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Myth: A New Age CYOA

Discussion in 'Choose Your Own Adventure Land' started by Fangshi, Jan 15, 2014.

  1. Nevill Arcane

    Nevill
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    Buddy points with him would not hurt. The whole point of saving Wenzel is to keep an amiable relationship with the people we heavily rely on, and not because we love him so much.

    It improves Wenzel's chances if Timo has time to get him to safety before we act. Timo gets what he wants, and we get what we want - that is, one less powerful enemy in the city.

    He has his plans for them, and we have ours, so we will have to compromise. I want the Weasels destroyed. This is to our benefit, to the benefit of Myrgard's citizens, and ultimately, to the benefit of House Albrecht.
     
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  2. asxetos Augur

    asxetos
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    Nevill i agree with you and updated my post. I just think its safer to inform Albrecht instead of Timo.
     
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  3. Nevill Arcane

    Nevill
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    Timo has his agents infiltrating the Weasels' compound, not Albrecht. And of the two, he is the one Wenzel trusts to an extent, so if Timo says that he was acting out of concern for his brother's safety, Wenzel is more likely to believe him and keep out of trouble.

    Maybe Timo will be able to convince him to flee the city for a while until the dust settles, so that we could finally stuff him in some backwater military outpost like Albrecht intended.
     
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  4. Karwelas Dwarf Taffer

    Karwelas
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    We should tell this only Timo. He is head of Weasels infiltration operation and he should know. Albrecht is a king, not babysitter. And Timo is only his brother so he don't do shit like his father can do.
     
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  5. Nevill Arcane

    Nevill
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    Fangshi, some questions.

    Army:
    How many robed figures are there, how close they are bunched up? What spells do they use? Do they use any tactics at all, are they organized in any way, are there leaders among them?

    Is there a highground nearby from which we would be able to shower them with arrows, catching them between us and the ghols?

    Items:
    Did we bring any oil to use with our enchanted oil can? Did we bring the replica of Lilli's portrait with us? How many of the sap bombs did we bring?

    Would the eagles perform as well with the spell plates as they did with the rings? An eagle should have no problem carrying one in their claws.

    Do the Arrows have special ammunitions, like Fire Arrows of the archers in the wars. Is there any vegetation to burn in the first place, or is there only sand and rocks?

    If we give several cloaks to one person, would it improve their defence or impact their freedom of movement? How big is the trade-off, is it worth it?


    As for the battle plan, I think we should send Nanshe a letter and one of the entangled dice via an eagle to coordinate the attack while we close on the enemy positions. An eagle can easily drop their message from above, so they are in no danger. We need the ghols to recognize us as allies and to take us into account - probably to distract the mages while we creep behind them and prepare our alpha strike. The exact details of the plan are in the works and largely depend on the answers to the questions above.

    Edit: why does no one give a cloak to Berty?
     
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  6. Fangshi Arcane

    Fangshi
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    From what you can see from your current vantage point there are about thirty. They are operating in pairs, trios and groups of five and are scattered along the slope of the mountain as the available cover dictates. You would not be surprised if there proved to be more than thirty though and you still have not been able to locate the origins of the howling you are hearing.

    They look to be mainly using elemental and physical spells from what you can tell. It is possible that they have other capabilities as well but if they do they are not currently utilizing them from what you can tell.

    As far as your collective specialties go:

    - D&T do not detect any mental spells being cast though it is difficult to be sure at this distance.

    - Lys does not detect any illusion spells being cast though again it is difficult to tell at this distance.

    - Lys does detect a few animal spells though. They are faint given the distance but they are there.

    They seem quite determined in their assault and their spells are being coordinated to a degree but you do not see any overall leadership. If someone is planning their actions they are not standing out in the open.

    There are cliffs and the like but all of them are on the defenders side of the battlefield. You will have to fight uphill against the mages just as they have to fight uphill against the defenders. There are a number of ridges on adjoining mountains through. They are not close enough to allow you to use them in the battle playing out before you but if you could bait the mages into charging at you, you might be able to draw them into range of some of the cliffs.

    Your expedition brought four large drums of oil as part of your supplies (about 800 litres) alongside, rope, extra wheels, and the like. Most of it would still be at the oasis camp but if you want the ladies might have brought some with them to the meeting. Just tell me how much.

    Yes.

    Ten. The dwarves have managed to perfect their construction and the only thing preventing the creation of more is a lack of sap. You would need to capture a few of the creatures and 'milk' them to make more.

    The dwarves have also also supplied you with eight addition bombs unfilled. You can pour whatever you want in them.

    Sure, I don't see why not.

    Yes, each has two fire arrows. They also all have the black arrows from which they get their name.

    The odd bit of shrub here or there but it is mostly rock and sand.

    Well the cloaks can already stop/deflect arrows and blades (unless they are built to puncture armour) so the defensive increase would not be too great though there would be some. If you wear five capes you might be able to stop a blow that would pierce one. They would definitely impact your ability to move though, particularly if you are not used to heavy loads to begin with.

    Depends what you want to do. the cloaks weight about 7kgs a piece and most of that weight is going to be right on your shoulders and neck. You can reduce some of the strain by fastening a belt around your waist as well if you ae willing to cut holes in the cape for your arms to pass through.

    If you think of them as roughly equivalent to regular mail only a bit lighter you would not be too far of the mark. The only other large difference is that the cloaks are a sort of fabric so they will behave much like fabric in most ways.
     
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  7. Karwelas Dwarf Taffer

    Karwelas
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    Fangshi, by the way. I have few questions.

    If one cloak weight about 7kgs - didn't they too heavy for mice even after you make little version?

    Black arrows have any special powers? Or they are just normal, black painted arrows?

    Who is that woman named Letta? (We have her portrait with us? Why?)

    Question to our team (better when only Thaïs hear us. Maybe Lyssa too.)

    - What they think about Nanshe? Should we do something with her after doing our dealings with her? How we should handle situation between ghôls and dwarfs?

    - Any thoughts about dealing with Weasels informations? Maybe tell them about our plan (Nevill plan :P ) and ask about their opinions.

    - Ask them about mice cloaks. Maybe we should ask Lyssa about that. She know them best.
     
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  8. Nevill Arcane

    Nevill
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    And the torque. Ceannard is working for us now, he can tell us.

    Ah, I've mixed the names, it seems. :oops:

    Lilli is the youngest of Albrecht's daughters who is presumed dead after her expeditions was attacked by ther ghols about 15 years ago. I would like to ask about her and confirm her fate with Nanshe. That is why I asked for her portrait.

    Letta is one of Albrecht's bastards and the leader of the Ten Sovereigns mercenary company.

    I think I will need a rough map again to understand what is happening. :)

    Where are we, where is the enemy, where are the ghols, and where are the best points of engagement on 'adjoining mountains'.

    Yeah, add it to the choices, I will vote for it. We only need a sample, there is no need to keep the whole scarf and not to make use of it right now.
     
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  9. Fangshi Arcane

    Fangshi
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    There are two different varieties of cloaks the dwarves were meant to weave for you.

    The first are the steel/metal cloaks and they were woven purely for defense. They managed to produce eight of them before they decided to take a break and try to produce the second type of cloak that was requested.

    The second type of cloak was meant to allow you to glide on the air. Like Batman or a wingsuit:

    Show Spoiler
    [​IMG]


    The only difference would be that it is a cape. It likely would have involved hooks of some sort to attach it to your legs and arms and allow you to control it but the dwarves never got that far. They managed to weave out about six cloaks from a material light and strong enough to do the job but then they got the idea to weave light and they forgot all about what they were supposed to be doing. The next thing you know, someone is throwing around lightning bolts and half the room is on fire... :lol:

    So the gliding cloaks are much lighter than the armour/metal cloaks and should be able to transport mice/rats/etc provided they can work out how to pilot them.

    Not magic but they are quite well made and they have a bit of a reputation for being 'almost supernatural'. It is said that 'whenever a black arrow is loosed a life is taken'. This is probably more down to the Arrows skill with a bow than anything else though.

    Nevill meant one of the King's other daughters who disappeared some time ago in an attack. Her name was Lilli.

    Sure, you had plenty of time alone in your new carriage to talk.

    Well Lyssa still thinks it was a bad idea to work with Nanshe in the first place but she has no personal problem with the Empress. She is willing to follow your lead in this as always.

    Thaïs thinks Nanshe has been a fair and reasonably honourable ally. She also thinks that you have all benefited from working together. She does not know if your relationship with the Empress can, should, or will continue into the future but for now she does not regret the deal you struck at Blackrock.

    Neither of them are sure.

    Lyssa merely states that she is no politician or strategist and she does not know what would be best but that she will follow you as long as you will have her.

    Thaïs does not think you should betray Nanshe unless you have to but she is quick to note that you might have to.

    Lyssa thinks that if it comes down a choice between the two that you should definately side with the dwarves. She says, 'At least they don't eat people." You guess that the witch has never been served ghôl brains...

    Thaïs is less certain. She says that she is tired of wars and the suffering they bring, she would prefer to find some way to prevent either side from harming the other but she does not know how that can be accomplished.

    You do and this is what they say:

    Lyssa thinks the Weasels should be wiped out and she is in favour of any plan that achieves that goal.

    Thaïs thinks it might be better to leave them in place and let Timo continue to mine the organization for data. She notes that the King's second son might not be thrilled to have you pull down his plots like this.

    You ask her whether the mice would like to try out gliding.

    She does not even get a chance to answer as Martin, curled up on Uttu's lap, springs to attention and immediately begin squeaking furiously.

    She translates, "He say that they will take any opportunity to master flight and take the fight to the old enenmies! The hawks, the owls, the eagle- ah, no he says that he is sorry and he knows that eagles are not all degenerate savages now- he says that the rest of his statement stands though. He would be honoured to test your latest inventions and reap the glory from doing so."

    He is working for you but so is Lyssa and Berty and they have not told you about everything they can do either. Get him to 'green' status and I will tell you. ;)
     
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  10. Fangshi Arcane

    Fangshi
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    Alright, one horribly primitive map coming up. If I was to orient it along a proper NSEW axis it would be a pain to draw so this is what it looks like from your position (looking through the spy glass):


    ghôls

    Nanshe's Mountain
    ghôls
    ghôls ​
    -------------------------------------Cliffs start about here----------------------------------

    mages
    mages​

    The Slope leading to the Mountain

    mages
    mages
    mages​

    mages

    ??? Something is howling but you do not know where it is ???


    Suitable Cliffs
    for an ambush​


    Suitable Cliffs for
    an ambush


    xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxOxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <----- The valley the original battle took place in. (You are at the O)​
     
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  11. Nevill Arcane

    Nevill
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    Okay, got it.

    The broad strokes of the plan:

    - Stealthily head for the cliffs closest to the mages (to our right).
    - Sent an eagle to Nanshe with a dice, a letter, and a list of communication commands based on 1-0 signals, much like what we did with her necklace.
    - An eagle should take the path different from that of our forces to confuse the enemy about the direction she came from. She will have to do a bit of extra traveling.
    - Nanshe should dress one of her people (or better yet, human slaves, though we don't know she has those yet) in the TWM's robes and have the fastest of her escort make a dash to our position, drawing the enemy attention to the package and making them think it's their target they are transporting. Better still if the dummy has some of the TWM's enchantments/trinkets on them, the same trick we used to lure him in, really. That might allow us to successfully ambush the enemy from the highground, drawing their attention to us, and then back from us again after we reveal the ruse and make them choose between pointlessly engaging us while the real target is getting away (we should coordinate this with Nanshe), and turning their backs on us while we rain arrows on them. This ambush may reduce their numbers to a more manageable size.

    Give it to Ceannard and Berty to consider. Any additions/corrections/clarifications?

    Anything in our equipment we can use to set up a proper killzone near the cliffs? Or can we make it up by listing some of the items we borrowed back at the oasis? ;)

    I think I will come up with something more detailed by tomorrow.

    Edit: would we see the hounds if we raise our eagles in the air from where we are standing?

    Well, good thing we are not working for him, then.

    It has to be done. :salute: Wenzel's life is about the only concession I am willing to make.
     
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  12. Grimgravy Augur Patron

    Grimgravy
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    Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire
    B
    Civ
    C
    The D & T, lyssa, the girls, and Caenard. Save 2.
    A
     
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  13. Fangshi Arcane

    Fangshi
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    They express concerns that the defenders might hoot down the eagle instead of letting it land next to them/enter the caves.

    The are also worried about whatever is howling out there. They do not know what it is or what it can do and that worries them in general.

    Other than those two general concerns they have no real problem with the plan as it does not risk any of your people directly (they don't count Lyssa's eagles) and if it fails all you have sacrificed are a few of the defenders and time.

    You brought two wagons. In those two wagons you had to transport half of the Arrows (so about thirty men). If you want you do have room in the wagons for a few things as long as they do not take up too much space. What exactly did you have in mind?

    You don't know. The main cast have never encountered the hounds they do not know what they can do. Nanshe would know but you can not directly contact her at the moment.
     
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  14. Nevill Arcane

    Nevill
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    I am pretty sure we asked the mice about them.
    So at least they should not come as a surprise.
     
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  15. archaen Arbiter Patron

    archaen
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    1. How do you want to try and reach the defenders in their caves?

    B) Dismount and advance on foot: You will leave five of the Arrows behind to secure your transports while you move with the rest of your personnel toward the defender's position. It will take you longer to reach the target but you will minimize the risk to your transports as long as the enemy does not specifically target them. You also might be able to take advantages of other paths you might miss on the back of a wagon. (Estimated time to arrival: 30 minutes, barring any obstacles thrown up by the enemy.) - I will flop if someone comes up with a good plan.

    2. The Spinner's Price: Well, they broke your artefact as the fellows are want to do. What do you want in return for their destruction of your property?


    C) Enchanting Equipment. They have plenty of extra tools and enchanting supplies lying around. Many of these objects would cost a fortune to purchase or construct on your own of course they are of little practical use for someone that has limited understanding of dwarven magic and technology:

    ii. One full set of engraving tools. The tools used by the Academy to work enchantments into metals, leathers and other materials. - For Melete and maybe the Seekers until she wakes up.



    3. The Weasels' gathered intelligence: You know just about everything you could ever want to know about the Weasels' day to day operations and organization. You could simply disregard the information as irrelevant to your investigation or you could use it somehow.

    C) You give the information to rival gangs and allow them to carve up Wenzel's little kingdom. The Weasels will be buried within weeks. - I will also vote for tipping off Timo so he can roll people up when it all goes down.


    4. You received eight steel cloth cloaks from the Academy. Who will use them? (Simply list who gets one, you can of course give more than one to a single person or even keep them all for yourself. The most popular set of choices will win.

    Thais, Derryth, Lyssa, Biliku, Uttu - We may be confused as Eberhardt cohorts briefly as I think they are running around in metal cloaks too?


    5. Your 'gliding scarf', what do you want to do with it?

    C) Use half to make mouse gliders and save the rest.
     
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  16. archaen Arbiter Patron

    archaen
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    Did our energon cube ploy not come into effect or do we have to wait for Albrecht to send them to us?
     
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  17. Fangshi Arcane

    Fangshi
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    It will take at least a week to get any results so Albrecht/Mayer will have to send them to you.

    Also forgot these:

    Added as D

    Added as A

    Added as E

    Added as D

    Added as B

    Added as C

    And finally added as C. :salute:



    Oh, also I forgot to add this to the list of questions but if you wanted to redistribute any of the items you (or your group) are carrying (rings, cubes and so on) then you might want to do so before you engage the enemy.
     
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2014
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  18. Nevill Arcane

    Nevill
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    Alright. So, about the Kunning Plan.

    Instead of venturing forth without a care in the world and engaging 30 mages and unknown number of hounds with no coordination with the defenders whatsoever, why don't we consider a bit of Speshul Taktics?

    - Start off by sending an eagle via a route different from what your actual forces will take. We don't want to make our position known in advance.
    - The eagle should have two items with her - a letter to Nanshe, and one of the dice we bought from Dietfrieds.
    - The letter should have a stone or some other weight attached to it so that the eagle could literally drop it on top of the ghols without actually landing. We don't want them to eat our messenger.
    - Since most of the ghols can't read Dwarven, Bruig, or at all, really, draw a scribble of the ghol in a regal clothing (as we've seen the Empress in a dream) to make it clear who the letter is addressed to.
    - In the letter we should describe a signal to make the eagle come down and hand Nanshe the die. We should also mention that we would like to have the eagle and the die back once this is over.
    - The letter should mention that she should keep the die at hand. Once she receives it, she should cast it once to let us know. Once we cast it two times in response, she should enter meditation and meet us in the Dreaming to discuss strategy.
    - Once in the Dreaming, try and learn everything there is to learn about enemy numbers, positions, force composition, tactics, and generally everything that should factor in our decision making process. Ask her about the howling beasts and if they have any weaknesses we might exploit, to prepare our men for this encounter.
    - Establish a simple communication system via the dice to give each other simple signals during the battle itself. One throw - attack, two throws - retreat, three throws - distract, etc. Hey, it works in multiplayer RTSes! ;) It largely depends on what our Dreaming war counsil would decide, so I am not giving the list of commands in advance.
    - Unless Nanshe has better ideas, our go-to plan would be to leave the transports with a few guards, sneak to a vantage point on a high ground via some obscure path, and lay low. We will signal her after we are in position.
    - On her part, Nanshe should prepare a bait to lure the enemy into a trap and under our fire. She should dress one of her human slaves in the TWM's robes, maybe give them a simple trinket or two from TWM's stock to make it look legit, and send them past our positions (not towards!) with her best runners carrying them. It was mentioned that ghols can run at a speed of a horse if pressed, and though their package would slow them a little, they should still be faster than the mages (don't know about the hounds, though). Hopefully, the enemies will buy it and move to intercept.
    - When the enemy moves into range, we should commence a crippling alpha-strike from above, hopefully catching them off-guard and severely lessening their numbers. Simultaneously, the ghols should descend from the mountain at the top speed and strike them in the back. Caught between two forces, I expect the enemy to fall quickly, especially if the bulk of their forces is comprised of 'squishies'. Either they will tackle us and get slaughtered by the ghols, or they will turn to ghols and leave themselves wide open to our fire.
    - We should stress the importance of a simultaneous attack. We will not engage in combat with a superior enemy force alone. Should the ghols fail to assist, this whole operation will have to be cancelled. Besides, a double strike at an encircled enemy is our best chance at victory. Any Nightmares or Lighting shows like the one we've seen Nanshe do before would be a welcome sight, too.
    - The rest of the plan is a general advice to make use of the terrain. Take cover behind the rocks, don't bunch up, set the enemies themselves on fire (mage robes are a fabric and thus flammable, no?) if there is no grass for us to burn with our arrows, try to prevent them from scaling the cliffs by bringing a part of the cliff on top of them, or flinging oil casks at them and setting them on fire, or blowing them off with a strong wind. These are all situational, so our captains should know what to do. If we can set up a killzone near the cliffs by utilizing unlit dwarven cocktails we borrowed at the oasis (the dwarves lit them up and throw them, but we can throw them or carefully place them in advance and then lit them up), we should do that. If we can use our aphids to blow up the mages, we should do that, too.
    - We should keep the spell plates on hand in case a hound sneaks up on us. I see no reason to go for an Avian Assault plan, which serves to take out a single target, when the enemy force has no clear leadership and is probably controlled by the Watcher himself. But if it turns out that there is a leader, or a particularly inconvenient target that threatens the plan's execution, use your assets to take him out ASAP.

    Mad Paint Skillz to illustrate my point.
    Show Spoiler
    [​IMG]

    Blue arrow - an eagle.
    Purple arrow - our forces sneaking to the ambush site
    Green arrow - Nanshe's distraction.

    I will call it Operation: Bait and Switch, and list it under 1. F - Freeform.

    Any comments, additions? Fangshi, is my assessment of the battlefield even correct? Any glaring difficulties that will need to be overcome?

    So, my votes for now:

    1. How do you want to try and reach the defenders in their caves?

    F - Freeform. Operation: Bait and Switch

    2. The Spinner's Price:
    Undecided

    3. The Weasels' gathered intelligence:
    E) You will alert Timo about your intentions to wipe the Weasels out. Let him use his agents to lure Wenzel out, kidnap him, or otherwise keep him away from his people. Then you will give the information to the gangs and throw the Weasels to the actual wolves. Wenzel will live, which should allow you to maintain good relationships with the rest of the family, but hopefully, he will be powerless to harm you.

    4. You received eight steel cloth cloaks from the Academy. Who will use them?
    B) Derryth, Thaïs, Lyssa, Biliku, Uttu, Berty (keep 2 for backup)

    5. Your 'gliding scarf', what do you want to do with it?
    C) Give half of material to the mice and keep the rest for creating more in the future.
     
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2014
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  19. Karwelas Dwarf Taffer

    Karwelas
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    I change my vote in the 1.

    1. How do you want to try and reach the defenders in their caves?
    F - Freeform. Operation: Bait and Switch

    Rest is preety much Nevill voting. (2 is D now).
     
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  20. asxetos Augur

    asxetos
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    Nevill delivers again :)
    Floping to 1F Operation: Bait and Switch
     
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  21. Nevill Arcane

    Nevill
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    So, if you are alerting Timo, is that C or E?

    What exactly do the dwarves hear about us? As much as it is lulzy to have such rumors circulate among the populace, I am not sure I like being used as a scarecrow to frighten naughty kids when they refuse to go to bed. :lol:

    Come on, really, now? Take a chill pill, girl, will ya!

    The Spinner was not bought with our own money, it was Albrecht who had paid for it! Why the hell are we screaming bloody murder when it were the dwarves that gifted it to us in the first place. That's just unseemly behavior.

    Oh, and what is Caoilainn angry about? She wasn't even there when we got it, and it's not like she can profit from it in any way. They probably saved her from an air diving session, something that I am afraid she would not appreciate, gven her record. :lol:

    I hope we aren't pushing him too hard. There are only so much ways to turn someone down subtly, and none of them seemed to work.

    We have given our advice to Lady Grey, it is now up to her to win him over.

    I am almost afraid to ask. But I will anyway. "What."

    What do we owe to such a big increase in our relationship meter with the Academy?
    What did we do to earn Mayer's respect? Is it just the money we are making together?
    Are the mercs just happy being paid, or are there other factors to our relationship?
    Also, just -90 with the Spider Realm? We have space to fall further? :lol:

    Edit:
    Cocktails, mostly. We have about 40 grenadiers with us.

    I would like to test an unorthodox application of explosives by a team that is not exactly proficient with them, and make it work. See, the explosive grenades the dwarves use are generally very stable by themselves, they are only dangerous when the fuse is lit, or if they are triggered by another explosion or fire nearby. They never explode on their own - well, not in the games, at least. The dwarves usually use them by lighting the fuse and lobbing the grenades at their enemies. My idea is to lob the grenade and then lit the fuse. It should make the explosives safe to drop and prevent casualties due to inaccurate throws, since the grenades won't go off unless we (or the enemy) specifically target them afterwards. And what makes the whole idea plausible is that we have a very specialized force equipped with AoE fire arrows, and very precise with a bow.

    This allows to use the grenades as a sort of mini satchel charges without the necessary training in explosives handling. It also makes the Arrows more deadly and more universal. The mercs would gain a lot in terms of mid-range power, and a team of two mercs acting in unison (one throws the grenade, the other lits it on fire as soon as it hits the ground) would be able to handle enemies that otherwise could overpower them.

    Of course, there is always a possibility of being hit with a fireball and exploding, but that is why you should not bunch up, and generally if you are hit with something of this magnitude, you are dead anyway, regardless of whether you have a grenade on your belt or not.

    I guess I'd like to ask Ceannard what he thinks about it, as I definitely see some possibilities here.
     
    Last edited: Dec 18, 2014
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  22. archaen Arbiter Patron

    archaen
    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2014
    Messages:
    621
    There was no options updated so it is 3.F and I'll flop to 1.F.
     
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  23. Nevill Arcane

    Nevill
    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2009
    Messages:
    11,060
    Shadorwun: Hong Kong
    Are there any differences, though? Is it that you are making a statement that you are not concerned with Wenzel's fate/your reputation with the family, but with the Watcher's agents instead? Their consequenses look identical to me, though our motives may differ.

    I may consider setting it as a backup vote if I understand what it is about.
     
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  24. archaen Arbiter Patron

    archaen
    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2014
    Messages:
    621
    Like you said, they are functionally equivalent. He will both save his brother and snap up any suspected watcher agents if we tip him off. I am not especially concerned for Wenzel but it will score points with his family to give them some forewarning then why not.
     
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  25. Nevill Arcane

    Nevill
    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2009
    Messages:
    11,060
    Shadorwun: Hong Kong
    Then I don't see a point of having two options, as I seek the exact same result.

    But if you prefer it that way, sure, 3. F>E. As long as we have enough votes. :)

    Edit: ok, 3E.
     
    Last edited: Dec 18, 2014
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