Atlus Persona Q

[Morality Games]

Atlus going to release another game that the U.S. will have and Europe will want.

http://www.ign.com/articles/2014/07/22/persona-q-shadow-of-the-labyrinth-release-date-announced

In seriousness Europe will get it 3 days later, but we'll see how that goes.

 

[Raghar]

Can someone explain me why they are calling it dungeon crawling, when Persona games sucks at dungeon crawling so much?

 

[Hobo Elf]

Of course it'll be released in Europe. It has Persona on the title. It's only non-Persona MegaTen games that get jerked around in the west.

Can someone explain me why they are calling it dungeon crawling, when Persona games sucks at dungeon crawling so much?

Because it's a dungeon crawler like Etrian Odyssey with Persona 3 & 4 flavor sprinkled all over.

 

[Morality Games]

Better question, why is a Persona game being launched on Nintendo hardware? Are they testing the waters for a possible Wii U port of Persona 5, or seeing if Persona fans will be baited into the Etrian Odyssey franchise?

 

[Hobo Elf]

It uses the same engine as Etrian Odyssey 4. That's pretty much the reason they are doing it for the 3DS.

 

[Martius]

Better question, why is a Persona game being launched on Nintendo hardware? Are they testing the waters for a possible Wii U port of Persona 5, or seeing if Persona fans will be baited into the Etrian Odyssey franchise?

I think there was survey for people who bought this game in Japan. From what I can remember most people said (maybe 60 or 70%) that they bought it just because its Persona game so I guess its working. I just wonder if after english release people will call it Dark Souls 2 of Persona. Its also done by same team which is behind EO4 so I guess they wanted to make some space between EO1 and 2 remake. Also its not like it was done fast. I think we heard some information about Persona project for 3ds around 2010.
Since I live in Europe I am very happy we will finally get Atlus game in decent time. Too bad that NIS want to squeeze too much money from fans. In USA limited version cost 70 dollars, here its 70 pounds plus 5-15 of shipping depending on place. If 1 dollar = 1 euro wasnt bad enough for us...


As for Persona 5, I would say chances of getting Wii U port are close to zero. If they will make ports it would be probably vita or/and ps4. Wii U will have SMTxFE so I guess they could follow up that with something, maybe SMT5 or some new spinoff? Or Devil Survivor 3 with better graphics on console instead of handheld?

 

[Morality Games]

It uses the same engine as Etrian Odyssey 4. That's pretty much the reason they are doing it for the 3DS.

 

[Hitoshura]

It's out now for about 2 weeks in NA and I've played about 10 hours of it on hard mode.

It's more than Persona that uses Etrian Odyssey's engine, the gameplay systems are 50% Persona, 50% Etrian. The dungeon crawl part is heavily Etrian inspired, including the "unlock the next shortcut" to progress, gathering spots, FOE and light puzzles. Quite better than the random boring dungeons of Persona 3 and 4.

The best part is the battle system, it has a "Press Turn" like system while having several elements from Etrian like different rows, binds, etc... The extra benefit you get from abusing a weakness is a Boost status. While in this state, it means that you are guaranteed first action next turn and the skill you will select have no SP or HP cost. Receiving damage while in Boost status make you lose it. That's an interesting system and it enhances the tactics quite a lot so far.

The game also tackle one of the problems you often see in turn based battle system where after a fight, you have to go to menu to fix yourself which is boring and repetitive. In this game, all characters have a main persona and a substitute you can change outside battle. These subs provide skills and extra HP and SP. In battle, if you take less damage than your sub's HPs, you will get out of battle without having lost any HP, the same is true for SP. The game rewards you for being efficient.

The worst part is how terrible the writing is. Characters are reduced to their single more poignant line and they will overreact to every simply event in the labyrinth. If you play a blobber because you don't want to be burden by a (terrible) story, don't touch this one.

Overall, pretty good but I wouldn't recommend it unless you already played at least one Persona (3 or 4) or an Etrian Odyssey. Standard rules for spinoffs I guess.

 

[Hobo Elf]

I have something like 40 hours clocked in and I'm on the final dungeon now. Currently grinding the P3MC to lvl 55 so I can

Spoiler

do the quest to upgrade the ultimate personas for everyone

. Luckily it's a quick and painless process since I just have Naoto on my team and use her to wreck enemies with Mamudoon/Mahamaon/Samsara. Game has been great so far, especially the 4th dungeon. Some really neat puzzles there. Especially the last floor of the 4th dungeon made me think for a while before I could solve the puzzle. The writing is crap for the reason Hitoshura mentioned, but the story is 'kay. It really is a story that should've been in a game with a more serious tone since it is rather sad. I think tomorrow I'll beat the final boss and then start NG+.

 

[CryptRat]

The extra benefit you get from abusing a weakness is a Boost status. While in this state, it means that you are guaranteed first action next turn and the skill you will select have no SP or HP cost. Receiving damage while in Boost status make you lose it. That's an interesting system and it enhances the tactics quite a lot so far.

I can't understand why so much games keeps going on with only the "it's super effective"/"it's not effective" instead of that kind of thing.
That could become a standard, since it makes the combat system so much better.
I really enjoyed both Digital Devil Saga, and the weakness system is probably, with the general atmosphere, one of the best points.

 

[Hobo Elf]

Digital Devil Saga uses the same Press Turn system as Nocturne so you should give it a try, if you already haven't. You will most likely like it as well

 

[CryptRat]

Nocturne is one of my favourite games. I will have to play it again to access the true ending.

 

[Hobo Elf]

I was naive to expect that it would have been a fast trip into the top level of the last dungeon. In any case I managed to finish the game. Great game, great final boss fight, nice ending, can't wait for NG+. I'm glad I got at least one challenging game from Atlus this year because YHWH knows SMT4 didn't cut the bacon.

 

[Hitoshura]

I was naive to expect that it would have been a fast trip into the top level of the last dungeon. In any case I managed to finish the game. Great game, great final boss fight, nice ending, can't wait for NG+. I'm glad I got at least one challenging game from Atlus this year because YHWH knows SMT4 didn't cut the bacon.

Glad to hear that the game remain challenging up to the end. The difficulty curve of SMT4 was pretty bad, at the start it was pretty hard and then suddenly, the game becomes very easy. One of the reason it became so easy is that you can assign inheritance skills manually from fusions and the game didn't add anything to counter balance this effect of "power gaming" across several generation of demon fusions. I was worried seeing this mechanism in Persona Q as well as it could end up break the game in the same way.

Another design change in Persona Q is that unlike Persona 3 and 4, the strategy for most random battle was to down all your opponents and then do an All Out Attack (AOA) to finish them off, no longer exists in Persona Q. Basically, hitting an enemy weakness no longer guarantee a down status, my guesstimate is that it happens about 1/3 of the time. Additionally, you don't get a AOA if all enemies are down, it's now a random event that seems to occur more frequently based on the number of downed enemies as well as the number of your party members in Boost status. Some will probably not like this change but I think it put more emphasis on tactics than before.

The extra benefit you get from abusing a weakness is a Boost status. While in this state, it means that you are guaranteed first action next turn and the skill you will select have no SP or HP cost. Receiving damage while in Boost status make you lose it. That's an interesting system and it enhances the tactics quite a lot so far.

I can't understand why so much games keeps going on with only the "it's super effective"/"it's not effective" instead of that kind of thing.
That could become a standard, since it makes the combat system so much better.
I really enjoyed both Digital Devil Saga, and the weakness system is probably, with the general atmosphere, one of the best points.

It's hard to understand why some new great game mechanism catches on while other gets ignored. We can't blame the obscurity of Atlus games anymore, most RPG designers probably played at least one modern SMT game or spinoff at this point. My guess is that developers who do turn based RPGs probably try to carter to nostalgic fans and there's a vocal minority(?) that don't like these fights so they don't spend much design emphasis on them, as long as the game gets going by selecting constantly "fight, fight, heal".

<clueless>After all, turn based games are over with the constant stream of high quality AAA real time systems out there so there's no point in trying to innovate turn based games.</clueless>

 

[Hobo Elf]

I'm a little bit surprised that there aren't other developers who try to ape SMTs battle systems. It offers a great level of customization, they always put a fun and unique spin on the main characters mechanics and how he learns his skills and they have a lot more tactical depth than pretty much all the other RPGs out there.

 

[Hitoshura]

I agree, I would ever say that they are the undisputed king of blobber battle system at this point. Sadly, I don't think that a battle system no matter how innovative or great it is will sell significantly more copies.

SMT got a good boost of popularity with the release of Persona 3, it was also my first SMT. While this game includes many great ideas from Nocturne for the battle system, if you were to ask outside the codex why people love Persona 3 and 4 I bet they would say the anime story or the social link before any actual gameplay characteristics.

Hell, even on the codex there's a similar trend, the top voted RPGs here are games with notoriously weak battle systems. RPGs compete on many different aspect, the battle system is only one of them and it is often forgotten.

 

[Kuhrazy]

I've never played a Persona game* and I just want a dungeon crawler, is this a spectacularly bad place to start?

*but I've played a few SMTs

 

[Hobo Elf]

It's a good as any place to start. Etrian Odyssey 4 and Soul Hackers for the 3DS are both fine places to start as well.

 

[Martius]

Actually its good place since its based on other Atlus series Etrian Odyssey which is actually pretty good dungeon crawler. Maybe even that series would fit you better if you dont care for things like battle systems with some Persona elements or little fan service.

 

[Kuhrazy]

Well the thing is I already have EA IV and Soul Hackers, and Strange Journey, and Dark Spire

 

[Martius]

Well, if you liked EO4 then Q is safe bet. To be fair you could pick up also remake of first EO and sooner (for US) second one or later (for Europe).

 

[SCO]

Avoid this crap like the plague.

I speak as a person that has read over 60 Persona fanfics here.