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KickStarter Poll - Best Tomb Raider

Which is in your opinion the best Tomb Raider game?


  • Total voters
    162

Bad Sector

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A: Toby Gard merely meant her to be "curvy" and "athletic" and not sexualized - that the latter was all Eidos' marketing department's doing,

The way internet discussion always goes it may have people thinking the game was an early 3D sleaze-fest which is not the case, and it really doesn't need to be an eternal discussion. You could replace Lara with some male generic bland Indiana Jones wannabe and it would hardly impact the appeal and value of the game.

Toby Gard certainly made Lara Croft sexy, but the marketing department focused on that aspect so hard to the point where there was practically nothing else beyond from how sexy Lara is. Which is completely misleading towards the game itself since as Ash mentions you could replace Lara with anyone else - male or female, ugly or sexy - and the game would be the same.
 

Morpheus Kitami

Liturgist
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For me, all of the Greece levels in OG TR.
Oh, yeah, from that hub area with all the cool puzzles, especially the sword one, to the Midas Statue, to the arena, all of that section was gold.
Toby Gard certainly made Lara Croft sexy, but the marketing department focused on that aspect so hard to the point where there was practically nothing else beyond from how sexy Lara is. Which is completely misleading towards the game itself since as Ash mentions you could replace Lara with anyone else - male or female, ugly or sexy - and the game would be the same.
I seem to recall someone, probably around here, once said that Tomb Raider was just a 3D version of one of Core's earlier games, Rick Dangerous, I do believe. Haven't played it myself, but I have noticed some similarities between 2D cinematic platformers and Tomb Raider, IIRC the portable titles were cinematic platformers, at least during the Game Boy-era.
Actually speaking about the sexy discussion, wasn't there another rumor that Lara Croft was based on some dude's sister and that's why he was pissed?
 

Ed123

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For me, all of the Greece levels in OG TR.
Oh, yeah, from that hub area with all the cool puzzles, especially the sword one, to the Midas Statue, to the arena, all of that section was gold.
Toby Gard certainly made Lara Croft sexy, but the marketing department focused on that aspect so hard to the point where there was practically nothing else beyond from how sexy Lara is. Which is completely misleading towards the game itself since as Ash mentions you could replace Lara with anyone else - male or female, ugly or sexy - and the game would be the same.
I seem to recall someone, probably around here, once said that Tomb Raider was just a 3D version of one of Core's earlier games, Rick Dangerous, I do believe. Haven't played it myself, but I have noticed some similarities between 2D cinematic platformers and Tomb Raider, IIRC the portable titles were cinematic platformers, at least during the Game Boy-era.
Actually speaking about the sexy discussion, wasn't there another rumor that Lara Croft was based on some dude's sister and that's why he was pissed?

Gard supposedly put a little bit of his sister into Lara. But there's really no "one" inspiration for Croft, Core have said everything from a pop singer(forgot her name) to Tank Girl were a big influence on her design. And as I said, Gard's former boss and one of his coworkers called bullshit in a more recent Eurogamer retrospective. Apparently Gard had a whole bunch of ideas for marketing Lara in a "cinematic" style and there was a lot of friction between him and the marketing department, who believed he was encroaching on their turf, so to speak. Gard had basically zero experience before Tomb Raider - his old boss actually said something like "this guy was sketching on the back of cigarette boxes before I gave him a chance". It sounds like he was getting to be a bit of a diva, and when Tomb Raider finally came out Gard was aggressively headhunted by places like Shiny, which naturally fed his ego and led to a bad relationship with the rest of Core during his final days there.
 

Bad Sector

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I seem to recall someone, probably around here, once said that Tomb Raider was just a 3D version of one of Core's earlier games, Rick Dangerous, I do believe.
Actually, it's more like a 3D version of Prince of Persia.

Yes that is exactly what i was about to write too, Tomb Raider is basically Prince of Persia with guns.

(and guns work as well in TR as swords in PoP - ie. they are both clunky as fuck)

Which is interesting considering Prince of Persia 3D failed despite essentially being Tomb Raider in a (romanticized) 1001 nights setting (main reason IMO being that while the controls were animation-driven like Tomb Raider and even had similar keyboard controls, the animations were too "verbose" and often unnecessary - like having a drop down animation for a tiny fall which took away control from the player until the animation finished - which gave the entire game a very clunky feeling, though if you could get used to that it is a neat TR clone).
 

Ash

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Given how popular Tomb Raider used to be it is surprising how little love it gets these days in terms of community content, discussion frequency, and revival of its particular style of design. I think it's because a lot of people bought the game, but few actually ever completed it. It was and still is somewhat hardcore, and handling the controls is certainly not something just anyone can do, even though they're actually quite intuitive and well designed.
 

Ed123

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Given how popular Tomb Raider used to be it is surprising how little love it gets these days in terms of community content, discussion frequency, and revival of its particular style of design. I think it's because a lot of people bought the game, but few actually ever completed it. It was and still is somewhat hardcore, and handling the controls is certainly not something just anyone can do, even though they're actually quite intuitive and well designed.

There are people working on OpenLara and the leaked PSP game right now though. And having a fansite like tombraiderforums still going after all this time is more than most games have.
 

catfood

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In a strange turn of events the PC version turned out to be superior precisely because it does not have a soundtrack playing in the background. The ambient sounds create a very unique atmosphere and you feel that you are actually alone in an isolated place which gave the game an extra boost to immersion.
 

SumDrunkGuy

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I think you misunderstood me. Of course she was designed in a sexualised manner, yet the end result was never actually sexy

So you admit that the original games were complete failures.
 

Lemming42

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People nowadays tend to underestimate the impact Lara Croft had culturally at the time. Here in the UK they even changed the name of Lucozade, the popular innard-rotting energy drink, to Larazade, and had Lara's dorky-looking FMV model on the bottle. The character is (or, was) such a big deal over here that some shitty council even named a street after her. Lara Croft was one of those moments where gaming somehow broke through into the mainstream, to the point where your grandma had vaguely heard of Lara Croft in the same way she'd vaguely heard of Mario. Back when gaming was still relatively underground and niche (though obviously, by the time of the PS1, it was starting to seriously seep over into the mainstream), you'd be able to talk about Lara Croft with kids at school who didn't play games, because they just knew who she was from cultural crossover.

The character also drew a female audience to the game, and to gaming in general. I remember back in the day a large portion of the online TR fan community was female (including the legendary Stella, who's walkthroughs have never been bested).

I'm not really sure they marketed the first game as a sleazefest. The second game, though, had a bunch of utterly cringeworthy "sexy" 3D renders to advertise it, and it was even worse for the third game. The games themselves were mercifully free of it (barring the joke at the end of TR2, which is clearly meant to be funny rather than titillating), but if anything, I think the dodgy marketing campaigns just put a lot of people off actually playing.
 

Ash

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In a strange turn of events the PC version turned out to be superior precisely because it does not have a soundtrack playing in the background. The ambient sounds create a very unique atmosphere and you feel that you are actually alone in an isolated place which gave the game an extra boost to immersion.

Calling complete bullshit. The soundtrack in OG Tomb raider's played in very specific spots, at most once per trigger, typically for no more than a minute, and no more than one or two triggers per level. There was hardly any music as-is, but when it did play it added a lot to the atmosphere and mood. And added some much needed variety. People like you is why games do not have soundtracks anymore. Cunt. There was hardly ever music playing in the game as-is, but you don't seem to get that. Like, of a 15 hour playthrough, 20 minutes is music time. The vast majority of time is spent listening to those illusive ambient sounds you speak of, that apparently could not be appreciated because of the soundtrack. Removing it adds nothing but decline, it was removed for technical reasons.

The game's music was so powerful and impacting the very few times it did appear.



Jesus titty fucking christ that is some good shit.

I think you misunderstood me. Of course she was designed in a sexualised manner, yet the end result was never actually sexy

So you admit that the original games were complete failures.

Calling complete bullshit. Only retards would assess a game's success on the basis of sexy or not sexy. I know the only reason you aren't a virgin is because you pay for it (you basically admit that in your sig lol), but come on, there is more to life than sexy or not sexy. I have two metrics for success: is it good (artistic success), and did it sell well (financial success). That's it. Guess what retard, it was both.
 
Last edited:

Ash

Arcane
Joined
Oct 16, 2015
Messages
4,741
Given how popular Tomb Raider used to be it is surprising how little love it gets these days in terms of community content, discussion frequency, and revival of its particular style of design. I think it's because a lot of people bought the game, but few actually ever completed it. It was and still is somewhat hardcore, and handling the controls is certainly not something just anyone can do, even though they're actually quite intuitive and well designed.

There are people working on OpenLara and the leaked PSP game right now though. And having a fansite like tombraiderforums still going after all this time is more than most games have.

True. I just rarely see classic raider respect these days, and while there is a community it is small and slow-moving. Probably because they're console games-first and no source was ever released. Imagining the possibilities of mods, source ports etc and bustling legacy that could have blossomed after 20+ years is a real shame.
 

Neuromancer

Savant
Joined
Jun 10, 2018
Messages
781

In a strange turn of events the PC version turned out to be superior precisely because it does not have a soundtrack playing in the background. The ambient sounds create a very unique atmosphere and you feel that you are actually alone in an isolated place which gave the game an extra boost to immersion.

The musical and ambient soundtracks in the PSX and PC version are basically similar; the PSX version features the atmospherical sounds as well.
The difference is, that the PC version is missing some small musical cues, e.g. one that triggers, when the wolves run up the stairs in level 1.

So, in that way the PSX version is actually superior to the original PC version.


But the TombATI installer I already posted earlier contains these missing music cues and restores the PC version to its full musical glory!
:D
 
Last edited:

Melcar

Arcane
Joined
Oct 20, 2008
Messages
32,095
Location
Merida, again
Given how popular Tomb Raider used to be it is surprising how little love it gets these days in terms of community content, discussion frequency, and revival of its particular style of design. I think it's because a lot of people bought the game, but few actually ever completed it. It was and still is somewhat hardcore, and handling the controls is certainly not something just anyone can do, even though they're actually quite intuitive and well designed.

There are people working on OpenLara and the leaked PSP game right now though. And having a fansite like tombraiderforums still going after all this time is more than most games have.

True. I just rarely see classic raider respect these days, and while there is a community it is small and slow-moving. Probably because they're console games-first and no source was ever released. Imagining the possibilities of mods, source ports etc and bustling legacy that could have blossomed after 20+ years is a real shame.

At least we have the porn.
 

Bad Sector

Arcane
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Insert Title Here RPG Wokedex
PC also lacks the golden Lara death animation.

You mean the one where
Lara turns into gold if she touches Midas' hand?
IIRC it is in the PC version (i haven't played the PSX version and i remember dying by that once :-P).
 

Morpheus Kitami

Liturgist
Joined
May 14, 2020
Messages
1,799
Calling complete bullshit. The soundtrack in OG Tomb raider's played in very specific spots, at most once per trigger, typically for no more than a minute, and no more than one or two triggers per level. There was hardly any music as-is, but when it did play it added a lot to the atmosphere and mood. And added some much needed variety. People like you is why games do not have soundtracks anymore. Cunt. There was hardly ever music playing in the game as-is, but you don't seem to get that. Like, of a 15 hour playthrough, 20 minutes is music time. The vast majority of time is spent listening to those illusive ambient sounds you speak of, that apparently could not be appreciated because of the soundtrack. Removing it adds nothing but decline, it was removed for technical reasons.
If he played it in DOSbox, he might not have had the music working. Speaking from my experiences, TR 1 is a pain to get the music working in DOS, and I remember basically not getting any the last couple of times I played, denying me that sweet, sweet menu theme. :negative:
 

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