Vapourware Scam Citizen - Only people with too much money can become StarCitizens! WOULD YOU LIKE TO KNOW MORE?

[Branm]

Just to chime in but id argue that games such as Eve Online would be the sort of economy that I think they should strive for. Obviously for people that played the market in eve the 0.001 Isk wars are annoying but you could still make a killing on the market. I personally financed my Titan with mostly isk made from buy/selling and market manipulation

Wrong, its a use of resources that should be put somewhere else, having some kind of "economy" that exists only to work for 1% of the population is fucking stupid, that 1% of the population should get their jollies on something else, this is like because the game have boarding actions it would have CS maps because well FPS is in so why not go the extra mile and be Cock of Duty: Future Warfare XVII?

Its depressing seen this game being overun by EVEtards, you have EVE and you fucking pay or Grind to play EVE ... here is a thought, GO FUCKING PLAY FUCKING EVE!

Same goes for economical simulators, if you want to play a Tycoon game well GO PLAY ONE!

I blame Chris for this, if he killed PvP right off he would killed the unhealthy interested of EVEtards and trying to make this EVE with a Joystick, even if that quote posted shown he appears to come to come realization of the idiocy he did but not full realization.

Woah....Carebear alert...And why does a realistic economy only work for 1% of the people? Are you stupid?

 

[Ranselknulf]

Been a bit since I watched the vid's on this but IIRC.. it was suppose to support private games as well as massive online play.

So you could still do private dog fights with your friends and such if you so desired?

Correct me if I'm wrong but that was the impression I had when I watched the kickstarter.

 

[Drakron]

Woah....Carebear alert...And why does a realistic economy only work for 1% of the people? Are you stupid?

First you can stop with the pathetic insult.

Second, you never have a "realistic economy" nor looking at the current state of the economy you should even try, I will point out the glaring flaw ... you dont lose anything, rather there is a mechanism that will stop loses as you cannot go into debt or if you can go into debt you either have unlimited debt or you have unlimited debt with a few attempts at stopping that.

In the end why the fuck are you looking for a economical simulation on a fucking flight sim? Its like well there is driving on Halo so why the fuck shoudnt Halo have racing? as I pointed out if you want to play a Tycoon game then go play one, NOT trying to make a flight sim into because you want to, I do go around to EVE forums and say "you know what this game really needs? Dating Sim elements" now do I?

Fact is you EVEtards are acting like this is going to be EVE with a Joystick that naturally concerns everyone that is NOT a EVEtard and does not want to be EVE with a Joystick, even Chris appeared to realize the community is being fractured into fractions, PvE vs PvP is something that will never end as you demonstrated so well.

Oh we have a ignore function dont we? right ...

 

[Yaar Podshipnik]

EVE is EVE mostly because of the community, the game mechanics are just enabling the behavior. And the behavior exhibited by a lot of EVE players is just consequence of humans being assholes, and only kept in check by the society. Societal checks and balances that are absent in computer games.

If SC allows destruction of property, then there will be players who will gank others just for fun.
If SC allows groups of players (corps) to have shared assets, then there will be corp thiefs.
If SC allows groups of players to hold any kind of power or control over some resource, be it planet, system, unique ship, etc., then there will be spies trying to blow up that group from the inside.
If SC allows trading freedom similar to EVE then similar behavior will emerge.

Any game that allows you to do stuff that people do in EVE will become similar to EVE in terms of collective and individual behavior. However, I fail to see why it would be wrong to have PVE and PVP people. Carebears sit in highsec, occasionally they get ganked. They either whine all the way to the bank with their easy ISK, or they grow some teeth and bite back. PVErs become PVPers. Grizzled veterans get tired of politics and fighting and do peaceful activities for a while, becoming fluffy and cuddly. It's all a cycle, and it works pretty well.

Then only problems is with fucking whiners, who can't get friends even in-game, and spend more time on forums than actually playing.

 

[Hellraiser]

If you don't lose anything and yet there is a mechanism that stops losses at a certain point I would say that yes, you do indeed lose something. The only problem is that you're getting money out of thin air, which is somewhat canceled by the fact that if you spend it at NPC shops it goes into a black hole never to resurface again. Hence you have inflation, the only issue with player-driven economies is money supply. The lack of taxation is another issue.

Anyway the point of an economics system is to stimulate player-interaction and conflict. Rather than shoot down something for the lulz the game gives you obvious benefits to engaging in PvP, as well as risks. Either way implementing a rudimentary dynamic economy with prices based on supply and demand is not hard. The planets are economically static, the only factor that changes is the number of goods brought in by players. The only issue is assigning demand and domestic supply to each one in a logical way, as well as a general equation that local sell/buy price is derived from, but that's a job for an intern. Coding-wise or asset-wise it's far from a drain on development resources. Player-driven economy is even less of a drain, it practically makes itself, all you need is just give them the tools to trade with each other. Market forces will handle the rest.

 

[Yaar Podshipnik]

The only hard thing with player-driven economy is bootstrapping it. EVE did this by initially, when player population was low, having a lot of stuff created and sold by NPCs. This created a price ceiling on a lot of goods. The most famous example was price of shuttles, that actually set the 4.something ceiling on tritanium, which is used to build pretty much everything.
Fortunately, as the player base grew, CCP made more and more stuff be 100% player manufactured, freeing the economy.

I expect something similar to happen to SC - NPCs will have a constantly diminishing effect on the economy, tied to the economical activity of the population.

 

[Liston]

Hangar module available next weak.
http://www.pcgamer.com/2013/08/23/star-citizen-2/?utm_source=fb&utm_medium=emp

 

[AstroZombie]

Powered by CryEngine 3, Star Citizen remains focused on high-end PCs, though Roberts isn't discounting the possibility of console versions at some point in the future. "It would have to be the next generation of consoles," he said. "Right now we're just on one platform - but basically [next-gen consoles] are high-end PCs with custom operating systems."

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2013-08-22-star-citizen-begins-rolling-out-next-week

This was not part of the deal, Mr. Roberts.

 

[Dexter]

Powered by CryEngine 3, Star Citizen remains focused on high-end PCs, though Roberts isn't discounting the possibility of console versions at some point in the future. "It would have to be the next generation of consoles," he said. "Right now we're just on one platform - but basically [next-gen consoles] are high-end PCs with custom operating systems."

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2013-08-22-star-citizen-begins-rolling-out-next-week

This was not part of the deal, Mr. Roberts.

You go on ahead believing that dude and buying his $1000 ships.

 

[AstroZombie]

You go on ahead believing that dude and buying his $1000 ships.

You have me confused with blaine, I pledged $30 for the shittiest ship and the shittiest hangar.

 

[Blaine]

You go on ahead believing that dude and buying his $1000 ships.

Telling Eurogamer and its audience of console chavs that consoles are out of the question wouldn't be tactful.

That said, I plan to seek clarification. I wouldn't have a problem with Squadron 42 seeing a console port, since that really won't hold back the PC version in any way, and would only serve to earn CIG more money. A bunch of the old Wing Commanders were ported. The purpose of PC exclusivity isn't to deprive console peasants out of spite, but rather to ensure that the game is designed in every aspect with the PC in mind, uncompromised by the restrictions, limitations and parameters of consoles.

The MMO portion however must never be ported to consoles unless it's a separate endeavor of some kind, meaning it utilizes its own servers or it's just a glorified version of user-hosted multiplayer. I'm not particularly worried regardless, since all those expensive ships of mine are selling for 2x+ their original price on the grey market to very eager buyers.

 

[AstroZombie]

I took a look at the CIG forums(lol) and most of the people there wouldn't be happy if this was being ported to consoles, to put it mildly.

 

[Blaine]

No doubt the membership are making a big fuss over it, which is good, because the developers will certainly notice and Chris will realize (though in my view he already does) that he'll need to step lightly. Bear in mind that he's been at Gamescom for several days, and personally I think he's just being especially tactful. This isn't the first time the CIG forums (and the Codex) have freaked out over something Chris has said in some interview. He's been seen to change his stance on an issue, or to have been misinterpreted, or to have misspoken... it's amazing, I know. Most people are perfect and never make any mistakes.

In any event, the people intent on trolling me in this thread never game Star Citizen any credit for being PC-only to begin with, so variations of "told you so" will just roll right off my back. The Hangar Module should be out soon (within a week?), and purportedly we can invite friends to view it once they've downloaded the client, so that'll be fun.

 

[AstroZombie]

Hangar module is out on the 29th.

 

[Blaine]

Hah, I'm no longer even paying as much attention as the average person. That's mainly because the forums are retarded, the Chatroll is retarded, and there hasn't been any real news until the Gamescom Hangar Module reveal.

For those who haven't seen, here's that vaporware in action (starts at 21:00):

http://www.twitch.tv/roberts_space_ind_ch_1/c/2809927

 

[Stereotypical Villain]

Roberts doesn't exactly have a good track record when it comes to creating well-polished games, he's rather the kind of dev who steps into a room filled with all of the actual devs and starts spouting ideas everywhere to the point where the project becomes bloated, inefficient, and stands a snowball's chance in hell to actually be finished in the way that it was originally intended to be. (See Freelancer for the prime example)

I do hope that my skepticism (which has remained with me ever since this project took off) will be proven wrong though since there's a lot of potential to be had if Roberts can keep his... cough... "creativity" in check throughout development. If not, I foresee vaporware within two years time.

My concerns without flame-baiting Blaine. I think I might actually get to go to a good afterlife after all.

 

[Blaine]

Roberts doesn't exactly have a good track record when it comes to creating well-polished games, he's rather the kind of dev who steps into a room filled with all of the actual devs and starts spouting ideas everywhere to the point where the project becomes bloated, inefficient, and stands a snowball's chance in hell to actually be finished in the way that it was originally intended to be. (See Freelancer for the prime example)

Chris Roberts departed the Freelancer development team years before it was released. He can't see a project through to completion when he's not even there. Clearly, you're well-informed on this subject.

CR is renown in the industry and among his fans for pretty much the exact opposite of what you suggest, namely getting games done and getting them done properly according to a unified vision which he's adept at conveying to his team.

 

[J_C]

Hah, I'm no longer even paying as much attention as the average person. That's mainly because the forums are retarded, the Chatroll is retarded, and there hasn't been any real news until the Gamescom Hangar Module reveal.

For those who haven't seen, here's that vaporware in action (starts at 21:00):

http://www.twitch.tv/roberts_space_ind_ch_1/c/2809927

Wow, that first few minutes from the PR guy....

But the game looks amazing.

 

[Metro]

But will it be on Steam?!?!

 

[Yaar Podshipnik]

We are also now pleased to reveal the $18 million goals:

Exclusive star system for pre-launch backers. Only players who support the game before its
launch will receive the computer coordinates needed to allow their jump drives to access this system.

 

[Grunker]

Wow. Keeps gettin' better.

 

[Yaar Podshipnik]

Other stuff seems cool, but exclusive *meaningful* stuff for backers only sucks. Personally, I will share this code with everyone who asks.

 

[Blaine]

Stop making mountains out of molehills. People will have had two years to come up with $30. Personally, I'm much more aggravated by the Codex darling Kickstarter projects peppering backer-named or -designed memorials, NPCs, weapons, items, and statues all over the finished product, but you don't see me squealing about it.

 

[Yaar Podshipnik]

I'm not making this into a big problem. I just don't like separating players based on access to some resource. However, we know nothing about the system itself. It may be just empty (player-usable resource-wise) but with some pretty background, etc. If that is the case, then this is fine. I would still help other people get inside though.

The items in other projects are a bit different story, as they will be available to everyone. Which is exactly the point, since those items/locations/NPCs/whatever is basically backers waving their dickwallets in faces of the plebs .

 

[Data4]

"WAH! Why does he get to drive that BMW while I'm stuck with this shitty Focus?!"