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    Fair enough. But they should be able to see them once the ghols reach the eastern edge.

    How much longer? At what speed are they moving? Slower than our dwarves on foot, I assume?

    Is the odd magic signal moving? In which direction and at what speed?

    Can she tell us what is up there? Why is her team moving north-east?

    Why can't she move south-east? It would let us be done with it faster, and the ghols can still retreat west.

    The ghols not changing directions might still be beneficial to us, as it does not give away our plan. Still, I am concerned about it.
     
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  10. archaen Arbiter Patron

    archaen
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    I'll flop Bii > Bi with the clarifications.
     
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  11. Fangshi Arcane

    Fangshi
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    Possibly. Depends on what the crows do really. To get a clear view of anything coming out of that maze you need to be damn near on top of it and your two eagles are not likely to win an air battle here.

    You do not know exactly how quickly they are moving but it is safe to assume they are going quite a bit slower than you are. Even your dwarves will likely catch them on foot eventually unless they drop the chests.

    It has not moved yet.

    They are returning to the Watcher's stronghold though she will not tell you where it is aside from the obvious that it is somewhere to your north and east.

    By the time she catches up with her soldiers they will be closest to the northeast corner by far. Her group is the slowest in this little dance and it would take substantially more time to turn around and make for the southeast corner. Heading southeast would also trap her between your main army and the chariots circling the gullies, she will be very hesitant to lead her people into such a situation. You can try to convince her to do so but her natural inclination will be to drop the chests in the northeast.
     
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  12. Nevill Arcane

    Nevill
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    I didn't mean the south-eastern corner. Ah, it's too much pain to explain it with words. Leet Paint Skillz to the rescue!

    [​IMG]
    They are currently heading towards where the green arrow is pointing. What I propose is to change their course to that of a blue arrow. There is not much of a difference in terms of distance, is there? And she is no more likely to get caught.

    This might be completely insignificant in the full scheme of things, but I'd like to stay as far away from the Watcher's keep as possible and to keep the dorfs closer to us if we can help it. I can probably accept the north-eastern corner if it is the fastest way, though.

    Then there is a problem of sending Nanshe her message when there are so many crows around. Maybe she should stay behind in one of the gullies near the edge after she sends her people away for our eagle to drop her the letter.
     
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  13. Fangshi Arcane

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    First off, brilliant map. :salute:

    Now:

    From your perspective yes, there is not much difference except convenience, since you don't intend to harm her in Bii. But from her perspective it still increases the likelihood of being caged and slaughtered. She can not be sure that you won't angle northward instead of eastward and if she heads southeast and you do not give her space then you will slam right into her with a superior force.

    It is essentially a question of trust and risk.

    If she tries to drop the package in the northeast she believes she can still escape if things go wrong.

    If she tries to drop the package in the east and things go wrong she has no chance. She does not know how fast your chariots are (which is why she does not suspect anything in Aiii) but she is fairly certain that they are faster than her soldiers so she can't flee to the east. She can't flee to the west since you will be in her way. Fleeing south is suicide for her and fleeing north will do her little good if you are right behind her. She would be trapped.

    I am not saying you can't convince her to turn southeast but it is not something she wants to do as she does not trust you. You are asking a lot by having her turn her forces that's all.

    What it will amount to in all likelihood is another check. You will have to persuade her and she will either believe you or she won't.

    Doing that would endanger only herself not her people so she would actually be less resistant to it. She might be willing to stay behind if you want her to.
     
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  14. Nevill Arcane

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    Well, otherwise she would risk not getting the message at all if the crows intercept the eagle. The closer she'll be, the easier it will go for all of us.

    We'll just have to instruct the eagle appropriately.

    So yeah, let's go with this. Once the dorfs load the gold, Nanshe will give the signal so that the eagle could find her. She should also make effort not to be spotted by the dwarves. She is a mage who can talk to birds, she can think of something. The eagle then should drop the message (it probably would be good for the message to be a letter with a weight attached to it so that it could literally be dropped without the eagle having to fly too close and without a risk ot it being carried by wind. If it would be heavier than something a crow or two would be able to pick up, it would be nice, too) and then fly back to the dwarves.

    It should not be hard to explain away what the eagle was doing... if anyone asks at all. It is our scout, it spotted a ghol, it dropped a rock on it, big deal. And if the eagle fails to reach her... the message should not contain any information that would be meaningful to anyone but Nanshe, so that front is also covered.

    I can be pretty blind when it comes to my own plans, so if anyone has something they want to comment on, please do.
     
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  15. archaen Arbiter Patron

    archaen
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    Tactics in case of ambush by Watcher's minion:
    We should have Lyssa ready with strong wind in case we see a wall of fog coming our way and she should then follow up by covering our position with illusions if there is a sizeable attack force with him. If the Watcher's minion is alone or only has a few minions, she should try to get her aphids off or distract him with an ice bolt while we hit him with a greater energy bolt. We should assume that mental spells are going to fail 95% of the time on the Watcher's minion and not waste the time.

    I sure miss the bombard cannon.
     
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  16. Nevill Arcane

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    I guess how we will communicate with the dwarves is we send them ahead on a pretence that we will do a flanking maneuver, then after a while we inform them via an eagle that the prisoner have escaped and send them 'after her', but also tell them to prioritize capturing the gold. When they arrive, they might assume the ghols, warned by the crows, dropped the gold and fled, and since they can't pursue them, the only thing left for them to do would be to pick it up.

    The eagle that is required to accomplish the last part of the plan will have to hitch a ride on the carriage with them. That would necessitate it carrying two messages. It is intelligent enough to know which one goes to whom, right? :lol:

    I really want to send a mage with them, but we are kind of tied. Lyssa needs to be with us to cover Nanshe's escape, we need to be able to talk to Nanshe, and Thais... well, let's just say I don't like separating with her. At least if the dwarves walk into a trap, there would be no casualties among the core group.

    Anyway, it is as much a statement of intent as any of the previously mentioned plans. If there is something the characters feel is more likely to work, let them use it instead. The plan involves multiple parties (the ghols, the dwarves, the mercs, our group, the prisoner, the eagles, the MYSTARY signal), and it would be a pain to plan for every eventuality. Those are just the broad strokes.
     
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  17. archaen Arbiter Patron

    archaen
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    Another thought. Are we sending Nanshe out next to the magical signal without the lead cover on her necklace? If she runs right past the magical signal pinging the crap out of it and it is the Watcher's minion, she is going to get picked up. He has a personal interest in her and may just take her into his camp and interrogate her. Then the message never gets to her ghols.
     
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  18. Nevill Arcane

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    Yeah, I thought about that. It's a bit late to cover it. It broadcasts its location for miles. If the mage is here, he already knows we are here, too.
    The other necklace bearers can sense her from about 30 feet, but the Watcher's creatures can find her 'when necessary'.

    Not to mention there is no way for her to sneak past the crows unseen. Indeed, it would be strange for her not to ping the crap out of it on the way to her ghols. That would signal that something is wrong with her necklace and arose suspicion.
     
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  19. Fangshi Arcane

    Fangshi
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    The vote will close in twenty four hours with an update to follow twelve to sixteen hours after that.

    The current leading option is Nevill's plan as proposed here.

    Current Tally:

    Kipeci: Aiii>Aiv
    Smashing Axe: Aiv>Aiii
    Jester: Ai
    Kz3r0: Bii>Ai
    Nevill: Bii>Ai
    archaen: Bii>Bi
    Sunnmøring: Aiv>Aiii
    Grimgravy: Ai
    Baltika9: Ai
    asxetos: Bii>Bi

    A)
    i. 3 votes
    ii.
    iii. 1 vote
    iv. 2 votes

    B)
    i.
    ii. 4 votes

    Post Flop:

    A)
    i. 3 votes
    ii.
    iii.
    iv. 3 votes

    B)
    i.
    ii. 4 votes
     
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  20. Nevill Arcane

    Nevill
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    The plan got the approval of our resident lunatic tactician, right before he jumped out of a window for a midnight stroll.

    I mean, it's a good sign that someone shares your ideas, right?
     
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  21. Kipeci Magister

    Kipeci
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    :decline:
     
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  22. Nevill Arcane

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    Hm, now that I think of it... If we give Nanshe the gloves, does it not mean that we also give her tools for long-distance communication?

    Think about it, covering her neck with the gloves disrupts the signal, and we can feel it from a great distance. So we should be able to notice when it stops.

    Fangshi, can we test that? Can we discern subsequent disruptions of the signal? Can we notice reliably how long such a disruption lasts?

    If the answer is yes, just tell Nanshe that the gloves are to be used for communication and that she should cover her neck whenever she needs to send us a message. She does not know what they do, and she does not know we can feel the signal, so it is extremely unlikely she would be able to figure out how they really work on her own. It would be more plausible for her to attribute this effect to the gauntlets, rather then to her necklace.

    If the length of the disruption can be noticed with acceptable accuracy, then we have the morse code for complex messages right there. But even if not, we can establish a pretty good communication system. Furthermore, we can use pauses between disruptions to transmit additional information.

    1 disruption - 'I have reunited with my team'.
    2 disruptions - 'The gold is at the drop point, go take it'.
    3 disruptions - 'The white mage/high priest/someone else is here. Be careful'.
    1 disruption, pause, then 2 - '???'
    2 disruptions, pause, then 1 - 'PROFIT' etc

    Also, did we just invent telegraph?
     
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  23. Fangshi Arcane

    Fangshi
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    Don't see why you wouldn't. As long as she is within range (and you do not know how far that range is) then you should be able to sense her necklace activating and deactivating. If you want you can use that to send short messages, sure. If there are no objections then that is how you will go about coordinating things.

    Anyway twelve hours till the vote closes.

    If you could create such devices in sufficient quantities for widespread application then yes. As it stands right now though it is just a trick.
     
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  24. Nevill Arcane

    Nevill
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    Do we need a pre-set list for a list of hypothetical situations she might encounter, or as long as the messages from Nanshe are short enough, you can hand-wave that? The communication will be pretty one-sided, since we can only receive messages, but can't send them to her.

    If not, we can settle on a network of watchtowers, each one with a high priest of the Watcher in a pillory, dwarves slapping them silly with leaden sticks wherever they want to transmit a message. Smashing Axe would approve. :lol:
     
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