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Pillars of Eternity Thread [Pre-Expansion]

VentilatorOfDoom

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Issues persist with the difficulty curve post the early game, admittedly. However, the IE games were a complete snoozefest and far easier by comparison.
This is wrong. After finishing PotD I installed IWD and played that game the last few days on the highest difficulty level. While you can defeat a lot of encounters before they even reach you, if you have ranged weapons equiped, there are enough encounters that force you to releoad, find a better strategy or even to just run away, heal up, come back later. In the entirety of PoE I was never forced to reload more than once for a specific encounter*, not even in the Adra dragon fight. Sometimes you might get surprised or you fuck up and have to reload and then get it right the second time. But when that happens it's usually not because the encounter is hard, but just because you did a clear error which you won't repeat a second time. Compare with IWD. Whether it's the mummy you try to kill with a +1 short sword without getting raped because you don't have magical ammo in the beginning of the game, whether it's sword and phase spiders swarming your party in Dragons Eye, with the sword spider hitting like a truck, or goblin or elven sharpshooters in the hand of the seldarin which fucking rape your party in seconds and force you to retreat through the exit. Heck, even the 4 bronze sentries you encounter when leaving the tiers of dead after killing the lich gave me more trouble than anything in PoE. And IWD is on the easy side when it comes to IE games. PoE's difficulty can't be compared to the IE games at all, that's one of the reasons why it has so many favorable mainstream reviews.

* one exception: when trying to reach the companions asap without leveling up, fighting the shades and Maerwald in Caed Nua with an underleveled party with only starting equip required more reloads
 

Ziem

Arbiter
Joined
May 17, 2014
Messages
324
petrify it with wizards gaze of the adragan or with the trap. follow up with anything.
 

ArchAngel

Arcane
Joined
Mar 16, 2015
Messages
19,969
petrify it with wizards gaze of the adragan or with the trap. follow up with anything.
The Dragon has 130+ defenses on Hard (probably much more on PotD) and your lvl 12 wizard will have maybe 100 accuracy with buffs at lvl 12. It is far from a guaranteed way to beat the Dragon in one try.
 

VentilatorOfDoom

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, not even in the Adra dragon fight.
You could give me some tips for that, because I'm constantly getting my ass handed to me.
I can tell you what I did on PotD. I did not use traps or paralyze spells. I had Eder, PC (fighter dps with defender modal on) , Grieving Mother, Aloth, Durance and Hiravias. I crafted foot items to increase all kinds of stats for the entire party, incl. one that increases movement speed, this helps right at the beginning of the fight. Eder was built for tanking, i.e. he used super tower shield, had Weapon&Shield style and Superior Reflection feats, the defender modal + the wary defender upgrade for it and so. The point is to get one character with high deflection to tank the dragon. Use potions of displaced image and scrolls of defense to increase his defense further as soon as the fight starts. The sequence of action was this:
- finish talking, have Eder run up to the dragon and attack once to become enganged then drink a potion of displaced image, when he is finished with the potion use a scroll of defense
- everybody else runs towards where the Xaurips spawn (but not quite the entire way, stop a few meters before) , you just have to be somewhat sidewards from the dragon outside of tail-whip reach
- use 2 summoning items, one to summon stuff behind the dragon where 2 adragans are, the other where the Xaurips are
- the 2 adragans at the front of the dragon attacked Eder and eventually died to a dragon breath
- buff up with protection from fear, devotions of the faithful, potions of alacrity or whatever else strikes your fancy, while your DPS start killing Xaurips; I just had Hiravias and Aloth go all out on them with chain-lightning and fire bug which killed the Xaurips rather quickly
- as soon as the first tail-whip occured (keep an eye on that) you can have Durance run up to Eder and cast crowns of the faithful, Eders delection score was 196 at that point. Durance needs to come back then to not get insta-gibbed by a tail-whip
- kill the 2 adragans behind the dragon, before I approached them and the dragon with my fighter I used a potion of displaced image on her too, to not get killed from a tail-whip, spam slicken with Aloth on the adragans if you have to
- when everything was dead I just attacked the dragon, use spells that deal raw damage, druid has those , disintegrate from cypher etc, when the dragon died the duration of the displaced image potion on Eder hadn't run out, so the fight doesn't take long
 

ArchAngel

Arcane
Joined
Mar 16, 2015
Messages
19,969
You only need to score a graze.
Graze will last like 5seconds. And the Dragon is not the biggest problem in that fight, I had more problems with the adragons and shamans that would petrify or charm/dominate/confuse your party.
 

Roguey

Codex Staff
Staff Member
Sawyerite
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May 29, 2010
Messages
35,771
So Diablo 3's success is due to Jay Wilson because he was the lead? It must be because Diablo 3 sold over 3.5 million in its first 24 hours!

Would it not be the case that PoE sold well because players thought they would get something similar to the IE games? Just like Diablo 3?

Both the metacritic and Steam user ratings suggest most people felt they reached that goal. Then you look at D3's metacritic user rating and see something that wasn't received well. :M
 

Immortal

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Safe Space - Don't Bulli
The same way you've dodged the dumbfuck tag I'd guess. :M

Same two people instant brofisting too.. :lol:

So Diablo 3's success is due to Jay Wilson because he was the lead? It must be because Diablo 3 sold over 3.5 million in its first 24 hours!

Would it not be the case that PoE sold well because players thought they would get something similar to the IE games? Just like Diablo 3?

Both the metacritic and Steam user ratings suggest most people felt they reached that goal. Then you look at D3's metacritic user rating and see something that wasn't received well. :M

:roll:
 
Last edited:

J_C

One Bit Studio
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Project: Eternity Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath
, not even in the Adra dragon fight.
You could give me some tips for that, because I'm constantly getting my ass handed to me.
I can tell you what I did on PotD. I did not use traps or paralyze spells. I had Eder, PC (fighter dps with defender modal on) , Grieving Mother, Aloth, Durance and Hiravias. I crafted foot items to increase all kinds of stats for the entire party, incl. one that increases movement speed, this helps right at the beginning of the fight. Eder was built for tanking, i.e. he used super tower shield, had Weapon&Shield style and Superior Reflection feats, the defender modal + the wary defender upgrade for it and so. The point is to get one character with high deflection to tank the dragon. Use potions of displaced image and scrolls of defense to increase his defense further as soon as the fight starts. The sequence of action was this:
- finish talking, have Eder run up to the dragon and attack once to become enganged then drink a potion of displaced image, when he is finished with the potion use a scroll of defense
- everybody else runs towards where the Xaurips spawn (but not quite the entire way, stop a few meters before) , you just have to be somewhat sidewards from the dragon outside of tail-whip reach
- use 2 summoning items, one to summon stuff behind the dragon where 2 adragans are, the other where the Xaurips are
- the 2 adragans at the front of the dragon attacked Eder and eventually died to a dragon breath
- buff up with protection from fear, devotions of the faithful, potions of alacrity or whatever else strikes your fancy, while your DPS start killing Xaurips; I just had Hiravias and Aloth go all out on them with chain-lightning and fire bug which killed the Xaurips rather quickly
- as soon as the first tail-whip occured (keep an eye on that) you can have Durance run up to Eder and cast crowns of the faithful, Eders delection score was 196 at that point. Durance needs to come back then to not get insta-gibbed by a tail-whip
- kill the 2 adragans behind the dragon, before I approached them and the dragon with my fighter I used a potion of displaced image on her too, to not get killed from a tail-whip, spam slicken with Aloth on the adragans if you have to
- when everything was dead I just attacked the dragon, use spells that deal raw damage, druid has those , disintegrate from cypher etc, when the dragon died the duration of the displaced image potion on Eder hadn't run out, so the fight doesn't take long
Well, I just killed the dragon, although I have no idea how it happened. :D I got owned by it several times, I tried several tactics, I was at the point of giving up and not finishing the quest. And suddenly this happened: I casted gaze of the dragon on it by Aloth. I hit it, and it got paralyzed for 14 seconds. I thought that this wouldn't help me too much, because after the 14 seconds, it will kill me with 1 breath attack, as it did a dozen times before. But after 5 seconds of hitting it with basic attacks, it just dropped. And I was like, what the fuck happened. I checked the combat log, and appearently Kana hit it for 211 damage with an arbalest, Edér hit it for 87 and Grieving Mother for 90. No crits, just regular hits, although my rolls were very lucky, between 90-98.

Now I'm not a mechanics guy in RPGs, I'm not constantly looking at the battle log to see and analyze every hit. But how the fuck is damage computed in this game? 211 damage from an Arbalest, which only has a damage of (30-40)+25%fire+25%corrode? That's 40+10+10 at best, or am I not getting something? The same goes for the other 2 character's damage.
 

ArchAngel

Arcane
Joined
Mar 16, 2015
Messages
19,969
, not even in the Adra dragon fight.
You could give me some tips for that, because I'm constantly getting my ass handed to me.
I can tell you what I did on PotD. I did not use traps or paralyze spells. I had Eder, PC (fighter dps with defender modal on) , Grieving Mother, Aloth, Durance and Hiravias. I crafted foot items to increase all kinds of stats for the entire party, incl. one that increases movement speed, this helps right at the beginning of the fight. Eder was built for tanking, i.e. he used super tower shield, had Weapon&Shield style and Superior Reflection feats, the defender modal + the wary defender upgrade for it and so. The point is to get one character with high deflection to tank the dragon. Use potions of displaced image and scrolls of defense to increase his defense further as soon as the fight starts. The sequence of action was this:
- finish talking, have Eder run up to the dragon and attack once to become enganged then drink a potion of displaced image, when he is finished with the potion use a scroll of defense
- everybody else runs towards where the Xaurips spawn (but not quite the entire way, stop a few meters before) , you just have to be somewhat sidewards from the dragon outside of tail-whip reach
- use 2 summoning items, one to summon stuff behind the dragon where 2 adragans are, the other where the Xaurips are
- the 2 adragans at the front of the dragon attacked Eder and eventually died to a dragon breath
- buff up with protection from fear, devotions of the faithful, potions of alacrity or whatever else strikes your fancy, while your DPS start killing Xaurips; I just had Hiravias and Aloth go all out on them with chain-lightning and fire bug which killed the Xaurips rather quickly
- as soon as the first tail-whip occured (keep an eye on that) you can have Durance run up to Eder and cast crowns of the faithful, Eders delection score was 196 at that point. Durance needs to come back then to not get insta-gibbed by a tail-whip
- kill the 2 adragans behind the dragon, before I approached them and the dragon with my fighter I used a potion of displaced image on her too, to not get killed from a tail-whip, spam slicken with Aloth on the adragans if you have to
- when everything was dead I just attacked the dragon, use spells that deal raw damage, druid has those , disintegrate from cypher etc, when the dragon died the duration of the displaced image potion on Eder hadn't run out, so the fight doesn't take long
Well, I just killed the dragon, although I have no idea how it happened. :D I got owned by it several times, I tried several tactics, I was at the point of giving up and not finishing the quest. And suddenly this happened: I casted gaze of the dragon on it by Aloth. I hit it, and it got paralyzed for 14 seconds. I thought that this wouldn't help me too much, because after the 14 seconds, it will kill me with 1 breath attack, as it did a dozen times before. But after 5 seconds of hitting it with basic attacks, it just dropped. And I was like, what the fuck happened. I checked the combat log, and appearently Kana hit it for 211 damage with an arbalest, Edér hit it for 87 and Grieving Mother for 90. No crits, just regular hits, although my rolls were very lucky, between 90-98.

Now I'm not a mechanics guy in RPGs, I'm not constantly looking at the battle log to see and analyze every hit. But how the fuck is damage computed in this game? 211 damage from an Arbalest, which only has a damage of (30-40)+25%fire+25%corrode? That's 40+10+10 at best, or am I not getting something? The same goes for the other 2 character's damage.
Petrified enemies receive 4x normal damage in patch 1.04 and 2x normal damage in 1.05
 

Athelas

Arcane
Joined
Jun 24, 2013
Messages
4,502
So now it will take 4 seconds to kill a petrified enemy instead of 2 seconds. Oh, the horror.
 

LeJosh

Savant
Joined
Feb 23, 2013
Messages
434
Location
Edinburgh
Decided to fire up my save game from a long break, I like what they have added, muh poor cipher mc is getting bopped about in the nerf department however.

Yay for a slight increase in endurance for my fully ranged cipher... overall though my party hasn't suffered immediately, from a glance.

Font scaling is a massive pro imo, 130% makes things look much more organised.

Is everyone supposed to be level 7 by mid act 2 though? I'm on the 6th floor of Od Nua and I feel hella op.
 

Infinitron

I post news
Staff Member
Joined
Jan 28, 2011
Messages
97,403
Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
http://www.theguardian.com/technolo...t-matter-if-people-dont-finish-games-any-more

Does it matter if people don’t finish games any more?

Just 6.4% of players who have bought role-playing adventure Pillars of Eternity have actually completed it, according to the PC gaming service, Steam. This critically acclaimed throwback to genre classics like Baldur’s Gate and Icewind Dale returns us to a period in which playing games was a much more demanding experience. I finished Pillars of Eternity a few weeks ago and the experience has left me crushed.

Does it matter that people don’t finish games anymore? Because they do not. Apparently only 15% finished Alien Isolation. Deus Ex: Human revolution stands at about 25%, while Bioshock manages a more respectable 35.9%. With Bungie’s online shooter Destiny, there’s a large percentage who have never actually played the game co-operatively, or seen the end game content – and only 15% have completed a raid.

Of course, measuring all of this is difficult as the figures shift according to genre and the meaning of the term “finishing a game”. With Pillars of Eternity, a workable definition is completing the core narrative in a single-player campaign and receiving an achievement. A month after release, most people haven’t done that – and that is hardly surprising.

Finishing a long RPG can be a commitment that means ignoring new releases, other ways to spend your free time (including the myriad gadgets and social media sites competing for our attention), and indeed, ignoring the rest of life altogether. With 100-plus hours of content, Pillars of Eternity is a major commitment.

It is, in some ways, a sort of oddity in a world that tends to converge on a game for a few days before leaving it for the next big title. Pillars of Eternity is built around a vast and amazing core narrative, complete with fascinating side-quests. You’re at your leisure to complete the main campaign – or you can just murder key NPCs and see where that takes you (although unlike other old-time RPGs such as Morrowind you can’t carry on down your merry murderous path forever).

It’s the stories that make it so brilliantly engrossing, though – yet those final moments that lead to a personalised conclusion based on the actions and decisions you inflict on the world, are seen by so few.

Characters v story
Let’s consider Divinity: Original Sin, an RPG that looks similar to Pillars of Eternity but shares little else. The story tone is different and the combat is turn-based. Despite being released last year, only 5.6% of Steam players have fully completed the game. Again, as an RPG this is a game built around a story with narrative threads that eventually need to be sewn together. But if only 5.6% of people actually see the end, does that mean role-playing titles are actually more about their character levelling and progression mechanics than the actual story?

Rather than reaching the end of narrative decision-trees that have been built up throughout the story or witnessing the journeys that allied NPCs make as you drag them on your character’s own vain quests, will most players just focus on slaughtering NPCs for XP then gathering up loot?
I loved Baldur’s Gate and I love Pillars of Eternity, but I had to make time in my diary and force myself to keep going to finish it. As a player, I want to see every possible outcome, every dialogue reaction to a situation that departs from the standard “good hero fights evil villain” narrative, every subquest that nudges you into a morally ambiguous act.

This is not the game’s fault; it is mine and it means finishing a game like Pillars of Eternity takes a lot of time. It is also mentally taxing: Pillars of Eternity uses exquisite dialogue and written cues to show how characters react, which means the player has to use his or her imagination to “see” most of the game. That is not something most gamers are used to these days.

Games spell things out for us now. Even in a title as detailed and character driven as Dragon Age: Inquisition I’ll see a villain doing villainous things as they spout villainous words because they’re a villain and that’s what villains do. I don’t have to use my imagination to see the subtext behind their actions, to gauge why what they’re doing matters to them.

‘Leap of faith’
Most modern games don’t ask the player to interpret the wry smile on another character’s face. The narratives are built on enjoyment and, as games are chiefly meant for recreation rather than as a test of emotional intelligence, there’s nothing wrong with that. Old-time RPGs did not adhere to that idea: back then, “fun” was what you made it and you were not guaranteed to have any.

If you want enjoyment out of the genre classics, you have to commit to the world that the game presents to you; it’s a leap of faith. And given the difficulty of grasping Advanced Dungeons & Dragons mechanics in a game like Baldur’s Gate, for example, you’re not always guaranteed to land in a wagon of hay.

There is a point in Pillars of Eternity where you’re given the option to fight an insanely difficult battle, or to make a morally dubious decision, avoid the fight and still get what you want. Normally I’d save a file, follow one decision tree and then go back and follow another. But I was too tired for another difficult fight by this point in the game and I enjoyed the outcome of my decision so much I just accepted it. I’m fairly sure I know the outcome of what would have happened if I’d have fought, but at the same time I don’t really know.

Maybe knowing and seeing everything are less important these days; maybe we are different now. But I don’t regret chasing Pillars of Eternity to its end – even if it did take forever.

:M
 

vonAchdorf

Arcane
Joined
Sep 20, 2014
Messages
13,465


I think the article is pretty good considering it's from the Guardian of all rags. No wonder that guy is only employed as comment remover community manager and doesn't even have an author page even though he regularity writes articles about games.
 

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