Editorial RPG Codex Report: PAX East 2015, or How Chris Avellone Called the Codex Unprofessional

[General Maxson]

Thanks mindx2, great interview! I wish I could hang out with my heroes, they really seem great! Tim Cain

 

[AW8]

That was a great read, mindx2.

You're a True OG.

 

[Morkar Left]

Great read. Thanks for the article!


And I wanted to go early to bed today...

I decided to go in search of a motorized scooter as I had done the previous year. With one of those I could basically LARP Carmaggedon to make my way through the crowds. Unfortunately, that plan quickly evaporated when I learned that scooters weren’t free this year, and that it now cost $100 to rent one for the day! I thought the cab fare was steep, but the Boston convention center was fully embracing capitalism this year.

Well, next time we should make a codex fundraiser for mindx2. I have this picture in my mind from a manically laughing and honking codexer who is driving game journalists before him while an attached codex banner is flying in the head wind.


Josh Sawyer actually has hair and smiles in the picture

 

[Obsequious Approbation]

You have actually trained me to be calm about these things. I’m like, “Well, it’s not as bad as the Codex so I really don’t care what you’re saying because you’re not as bad as the Codex.”

To heartless critics, and mindx2 in particular!

 

[Infinitron]

Problem: The Codex didn't exist when Fallout 2 was released.

I wonder what game he actually meant, or maybe he meant another forum.

 

[Ninjerk]

Problem: The Codex didn't exist when Fallout 2 was released.

I wonder what game he actually meant, or maybe he meant another forum.

Now we really have something to bitch at them about.

 

[Cosmo]

Am i the only one who spat his Mountain Dew when Tim Cain said he owned the fucking ToEE code ?!
FFS we need a kickstarter or a fundraiser to recreate assets and expand on it ! Don't you think we could use a turn-based Neverwinter Nights, supporting fan-made modules and all ?
And may i remind you all that ToEE's code was based on Arcanum's ?

 

[Jedi Master Radek]

It's the most positive, even joyful, Codex thread ever. The clear sign the decline had been finally slayed and the RPG Reneissance had triumphed! I wish all developers interviews were amazing like this. And if Tim Cain, Chris Avellone and Adam Brennecke are really reading this thread, then I want to thank You for all Your contributions towards our glorious genre, past,present and future. And I urge to finally register!

 

[mastroego]

Yes, he was talking about it as if it was a bad thing to "fix".
I wasn't "larping", I was putting things in way that pleased me and getting a PROPER response from the virtual world.
Like, having less CON meant that I had to adapt and use tactics that still might see my frail poor fighter come out on top, use equipment that I hadn't used in previous playthroughs, and so on.
In a word, having fun, which is why I bother with games to begin with.

Your previous post said: 'A game where stats still behave in a way that makes sense'.
This doesn't describe Baldur's Gate where a 3/3/3 int/wis/cha fighter will have virtually the same experience as a 18/18/18 int/wis/cha fighter (except for shop discounts, whoop di doo).
How is this a 'a PROPER response from the virtual world'?

The systems were crude, granted.
But at least they weren't ass-backwards. And if some even were, they weren't made so on purpose.

 

[Zep Zepo]

Great read. Thanks for the article!


And I wanted to go early to bed today...

I decided to go in search of a motorized scooter as I had done the previous year. With one of those I could basically LARP Carmaggedon to make my way through the crowds. Unfortunately, that plan quickly evaporated when I learned that scooters weren’t free this year, and that it now cost $100 to rent one for the day! I thought the cab fare was steep, but the Boston convention center was fully embracing capitalism this year.

Well, next time we should make a codex fundraiser for mindx2. I have this picture in my mind from a manically laughing and honking codexer who is driving game journalists before him while an attached codex banner is flying in the head wind.


Josh Sawyer actually has hair and smiles in the picture

Yeah..i mean...charging an exorbitant fee..that sounds like it goes against the ADA laws or something.

Zep--

 

[Zorba the Hutt]

The Obsidian crew came across very well but I did have to chuckle at the thought that, for all their talk of old Codex accounts just waiting to be reactivated... the interview was arranged by a kindly PR guy from a publisher.

 

[MTwolves]

Great report, mindx2. Thank you.

I wonder if a sci-fi RPG based on the Hindu-Buddhist pantheon will ever get made.
I know that Tim Cain has mentioned being interested in a RPG based on Roger Zelazny's Lord of Light a couple of times before.
Having read the book and played Tim's games, I would fund the game in a heartbeat if it ever went up on Kickstarter.

I just don't know how many other people would fund it. It's a fairly novel and creative concept.

 

[MTwolves]

Am i the only one who spat his Mountain Dew when Tim Cain said he owned the fucking ToEE code ?!
FFS we need a kickstarter or a fundraiser to recreate assets and expand on it ! Don't you think we could use a turn-based Neverwinter Nights, supporting fan-made modules and all ?
And may i remind you all that ToEE's code was based on Arcanum's ?

Anything that Tim Cain designed, I would automatically buy.
Troika was short-lived and its games were flawed, but Arcanum, Masquerade and TOEE rank among the finest RPGs I have ever played.

 

[Zep Zepo]

Let's also try to get him a "service honey badger" next time!





Zep--

 

[Blackstaff]

That was seriously amazing !

Truly awesome read.

 

[mastroego]

FYI, if having a sub-par character is what makes a game fun for you, you can build one in PoE by simply not using all of your available attribute points in character creation. No meaningless 18 Charisma stat dump required.

I know I'm repeating the concept, but well.
I also played with a sub-par character. A challenge I could create without breaking the immersion of the world, since stuff generally made sense in BG.
Like, less physically powerful characters being easier to kill by armed foes.

Sawyer only thinks in terms of mechanics, ones that behave illogically with the virtual world he's trying to sell on top of that. And he doesn't care because it's a "game" and it must be balanced, whatever that may mean in his mind. And he doesn't even like the true masterpieces that allowed his own game to get funded to begin with.
He's clueless, I stand by my statement.
Time will prove me right.
Or it will prove that the world is full of retards.

 

[Infinitron]

I also played with a sub-par character. A challenge I could create without breaking the immersion of the world, since stuff generally made sense in BG.

Who cares? That's not what made the Infinity Engine games great. People weren't wandering around the Sword Coast or Athkatla going OMG MY STRENGTH MAKES ME DO MORE PHYSICAL DAMAGE BUT NOT RANGED DAMAGE THIS IS SO AWESOME.

Take a look at Sensuki's criticisms of PoE. There's a man who knows what actually mattered in the Infinity Engine games - moment-to-moment combat feel and the abilities that you actually use. He doesn't waste his time whining about stats that you only look at in character creation and then never touch again for 100 hours of gameplay, or about when you get experience points and other irrelevant bullshit.

Like, less physically powerful characters being easier to kill by armed foes.

Actually physically powerful characters are just as easy to kill as weak ones if they have low CON.

 

[mediocrepoet]

Great article, it sounds like you had an amazing time mindx2!

 

[mastroego]

Take a look at Sensuki's criticisms of PoE. There's a man who knows what actually mattered in the Infinity Engine games - moment-to-moment combat feel and the abilities that you actually use. He doesn't waste his time whining about stats that you only look at in character creation and then never touch again for 100 hours of gameplay, or about when you get experience points and other irrelevant bullshit.

You're not seeing my point.
What I see is "clues".
Clues that the leader of a big, relevant project is severely misguided.
Obviously it's not a single stat that will ruin a game.
But it being led by a misguided guy who likes to make things ass-backwards will.
It certainly doesn't surprise me that there are problems with the combat too.

Actually physically powerful characters are just as easy to kill as weak ones if they have low CON.

Right, ok, but you know what I meant

 

[Zorba the Hutt]

Haven't we had the Sawyer / PoE debate enough times yet?

 

[Infinitron]

I certainly won't experience them first-hand though

I don't believe you.

Sorry that professional game designers aren't as big into LARPing as you are.

 

[Zep Zepo]

It's almost like Infintron would like to leave the codex and become a "community manager" for a AAA game developer.

Zep--

 

[Deleted member 7219]

Problem: The Codex didn't exist when Fallout 2 was released.

I wonder what game he actually meant, or maybe he meant another forum.

This is Tim Cain we're talking about right? He probably meant one of the Troika games like Arcanum, TOEE or Bloodlines. There was a lot of chatter on the Codex when they came out.

 

[Infinitron]

It's almost like Infintron would like to leave the codex and become a "community manager" for a AAA game developer.

Zep--

OtherSide Entertainment isn't an AAA dev.

Problem: The Codex didn't exist when Fallout 2 was released.

I wonder what game he actually meant, or maybe he meant another forum.

This is Tim Cain we're talking about right? He probably meant one of the Troika games like Arcanum, TOEE or Bloodlines. There was a lot of chatter on the Codex when they came out.

No, MCA. Read the interview dude

 

[Deleted member 7219]

Problem: The Codex didn't exist when Fallout 2 was released.

I wonder what game he actually meant, or maybe he meant another forum.

This is Tim Cain we're talking about right? He probably meant one of the Troika games like Arcanum, TOEE or Bloodlines. There was a lot of chatter on the Codex when they came out.

No, MCA. Read the interview dude

Sorry, yeah I read it twice but forgot. I'm tired. I'm surprised MCA sad that considering how well he knows us. If you look at his old posts you'll find he came on here trying to defend something but didn't stay very long. In his head, it was Fallout 2.