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SaGa Series Discussion

ebPD8PePfC

Savant
Joined
May 13, 2018
Messages
225
Finished Orphina's story. Good game. I tried Romancing Saga 3 beforehand and dropped it after several hours.
- The combat system is excellent. Combat is all you do the entire game and it stays fun to the end. The formations and the bp systems are great. I was still experimenting with new formations as the game ended.
- The leveling system is really good.
- I love that you don't need to waste time talking to NPCs, or navigating a pointless virtual world. Instead it's just combat, interspersed with small conversations.
- I didn't like the writing, but there's not a whole lot of it in the main quest so it's easy to ignore. I have no idea who's Siegfried or what's the deal with those Scarlet shards, but that didn't hurt my enjoyment of the game. I did like some of the light hearted side quests, but sometimes it turns to pure pointless drivel. I feel bad for the translator who had to do all the meaningless product conversations.
- There's not much you can do to respond to enemies without knowing who they are going to attack, which flattens the strategies you can employ. Counterattacks aren't useful because they require knowing who the enemy is going to attack (so you need Frenzy), and interrupts aren't really defensive. I would love to see a version of the battle system designed around knowing ahead of time who the enemy is attacking, but it would require quite a redesign.
- I like the LP system. It punishes loses in a really gentle manner, so players are encouraged to switch characters after a lose rather than reload.
- I wish they were more visible numbers. What's the chance to block, what's the chance to debuff, etc'.
- I like the art style. Yeah, Square has overused the chibby style, but it's fine overall.
- The crafting system is dumb, mostly because tier 5 is always better than 4, so going for a better item in tier 4 isn't a meaningful choice when it's gonna be quickly replaced. Maybe I'm missing something here.
- I don't get why the product system is in this game. What is it supposed to add? It also has a lot of drawings, which is money for art that could have been used in other areas. It feels completely tacked on.
- The biggest issue that I see is that the game has too much content, and some of it isn't up to par. I would be happy if they slashed a route or two, and had hand crafted items, or meaningful itemization in general. They could have also had better encounter design, but that's fine for most of the big fights.

If you enjoy unique combat systems but don't like the sort of overwrought narratives that plague most jrpgs, than you should try this game. 90% of it is a good combat system with challenges to go through. It's a really good jrpg, wish other games were this focused.
 

Hyperion

Arcane
Joined
Jul 2, 2016
Messages
2,120
meaningful itemization in general
Choosing your weapons is important throughout the whole game so you can make sure to spark all techs. Weapons only become a meaningless choice at endgame if you get the hidden trade-in weapons, which are the best of the best. Leonard gets a free Frying Pan since he has Lissa. This is a pretty decent-sized boon to have.

Primary Armor gives you a bunch of options based on stats and defense, but in the end you're going to choose Dragonscale Armor for balanced defense, Wyrm Armor for phys defense, and Sunlight Robe for Ele defense. If you want someone to be especially quick, you can forget about Dragonscale Armor and give them Angelic Armor instead, since it gives +2 Mobility.

Don't sleep on stat bonuses, especially Endurance, as it's very hard to come by. Endurance reduces damage taken when blocking with a weapon, ups your status resist, and increases weapon block rate. Padded Clothes are one of the only secondary items that adds Endurance, but it's a Rank IV item, compared to the Rainbow Shawl at Rank XIII. You can sacrifice some defense and sleep resist for that +1 Endurance bonus.

For shield blockers, Circlets are probably the best for building your block chance - high blunt defense (probably the most common damage type you see) and a whopping +2 Acuity. But you can always use other things.

Radiant Shield VS Abyssal Shield is another good option. The former has like 16 block but +1 axuity while the latter has a pretty huge 25 block but -1 to all stats. Personally I haven't wanted to sacrifice that amount of stats for some extra block, but it is 100% damage reduction.

Itemization is definitely something that doesn't bother me, and stacking defense is something that is pretty huge for the uber bosses, which I'll probably save for my super-run where everyone has tons of roles and maxed skills etc.
 

Ialda

Learned
Joined
Oct 13, 2019
Messages
124
I got Urpina for my first playthrough and I'm currently getting my ass kicked by the earth serpent boss battle in Azuhacan
Just use Paralyze, so either Shadoe Weave, or Shocking Rush. He's quite vulnerable to it, so a streak of bad RNG is the only thing that makes it dangerous.

keep being wrecked by the black guards - that devil thingy interrupt of their is pure evil
Devil monster interrupts Pierce - use Gravedigger with a Greatsword user to interrupt him, or don't use any Pierce attacks that turn.

Axe-wielding commander uses Hell's Fury, which interrupts Blunt damage. This is basically a guaranteed OHKO.

Sword-Wielding Commander uses Thousand Blades, which interrupts Pierce. AoE + Stun. This is dangerous.

Hammer-Wielding Soldier uses either Seismic Strike (Blunt) or Gale Strike (Pierce). Guess based on the other actions enemies take, because Gale Strike takes quite a few more BP to cast than Seismic Strike. Seismic Strike is more dangerous because it's AoE + Low Paralyze.

I finally suceeded at beating him, thanks for the help ! I'm currently at the beginning of chapter 2 (i chose the sigfrei storyline). Finally devised how to learn new spells, too !

Trying to grind some very specific techs to get good roles is a pain (like spear techs for the Invoker one with intelligence/accuracy up I want for my spellcasters), and the RNG foiling my best laid-out plans can be infuriating, but I'm still hooked.
 

IceyD

Scholar
Joined
Feb 1, 2017
Messages
137
Location
Chicago
This is the first time I'd consider getting a game on iOS since the UI looks fairly natural for the platform. Anyone playing on smartphone?
 

Shackleton

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Dec 29, 2011
Messages
1,301
Location
Knackers Yard
Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Make the Codex Great Again! Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture
Have to say I'm enjoying this one a lot. 23 hours in, on Urpina's second chapter and roaming around exploring. I went over a bit of a hump at around 10 hours or so when I was feeling like the choice to make the game purely about combat meant I was going to get burnt out and bored quicker, but after I started building up the various skills and got a few more characters, it just clicked and I've been hopelessly addicted since.

Been trying to avoid spoiling myself on the story, just looked up a few roles and unlock requirements. Blimey, there's a LOT of roles aren't there?!

Is it one of those games where you have to play through each character arc to fully understand what's going on? Because I can see that taking a looooong time and even though I love it now, not sure the combat will keep me engaged for 200 hours plus. Oh, and how do you unlock the 'Fast Battle' option? I'm thinking it's complete at least one playthrough but I'd kill to be able to speed up the animations already.
 

Abu Antar

Turn-based Poster
Patron
Joined
Jan 19, 2014
Messages
13,514
Enjoy the Revolution! Another revolution around the sun that is. Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
I'm doing fairly well on Balmaint's route. I'm starting to get in a bit of trouble, though. I need better gear, but I think I may have to ditch my current plan on rotating characters and just stick with a main party of like 7 characters. Currently, I can't keep everyone's gear up to speed and the newer allies don't have great survivability.
They start with lower HP and worse gear. To be honest, I haven't read up on anything. This run is completely blind. Even roles, I haven't experimented with. There are a few that got unlocked, but they unlocked without my intention. I more min-max focused run is likely in the future. For now, it's fun finding out stuff on your own.
 
Self-Ejected

aweigh

Self-Ejected
Joined
Aug 23, 2005
Messages
17,978
Location
Florida
this shit looks good. been watching some footage on YT and it looks very detailed and intricate but very low-budget. I don't think you get to explore anywhere in real-time, correct? The whole game is board-game style? i like the shared pool of resources for everyone and instead of assigning turns, you decide what you want to do and depending on who can do it then it subtracts from the point pool; then when that's done the turn order is decided by stats, no ATB nonsense, and you can look ahead at what the enemy actions are as well if you want. That's all very cool.

the thing that's turning me off is that from what i saw in the gameplay videos there's apparently no dungeoneering nor real-time exploration of anything, you just walk around a stylized world map and enter into conversations or into battle, nothing in-between, i.e. you don't explore any places...

i think there's some randomization that happens when you go to some events, maybe? that change what other events appear or change engagements? for example i noticed there was an encounter that said specifically if not dealt with immediately it would harm a town, though i don't know what the results of that would be; i assume the town event would then disappear locking you out of its resources (weapon upgrading mainly)?

this looks like a really good combatfag game but i'm just worried about the seeming low-budget nature of the experience. i'm thinking maybe it would be a better decision to try the romancing saga remakes of 2 or 3 instead of this one? since i haven't played any of them.
 

Jinn

Arcane
Joined
Nov 8, 2007
Messages
4,930
this shit looks good. been watching some footage on YT and it looks very detailed and intricate but very low-budget. I don't think you get to explore anywhere in real-time, correct? The whole game is board-game style? i like the shared pool of resources for everyone and instead of assigning turns, you decide what you want to do and depending on who can do it then it subtracts from the point pool; then when that's done the turn order is decided by stats, no ATB nonsense, and you can look ahead at what the enemy actions are as well if you want. That's all very cool.

Definitely one of the best combat systems ever in a JRPG. Maybe even one of the best combat systems in an RPG in general.

the thing that's turning me off is that from what i saw in the gameplay videos there's apparently no dungeoneering nor real-time exploration of anything, you just walk around a stylized world map and enter into conversations or into battle, nothing in-between, i.e. you don't explore any places...

Once you start playing, you quickly begin to realize that the entire world you're exploring operates almost like a dungeon in itself. Yes, you need to take action (IE fight battles) for things to move forward in that world, but in that sense, it's much more reactive than most RPGs. There is meaningful questing and exploration. It might not seem like it at a glance, but it works very well.

i think there's some randomization that happens when you go to some events, maybe? that change what other events appear or change engagements? for example i noticed there was an encounter that said specifically if not dealt with immediately it would harm a town, though i don't know what the results of that would be; i assume the town event would then disappear locking you out of its resources (weapon upgrading mainly)?

There is a lot of meaningful truly gameplay related Choice and Consequence. As for randomization, not so much as far as I know. There is level scaling based on how many regions you've explored/triggered by the first fight in a new region. It is the absolute best and only good incarnation of level scaling ever conceived, besides in the other SaGa titles (The Last Remnant included). It's the only series that has ever gotten level scaling right, and the only series where I'll not only put up with it, but enjoy it.

this looks like a really good combatfag game but i'm just worried about the seeming low-budget nature of the experience. i'm thinking maybe it would be a better decision to try the romancing saga remakes of 2 or 3 instead of this one? since i haven't played any of them.

Very little about the game feels low-budget to me. The art direction is beautiful, the world building is the best in the series, the writing is great with a very nice localization to boot, the combat is fine-tuned and one of the best systems ever created. I've been seeing you deliberating over where to start with the series for a couple months in shoutbox. Start any of these that you mentioned, but if you really can't decide, start with Scarlet Grace. It's possibly one of the best game in the series, despite how it deviates from many of the other titles with its exploration. That being said, it's also got some of the most intuitive and interesting quest design of the series as a result.
 
Last edited:

spekkio

Arcane
Joined
Sep 16, 2009
Messages
8,278
BROs, thanks to my trusty retailer FatGirl including the JAP version in the premium package, I was able to create an undub for the game. Just a simple swap of \Voice\ folder. Not extensively tested, but it sounds to be working fine. ~170 MB, instructions in readme.txt.

May the Weeboo God Bless you.

http://www.mediafire.com/?ag6mujr0awz3d3t/
 

jungl

Augur
Joined
Mar 30, 2016
Messages
1,420
scarlet grace is very low budget to the point the developers don't care. Few encounters in the game listed as hard only have 1 enemy. They either messed up enemy placement or named the difficulty wrong. 90% of the time you spend fighting and the games combat system is as complex as pillars 2 ship combat LOL. The world art design is whatever go play cat quest 2 and its the about the same quality. The quest design is a well done feature in the game.
 

Matador

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Jun 14, 2016
Messages
1,631
Codex+ Now Streaming!
Do I miss a lot if I play Saga Scarlett Grace, and not the ambitions version? I would like to play the game on PS Vita, and there the ambitions version is not released.
 

Shackleton

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Dec 29, 2011
Messages
1,301
Location
Knackers Yard
Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Make the Codex Great Again! Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture
Well 45 hours into Urpina's story, Chapter 3 and I'm starting to get a bit bored. It's unfortunately fell into the same routine for every battle and I'm just breezing through pretty much everything using the same team and the same moves. Spear formation, Khan Spiral striking while Nessa mesmerizes, Urpina Sonic Blades if there's any conditionals showing, Elysed does whatever spell I'm trying to raise skill on and Oghina bookends the line making sure I get United attacks. I've enjoyed it but now I just want it to be over. Perhaps it's because of Urpina's route, but I've not seen any of this 'amazing quest design' others are speaking of. Everything is just going from node to node and either fighting or talkling. Occasionally you have to think about the order you go to the nodes, but usually it's pretty much spelt out for you.

Will definitely leave it a bit before doing any other of the routes. They made a big mistake not letting you speed up the combat before completing a route, it's just dragging it out.
 

Abu Antar

Turn-based Poster
Patron
Joined
Jan 19, 2014
Messages
13,514
Enjoy the Revolution! Another revolution around the sun that is. Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth

Abu Antar

Turn-based Poster
Patron
Joined
Jan 19, 2014
Messages
13,514
Enjoy the Revolution! Another revolution around the sun that is. Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
Scarlet Grace question - can you even grind in this game? Encounters are all gone and I'm stuck with enemies who are face-raping me (as Urpina of course).
Yes, you can grind. Be sure to also upgrade gear and make use of status ailments. They are invaluable. You should also try to get a grip on link attacks as soon as possible. Further, I can't stress how useful interrupts and counterattacks can be.
 

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