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On graphics and the willpower to withstand it.

Discussion in 'General Gaming' started by The Nameless Pun, Sep 1, 2015.

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OP is a complete faggot

  1. Yes

    43.6%
  2. Yes (KC)

    56.4%
  1. commie The Last Marxist Patron

    commie
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    Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Divinity: Original Sin 2
    The ONLY time graphics should be mentioned as a valid criticism is regarding flight/military/space simulators from the turn of the 90's. Great games, but really aged badly(Midwinter, Gunship 2000, SWOTL etc..). I'd sacrifice my entire boxed collection of games to have them near 1:1 remakes(fixing only the annoyances) with modern graphics; and even more crucially resolution; that the games deserve. From 1995 on the graphics are pretty good for sims(even now HIND is serviceable and clean and sharp), though of course, greater terrain detail would always be welcome to match the decent systems modeling which usually was above what the game could actually render.

    But for RPG's? Wash your mouth out with soap faggit!
     
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  2. AetherVagrant Savant Patron

    AetherVagrant
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    My taste varies significantly with the specific game.
    Games whose graphics ive always adored despite being aged nowadays:

    -Fallout1/2 :(already been said. my only beef is the weird crossshatching/dithering..with good transparency and some lighting it could be beautiful even to the mouthbreathers.
    -Ultima 6/7 : cant be called beautiful, exactly, but they are charming, and the era's tech problems are dont loom large enough to be distracting or get in the way of enjoyment.
    -LOOM/Maniac Mansion -- less than 256color grafix used to be a dealbreaker for me, but these games make older Kings Quest art look like crayon scribbles a dutch mental institution.
    -Darklands : Characters are just a few pixels when in combat mode, but it makes them look more like abstract physical miniatures, and the rest of the art is just sublime.
    - Witcher 1 : just shitting you, what kinda retard thinks this one looks dated? half the time I think it looks better than Witcher 2 or ME games.
    - Divine Divinity: still the best-looking entry in the series, at least till DOSee comes out.

    Cant into teh gfx:
    Gothic 1/2/3 : played and loved the first two, but thought their graphics sucked ass even when they first came out.
    SS2 : unplayable and not suspenseful without mods
    Anachronox
    Most gold box games: liked some of them as a kid, always hated the graphics.
    Daggerfall: cant even tell what im looking at anymore. Harpie boobies are no longer titillating.
    Kings Quest games. (vs I liked the art in Quest for Glory Games)
    Dungeon Siege. Any of them. anything with -Siege in the title. (except for castles:siege and conquest)
     
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  3. The Nameless Pun Unwanted

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    I must disagree with you about system shock 2, I played it without any mods and it was perfect, the blocky graphics just added to the tension, IMO.
     
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  4. AetherVagrant Savant Patron

    AetherVagrant
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    Maybe, they were scary ugly. I probably just got spoiled by Bioshock too early, and its eezybreezy gameplay but good art and jumpscares. didnt have much element of danger though.
    But in SS2 the fact that the zombies keep respawning was the scariest part. are they unkillable? are they being created somewhere? no matter how many crew you kill, more keep coming out of the woodwork. sometimes i just want to clear an area and get a break to explore my shitty maps and keycards without every poor soul i murdered jumping up in mai fayce. ​
     
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  5. Fowyr Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    Fowyr
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    Exile (with E3 tileset) has a very good graphixx.
    Fallout/Fallout 2 is breathtakingly beautiful.
    OP is a faggot, though I chuckled once or twice.
    It's pretty normal for roguelikes to have arbitrary keys assigned to commands. You just read manual and learn them in hour or two. These long key strings from *bands (let's cast a Malediction! c - m - b - l - f - g - h! Huzzah! Goblin is dead!) are much more tiring.
     
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  6. MadMaxHellfire Arcane

    MadMaxHellfire
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    i don't care about graphics. i play roguelikes (with tilesets or i'd get blind).
    i care about good interfaces, and oh god almighty many older games are such a truly horrible excruciating suffering!
     
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  7. Jasede Prestigious Gentleman Arcane Patron Sad Loser

    Jasede
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    I dunno if this is a joke post.

    It's a carbon copy of my first Codex post from 10 years ago; it was some wankery about how awesome text is because we can imagine stuff and that looks better than graphics, seguing into how awesome I am for being able to withstand graphics.

    I was a moron then, and while I don't claim not to be one now I'll tell you one thing; the sooner you realize good graphics are as integral to a good game as everything else the sooner you can grow past hipster wankery, as long as you never forget the importance of art design. Games from 2015 look better than games from 2000. Fact.

    Also the guy above me is silly too; a rogue-like also needs "good graphics" except it means something different in that context. Just compare ADOM to Nethack, or Crawl to SLASH - which one is more readable, which ones give more easy to process at a glance information and look more pleasant to the eye? Even with all ASCII something can have better graphics than the competition, only graphics means something else then.
     
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  8. Excidium II Self-Ejected

    Self-Ejected
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    Intense idiocy to look at grafics without the context of budget, time frame and target platform.
     
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  9. rado907 Savant

    rado907
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    I also find it hard to play games with obnoxiously bad or horribly dated graphics. The thing is, some old games have aged well. Loom is a gorgeous game. Fallout 1&2 and the Infinity Engine games are beautiful. Fallout 3, on the other hand, is butt-ugly, as are many older 3D titles.
    Generally, 2D titles age seem to age much better than 3D titles. Which is one more reason for preferring isometric 2D to low-grade 3D.
     
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  10. SCO Arcane In My Safe Space

    SCO
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    It's not graphics that really kill a old (or new) game, it's affordance and usability and some bad design. Things like irresponsive controls, multiple key combinations for common actions, needing to remember a large custom vocabulary for the parser, 'random' encounters which aren't (r.i.p. midwinter), chopter simulator controls instead of mouse look, fallout 1 inventory (lolll), dumb reflex minigames (hillsfar) etc

    There are a great many games i like that have no graphics at all.
     
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2015
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  11. Awor Szurkrarz Arcane In My Safe Space

    Awor Szurkrarz
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    'sup dr0g.
     
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  12. shiteatingnippledick Arcane Patron

    shiteatingnippledick
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    Don't give in to the devil that is graphics, Nameless-senpai!

    [​IMG]
     
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  13. Gregz Arcane

    Gregz
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    I have the opposite problem, the better the graphics are, the less I can use my imagination and thus the lower my immershuns.

    I'm like those people who say the book is always better, because I can imagine a game more intimately.

    And ^ this x 1,000,000
     
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  14. Konjad High on potatoes Patron

    Konjad
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    Strap Yourselves In Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2
    I was a graphic whore when I was a teenager. I was even buying a new PC every two years to run new titles on max details, and back then I had a lot of money to afford it. Today I am an old poor man whom just automatically chooses "low" graphic settings in every game after installation even if my computer could run it higher, because I totally not care about graphics anymore (I only care to run it on my native resolution, because otherwise games look like crap on LCDs). I'm not against improvements in graphics, nor I am for them. I am completely indifferent. I can enjoy Dwarf Fortress' graphics (with a tileset) just as much as Dragon Age 3's.
     
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  15. Jiggy Boobles TESTOSTERONIC As Fuck™ Patron

    Jiggy Boobles
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    The difference is back then graphics hugely improved every two years. Now it has been almost stagnant since Crysis in 2006. The hardware requirements keep skyrocketing but that's just because of shitty coding and worse and worse console ports.
     
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  16. The Nameless Pun Unwanted

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    The Incline is strong with this one.
     
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  17. Awor Szurkrarz Arcane In My Safe Space

    Awor Szurkrarz
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    Oh how the mighty are fallen... We shall be mighty yet!
     
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  18. Night Goat The Immovable Autism Patron No Fun Allowed

    Night Goat
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    It's okay to dislike ugly games.
     
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  19. Durandal Arcane

    Durandal
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    Can you blame an old person for being ugly?
     
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  20. I'm Big Into Anal Arcane

    I'm Big Into Anal
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    this thread is further evidence the codex broke the newfag mould when i joined
     
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  21. DraQ Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    DraQ
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    1. There is world of difference between good graphics and new graphics, also between bad bad graphics and old graphics. Do note that "old" doesn't exactly mean when it was made.
    2. This is one of the rare cases where wisdom would actually be the applicable stat, not willpower. :smug:
    That said, there are kinds of graphics that are positively grating and it includes some low-budget indie graphics (especially when screen scrolls a lot but there is no smooth scrolling - which I think is the case with at least earlier Jeff Vogel's games), awful visually inconsistent indie graphics (KoTC - with smooth transparent lensflares plastered on top of low-res, low color pixelated sprite- and tile-work, with, again low res, low colour, pixelated, black-outlined, non-transparent light source sprites pasted on top of the lensflares - is the kind of game I woldn't touch with a ten foot pole even if it combined its allegedly good combat mechanics with PS:T's writing and FO C&C all at once because just looking at it simply makes me physically, violently ill) and, of course all the modern (at the time) AAA titles that insists on maximizing visual gimmick density per screen area at the expense of everything else (Oblivion was the poster child of that and also made me feel violently ill although visuals were the least of its sins).

    Of course, old graphics, when done well, don't lose potential to impress - Fallout, Lands of Lore, etc.

    Actually, aside from that particular complaint (which holds for pretty much every multiplatform game with bumpampping courtesy of limited texture memory) Skyrim's visuals are remarkably good.
    It has definite art direction (whether you like it or not is another matter), environments are quite lovingly crafted, effects are smartly and tastefully used (Skyrim is the only game I know that resists the temptation of using DoF to make shit blurry all the time, pretty much limiting its use to menus, underwater and inclement weather), locations are unique enough to be instantly recognizable despite their number, character faces are a backtrack to Morrowind's superior art direction rather than parametric potatoes of OB and so on.
    It's also an example of graphics that looked good despite being dated on release - being multiplatform Skyrim was made to run on half a decade old hardware that was new when Oblivion came out and the difference between two is startling. Of course Skyrim does cut a lot of corners in terms of visuals - model geometry, light sources, etc. but by using its assets in smart manner and applying its bells and whistles conservatively it manages hold really well.

    Well, it would help if they didn't try to look like actual graphics, then.
    They could gain a lot of clarity and style this way.
    Besides, I've seen quite successful attempts at actual graphics even on c64 so not an excuse.
    Well, they kind of are, mostly because of clarity. ASCII graphics is really bad in this regard.

    Don't you shit on The Witcher.
    The 1st one is pretty much the posterchild for both art direction (well, most of the time) and doing wonders with shit and dated engine.
    It and Morrowind are also in quite different categories due to the setting alone. I would also put Witcher far above at least the first BG.

    And yeah,
    :hmmm:
    The fuck is wrong with you, son?

    (Ok, SS2 has always looked kinda shit, but not nearly shit enough for it to matter.)
     
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  22. Jigawatt Arcane

    Jigawatt
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    Um, nothing? [​IMG]
     
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  23. Gozma Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    Gozma
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    Flipside of this is playing old fast games without many animations, often using frameskipping too, and then playing some new shit having to SIT THROUGH A FUCKING SECOND LONG CROUCH TO FISH SOME LOOT OUT OF A CHEST ANIMATION A MILLION TIMES FUCK YOU GOD DAMN
     
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  24. Sykar Arcane

    Sykar
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    [​IMG]
     
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  25. Exhuminator Arbiter

    Exhuminator
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    Talented art direction is timeless. Gimmicky technological eye candy is not.
     
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