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RPGs that fell short of greatness and should be remade

Discussion in 'General RPG Discussion' started by Deuce Traveler, Nov 29, 2021.

  1. Lacrymas Arcane

    Lacrymas
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    Pathfinder: Kingmaker
    Tbh, this is such an extreme case of meddling it borders on satire. I've honestly never seen this degree of publisher shenanigans before or since.
     
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  2. Lord_Potato Arcane

    Lord_Potato
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    I was in Athens during 4 days of constant snow, a very rare event in these parts. The city quickly became paralyzed, taxis were unable to carry people to the hills, all steps (and there are many in this city) became slippery with ice. Fun times!

    But it's true snow is a common occurance in Greek mountains. Even those around Athens, not to mention mountains in northern regions like Macedon or Thrace.
     
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  3. ERYFKRAD Barbarian Patron

    ERYFKRAD
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    Strap Yourselves In Serpent in the Staglands Shadorwun: Hong Kong Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker
    YOU HAD ONE JOB FFS
     
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  4. Lacrymas Arcane

    Lacrymas
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    Pathfinder: Kingmaker
    And it's still better than the other stuff from the KS era.
     
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  5. Shackleton Arcane Patron

    Shackleton
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    Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Make the Codex Great Again! Pathfinder: Kingmaker
    What? Like is everyone going to pretend to not notice the fucking nonsensical typo in this quote? Erymanthian BOARD? Board like a fucking plank of wood? Yeah, I can see why that stupid quest was cut, a town being terrorised by a massive noticeboard that's turned sentient from all the bullshit fetch quests posted on it and has struck back against it's oppressors.

    Now, a quest to slay the Erymanthian BOAR might have made a bit more sense. Better to hunt a giant pig than a lump of timber.
     
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  6. IHaveHugeNick Arcane

    IHaveHugeNick
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    I'm not a fan of remakes but reimagined Lionheart would be cool.
     
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  7. Darth Canoli Arcane

    Darth Canoli
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    Daily reminder KotC 2 exists and walks all over this.
     
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  8. Diggfinger Cipher

    Diggfinger
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    Cyberpunk 2020 deserves a RPG/mechanic overhaul:cool:
     
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  9. PorkaMorka Arcane

    PorkaMorka
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    Obviously almost any remake would most likely be bad, we shouldn't want anything to be remade in today's culture

    However, a lot of RPGs could be significantly improved if an experienced player with a solid understanding of pacing and level / encounter design went through with some decent editing tools and made them less annoying to the player, mostly by cutting away bloated parts or tweaking existing fights to make them slightly less boring.

    Wizardry 8 and TOEE are good examples of almost- good games dragged down because they force the player to sit through low quality pseudo-content, but even Pool of Radiance Ruins of Myth Drannor was potentially kind of fun to play around with, I just didn't want to spend hours and hours (with the fast animation mod on) exploring the same brown dungeon and fighting the same zombies etc. Just condense that part into a few hours and skip some of the more boring fights, put some interesting enemies with actual abilities in, etc.

    Divinity Original Sin Enhanced Edition could also use another remake, where they just try to make the game less annoying to the player and remove all the lootable barrels and paintings, other pointless busywork, excessive dialog and unfun puzzles. If it had normal pacing it would actually be a decent game, by the time you got sick of throwing environmental effects around it would be almost over.

    I don't understand why this problem persists from game to game, because it should annoy the broader and more casual audience that companies are seeking.
     
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  10. Norfleet Moderator

    Norfleet
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    I noticed. Like you, this is the vision that it immediately conjured. I just thought this this idea was too hilarious to say no to.
     
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  11. lukaszek the determinator Patron

    lukaszek
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    why would you play dos if not to trap bosses with furniture?
     
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  12. Darth Canoli Arcane

    Darth Canoli
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    :deathclaw:

    What's better than Wizardry 8?
    Name 3 better blobbers and make us laugh.

    ToEE has its shortcomings but its major flaw is it's too short, nothing else.
     
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  13. PorkaMorka Arcane

    PorkaMorka
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    I don't like blobbers, but as far as I know, Wizardry 8 IS the best blobber. I especially liked how you could move your formation around during battle.

    However, it is still true that Wizardry 8 is slow and bloated with tedious random encounters, some of which take 15+ minutes to play out, either because of crowd control and slow animations or because of "friendly" NPCs and weird pathing issues.

    Most long time fans recommend playing Wizardry 8 with a speed patch and there are also some recommended mods that (I believe) try to address some of the problems with abnormally slow random encounters, by tweaking animations, pathing issues, enemy stats, friendly NPCs, etc.

    So the Wizardry 8 fan community basically agrees with my assessment that Wizardry 8 would benefit from an experienced player going through and cleaning up some of the annoying aspects.

    ToEE is a similar story, yes it has a good combat engine with some good fights, but that combat is semi-locked behind hours and hours of Hommlett, which is not fun at all. It also suffers from boring encounter design in a lot of places. It was a mistake to translate the P&P module into a video game too literally, the DM is supposed to adjust things to keep it fun.

    An experienced player with a good understanding of level / encounter design and a basic set of design tools could DRAMATICALLY improve TOEE, in fact the community used to recommend the use of the Circle of Eight patch to help with some of these issues, however I'm not sure if it is still recommended, since it started to get bloated.

    (Which is another issue; mods can and do improve aspects of these games, but mods tend to introduce their new own problems at the same time.)
     
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  14. Brancaleone Arbiter

    Brancaleone
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    And a readable font for ... uhm, some old people I know.
     
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  15. Grunker RPG Codex Ghost Patron

    Grunker
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    Wizardry 8 is one of the very small number of Codex Sacreds. Not even stuff like PS:T or Baldur's Gate has membership of that Church. So what's a Codex Sacred?

    A Codex Sacred is a game considered so awesome that even constructive criticism of its minor flaws is considered heresy. A good example would be something like critiquing the shallow nature of Fallout 1's combat. Even if you preface your critique by saying that it's just a small part of Fallout's otherwise magnificent gameplay, even if you remember the disclaimer that you're talking about a minor blemish on an otherwise all-time great, your criticism will be mistaken for edgelord declinerist bullshit about a perfect game.

    Or indeed, as you do here, point out the fact that Wizardry 8 would be even better with less bloated encounters and more fluidity in the combat.

    Every codexer of course plays with WizFast and thus implicitly recognizes that any sane person will ackknowlegde the fact that Wiz8 encounter can get a bit tedious due to the slow and distended encounters.

    You're just not allowed to point it out.

    The high priest of the Chuch of Codex Sacreds is Darth Roxor, but many prominent members of the 'dex count themselves members of it. All good people, by the way, some of the most worthwhile posters around here when it comes to quality content about older games. Many of the members are people who actually play tons of RPGs and not just GD scum. So you'll have to take the sour with the sweet, to translate a Danish expression.
     
    Last edited: Dec 1, 2021
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  16. Bigg Boss Arcane

    Bigg Boss
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    Wasteland 2 DC is better than the first two Shadowrun's. I couldn't be bothered to go back for Hong Kong with the barebones RPG mechanics (more like XCOM) followed by talking to bullshit NPC's with fluff text in-between missions.
     
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  17. octavius Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    octavius
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    Show Spoiler

     
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  18. Grunker RPG Codex Ghost Patron

    Grunker
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    That is a re-write. The actual expression is "Man må tage det sure..." (sour) "...med det søde" (sweet).
     
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  19. Gandalf Learned

    Gandalf
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    I'm thinking Deus Ex 2, because Invisible War was kind of a miss.
     
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  20. Maxwell's Demon Arcane

    Maxwell's Demon
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    Imagine using an engine like Prey (2006) that allows for real-time portals and variable gravity.
     
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  21. agris Arcane Patron

    agris
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    5,016
    Totally right, like the BG2 fan remake in the DAO engine. Instant classic.
     
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  22. Gaznak Educated

    Gaznak
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    Didn't read the thread, sorry, but the first thing that comes to mind is Lionheart, of course.

    But...
     
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  23. curds Prophet

    curds
    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2019
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    Holy shit.

    They weren't allowed to have snow in the game because of the risk of alienating people who are already so stupid they don't know it snows on mountain tops in most parts of the entire planet.

    This is like the most perfect example of why gaming has declined.
     
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  24. Blutwurstritter Educated

    Blutwurstritter
    Joined:
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    Germany
    I know there was talk about a Icewind Dale conversion to the ToEE engine but I lost track of it. A port of BG 1 to the NWN II engine also exists but wasn't finished when I tried it some years ago. Did any of the conversions ever finish ?
     
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