KickStarter Scorn - another Giger influenced horror game released after long developement

[toughasnails]

I will probably be thinking of the world of Scorn and what it all means for quite some time. It's like that civilization transformed into a tumour that fed on its former self.

That's more or less it, yeah. I'd check out the artbook if I was you, it's definitely worth a look.

 

[infidel]

On a more positive note, I'll say that the music in Scorn is top fucking notch. This Aethek guy came out of nowhere, it's some Bosnian apparently? A great honor to be included alongside the likes of Lustmord.
Tagging my dark ambient bro/pro composer @infidel.
Check out this awesomeness (11:50 Encapsulated is my fav):

I can see why you dig it, this one in particular reminds of that Council of the Magi thing. Listened to about half an hour so far, I like it a lot for the most part. Gonna probably add all that to my playlist for reading Hellblazer, heheh. The ones near the end of those 30 minutes were a little too heavy on the subs at times but overall I like it so far. It's got that tense, dark but not overly dominating vibe that I usually seek from dark ambient. And it certainly feels to me that there's less Lustmord in it than that Aethek dude so far (that might change).

drone ambient isnt that hard to make

Ah, that is a common misconception. A lot of genres seem easy to get into making, like hiphop or ambient. What could be easier? Grab a beat for 5$ or for free, say some stupid shit in a monotonous voice into your smartphone and boom, it's done, right? The problem is that there are a lot of nuances particular to any genre that are invisible to the outsider but are very important for the people who are into it. There's basic emotion, feeling and atmosphere inherent in any ambient track and that's the starting point of differentiation between the subgenres, calm, tense, sad, scary, spacey, new age high in the clouds, etc. And once you start listening to dark ambient, you quickly find that there's a whole spectre between dark, slightly tense to scary and "grating on my nerves". The next thing is instrument choices. Ambient tolerates rhythms at times (like at 8:56 of that video of Scorn OST) but rarely and rhythms can be more or less machine-industrial or done with drums and various percussion even if the "beat" (heheh) is highly repetitive. Sure, start with some pads and there's a million of them ready for another 5$. Except once you start, none of them seem to sound right :D. The third big thing that can change the results heavily is the mixing. More air? More weight? Less presence and definition by how much? Competitive loudness (for the loud genres) and professional mixing can be heard very easily even if you're not into the genre itself.

BTW, I may be wrong but Eno makes a very specific thing that got popular way back because it's way more mainstream and pleasant to hear.

 

[Starwars]

I was pessimistic but hopeful for this and yeah... I thought it was pretty crappy overall.

It's this thing where the game clearly wants to feel different. But despite its unusual appearance (which isn't that unusual since it's so connected to Giger, just unusual in that it's a full game of it) it's something you've seen a million times in terms of gameplay. Same crappy gameplay experience like a million other games, just with a fleshy body-horror paintjob on it. Same "we have this awesome idea for the visuals that we can't wait to show people but uuh... I guess we gotta put *some* gameplay in there since... uh... it's supposed to be a game after all". Some of the puzzles were not offensive-bad but they're not good or interesting enough to carry it as a puzzle game. And the combat is just... well. What you would expect I guess.

That being said, it does look good at least. But I find that the art direction is a lot less striking as an overall package. While there is some variety, you kinda lose the impact when it's all "biomechanical horror". I don't find it particularly memorable.

I do like the fact that there's no real UI except for some minimal stuff and that you're dropped into a world without explanation, and that the devs try to tell their story without characters, journal notes and the other usual stuff.

And, it did keep me interested enough to see where they would go with the world and story, that I played it until the end. So I guess that's saying something at least.
But overall I would not consider it worth the price at all. Maybe if it's heavily discounted at some point.

 

[Feyd Rautha]

What makes a puzzle good? What makes a puzzle bad? It would be interesting to see someone explain that... I've only seen opinions so far.

 

[RaggleFraggle]

The devs cut out almost half the planned game, including key environmental storytelling. Even people who never read the artbook have pointed out length and pacing issues caused by the absence.

 

[NecroLord]

A horror RPG with the aesthetic of both Giger and Beksinski...

One can only imagine.

 

[toughasnails]

What makes a puzzle good? What makes a puzzle bad? It would be interesting to see someone explain that... I've only seen opinions so far.

I'm honestly not sure how you could get a clear cut answer to that.
I said it earlier, I think that the puzzle in the opening area is actually p fine in the context of this game, even if its central "problem" is simple or unimaginative taken in abstract. It's good bc it is organically integrated in the world and you learn about the world's functioning by paying attention while following the steps of the puzzle. It also excellently reflects the philosophical critique of modernity and modern technology that the devs are by their own admission drawing on. It's basically the core points of Heidegger's essay on the essence of technology presented to you in a striking, uncompromising way. First you have the human(oid) workers packed in pods and framed on a rack, and by following the puzzle you'll see the full extent to which they are reduced to what Heidegger calls standing reserve. They operate the machinery, power it, are recycled for spare part and building materials (maybe even nutrients for the living workers). And all of it seemingly had no other purpose than efficiency for efficiency's sake and growth for growth's sake.
You yourself can either recycle a worker and use a part of his body as a tool or "save" it (but you are still doing it for other purpose, not primarily to save him).
Heidegger wrote of this in the context of natural resources, how they are exploited, transformed, stored, transformed again etc but there was one point where he mention how scary grotesque the term "human resource" is (which was probably p new at the time the essay was written but it is now the part of everyday speech and we don't even think of its implications).

As for what would make a good puzzle in general, I'm not sure? It not being based purely on trial and error and guesswork, giving you sufficient hints, either not requiring some specialized knowledge or if it does, it is something that fits the game (mathematical problem or astronomy in some hard SF adventure game for example?) and you've given hints as to what exactly you are dealing with so you know what to look into outside the game if you don't have that sort of knowledge...
You are better off asking in the adventure game forum. But if you played any number of p&c adventures you'll know how often you'll read stuff like "I liked the game but the puzzles are too easy/too obscure/suffer from moon logic etc". So good luck with that I guess...

NecroLord
Possibly this, it was mentioned earlier in the thread.

Although frankly the Beksinski influence seems to extend only to the visuals of some locales and backdrops, the game's set-up otherwise seems to be a p familiar fantasy fare.

 

[Balor]

It also excellently reflects the philosophical critique of modernity and modern technology that the devs are by their own admission drawing on. It's basically the core points of Heidegger's essay on the essence of technology presented to you in a striking, uncompromising way. First you have the human(oid) workers packed in pods and framed on a rack, and by following the puzzle you'll see the full extent to which they are reduced to what Heidegger calls standing reserve. They operate the machinery, power it, are recycled for spare part and building materials (maybe even nutrients for the living workers). And all of it seemingly had no other purpose than efficiency for efficiency's sake and growth for growth's sake.

Exactly. It's all in the artbook, and which I've read after playthrough and was pleased that I've got most of the themes right despite hearing pretty much nothing about the game, because typical survival horror games are not my cup of tea, but this is , fortunately, not a survival horror game, and certainly not a shooter.
It is *existential* horror game. Which is actually worse, because the worst that can happen already happen to you - you got born. And this is very relatable (and they want their game to be both 'alien' AND relatable, emphasising this multiple times) In fact, it had a subtitle of "Dasein" sometime in the past, I think (at least what I've gathered from some vids about game development).

Both Acovic and Peklar can name long lists of film directors, authors, and philosophers, as well as other artists—David Cronenberg, David Lynch, Dario Argento, Franz Kafka, Jorge Luis Borges, J. G. Ballard, Thomas Ligotti, Albert Camus, Martin Heidegger, Ernest Becker, and Sigmund Freud all deserve credit here—whose bodies of work played a part in Scorn’s genesis as general stimuli, but never as referenced materials.

It's all there.
(I think Zapffe's 'Last Messiah' while unreferenced, played a great role here as well, but than they referenced Ligotti, and his Magnum Opus "The Conspiracy against the Human Race" cites him as pretty much major influence)

It uses puzzles, visuals, story, and eventually even name itself to ask, and show an answer to, "hard questions" like: "Is life sacred?" "Does it have meaning?" "Does it have value?" "What if it has negative value?" "Can there be things worse than a death?"

You, basically, are being thrown into world that makes no sense, forced to exploit others or suffer and die, than get exploited in turn... don't find any meaning and don't even get to die, and reap only eternal suffering - and given the nature of society of Scorn world - it seems deserved. Both as a protagonist AND as a player. (Some more than others, that's to be sure)

So yea, theme of birth, death and suffering, and what would happen if you remove "death" out of this list. The point of the game is hammered home again and again (most obviously with "nonlinear" moldman puzzle): Life is suffering. Eternal life is the worst thing that can happen to you, not dying.
Trying to achieve immortality is to guarantee yourself an eternity of suffering. Metal:Hellsinger? Scorn is the most "metal" game of the year, if ever, period. And it's hellscapes are much more convincing - because they always were 'other people', indeed. Existential horror > survival horror.

The visceral visuals are supposed to evoke visceral horror at some of possible outcomes we are (possibly) heading to - a brutal dystopia where exploitation and suffering is dealt on truly industrial scale (and by the way - that's how industrial farming already works, basically - but hey, they are not humans, so that's ok. So are 'moldmen' that are subhuman, right? So their suffering is irrelevant...), and you cannot be sure that even death can bring you freedom from it anymore.
You can clearly see at what or whom the 'Scorn' is directed AT, do you now?

By the way, the dreadful combat is most certainly dreadful on purpose, given how easily avoidable pretty much of of it is, and how this fact fits exactly into the game theme - you are vulnerable, and the annoying critters are basically animals. They just defend themselves, leave them alone for a moment and they wander off, melding back into the flesh that spawned it... it is humans that insist on their elimination, causing them and themselves entirely unnecessary suffering when they could have used their 'superb mind powers' and know better...

This is exactly like Pathologic - a gem of a game that most people would not play - and what was never intended to be 'fun' and 'entertaining'. Or pretty, even.

Some of my musings about the portal

I'm not sure it is even a 'portal', or at least something that 'mortal flesh' can enter - you can see the effect on the statues, if those are even statues, and the 'eroding' effect is apparent and emphasized the final and particularly gruesome ending video. Did this effect, in fact, break the (physical!) 'mind link' that allowed the protagonist to control the Shell?
I'm not sure why people hate ending so much - it is pretty much PERFECT. Were they expected a Disney happy ending? I'm quite sure that in case of the protagonist it was not supposed to be a hope of transcendence or salvation - but of total oblivion, because he knew that was in store for him otherwise, you can constantly hear screeches of the parasite in the background, hunting him. It might even be some sort of ritual 'body disposal', after 'extracting the 'higher consciousness' out of the body, which most certainly has to do with the parasites - and which got very wrong in 'our' case. Admittedly, that IS a conjecture, because artbook has nothing on this.

 

[Balor]

All in all, it is one of the very few games that TRULY deserves 'mature' rating.
Not because of the gore, boobs and phallic imagery. They are perfect for teenagers, actually. The understand them and appreciate them.

It is because it delves in concepts that are literally inconceivable to 'immature' people.

 

[RaggleFraggle]

A horror RPG with the aesthetic of both Giger and Beksinski...

One can only imagine.

The Blasted Labyrinth and Tower levels look like they would’ve been the most Beksinski-esque of the levels, but they got cut

 

[DarkUnderlord]

You walk around and click on the only things you're allowed to click on until something happens and another area opens up.

Sometimes you encounter monsters which are.. annoying? Dunno. I only have the nut puncher at the moment. Is there actually combat in this game?

Visually it looks interesting (feels too much like a comic book painting and less like a slimey real goo-ball world) but there's no interactivity. It's not like I'm understanding what these machines do or what's going on. Or what I am or what happened to me. Maybe that gets explained, maybe not. I feel like not.

When I died (to some gas thing which I didn't realise was capable of killing me or was in fact actually harming me at all), and reloaded and realised it's a shitty check-point save system - I lost a lot of interest. But I do fire it up to wander about and click on the next thing from time to time.

The game wasn't so bad? I played it without having read any opinions online and it was quite alright I think. Reading through this thread there's only the negative opinions.

I will probably be thinking of the world of Scorn and what it all means for quite some time. It's like that civilization transformed into a tumour that fed on its former self.

How do you decide if puzzles are good or bad? People are saying the puzzles are stupid but how?


e:

Ok. Those videos kind of explain that. Didn't know about the healing.

My issue with the puzzles is that the "puzzles" I do, I'm doing because it's the only thing I can click on. It's not like I figure out the secret of what the machine does and apply some logic to it. It's just, click this, this thing moves, ok so I need to move a thing, click some more and some bullshit happens. I can never predict what that bullshit is though - so it's not like, ahh I need to turn on the power so I can get the lights on. It's more, this is interactive. I click on it, ok I click again, it's a timing thing, or I can move a thing, that makes another click, oh and now we're done and a human has popped out of an egg. Ok whatever.

There's also clearly only one linear path through - or at least there has been so far - so while I do feel like I might get lost, you never really do. You can't even fall off the edge into some of those awesome chasms. You just stop at the edge.

I feel like fighting the monsters might add some actual game-play to it. Maybe that's why people are fighting them? So they can DO something instead of just wander to the next thing and click.

 

[Feyd Rautha]

I killed almost every monster. Thanks for explaining about the puzzles, I agree.

e: There's also a pistol and a shotgun. The story is explained in the artbook.

 

[Wunderbar]

Agree with most of the criticism expressed here, but I still liked the game. Didn't read the artbook though.

 

[Spukrian]

I just finished this. I started it a long time ago but got stuck on a combat encounter and took a break for a few months.

Well, yeah, the art, the environments, the world... they're all fantastic. I also liked the puzzles. I didn't like the combat though. Early in the game it was easy to just run past the enemies or just hide and wait untill they despawn, but later on there were several ambush situations were combat couldn't be avoided, culminating in a very annoying boss fight. The game would've been better with more puzzles and less combat.

 

[RaggleFraggle]

I forgot about this thread.

Some old news: Ebb removed the gorgeous artbook PDF and replaced it with a shitty mobi file most computers cannot open anyway. That’s shitty service.

Also, they didn’t deliver on their promises. They cut out half or more of the planned areas… did I say this already?

Ebb can eat shit. They’re worse than all those idiots copying superficial details of Giger art. Peklar actually seemed to understand the symbolism and other high-minded ideas, then he botched the execution and refuses to take responsibility for it. Their PR is nonexistent.

I’m so burned out by constant disappointment from every single media company I bother to buy from. I hate this planet.

 

[United Nations]

Three hours in, quit game for now after first combat experience.

Puzzles are top-notch so far, and the game world is intensely creepy, but not quite scary.

I'm a HUGE fan of horror-themed walking sims, specifically Visage, MADiSON, Observer, and Frictional's Penumbra 1/2, Amnesia 1, and SOMA.

These types of games really suck me in for some reason, they're a whole shit ton more atmospheric than say Doom 2016, Resident Evil 7, or Diablo IV for example.

 

[Venser]

I might try it in VR with Unreal Engine VR injector.

 

[United Nations]

Just beat the entire game, took me 7.5 hours total.

Seriously excellent piece of art, but two things holding it back that I'm sure have been mentioned a number of times in this thread:

1. Dildo weapon was a seriously bad decision; it should have been included only as a tool.
2. The game needs multiple ending since the vanilla ending was total shit and too pessimistic even for a game this gloomy.

Other than that, the setting and ambient soundtrack were great, and I felt that the game was strongest in the first and final act but sort of dragged in the middle.

I really wish there were more puzzles like the nut cracking puzzle in the beginning in the game, unfortunately every other puzzle was too basic.

I was surprised by how the final act picks up and includes some of the game's best content, right up until the final scenes where the story falls apart.

 

[RaggleFraggle]

Just beat the entire game, took me 7.5 hours total.

Seriously excellent piece of art, but two things holding it back that I'm sure have been mentioned a number of times in this thread:

1. Dildo weapon was a seriously bad decision; it should have been included only as a tool.
2. The game needs multiple ending since the vanilla ending was total shit and too pessimistic even for a game this gloomy.

Other than that, the setting and ambient soundtrack were great, and I felt that the game was strongest in the first and final act but sort of dragged in the middle.

I really wish there were more puzzles like the nut cracking puzzle in the beginning in the game, unfortunately every other puzzle was too basic.

I was surprised by how the final act picks up and includes some of the game's best content, right up until the final scenes where the story falls apart.

The devs cut out 90% of the game so they could increase the polycount and rush it to release.

Here’s a playlist by a dedicated fan chronicling development:

Originally there were several more levels, including a battlefield, a ruined cyborg factory, a tower that harvested and distributed sentient meat slurry, and an enormous city where you’d extract your brain as a flying squid and switch between various mech suits to solve puzzles, you’d ride ziplines across the city, and replace the parasite with cyborg implants. It all sounds way more interesting than the actual game.

 

[United Nations]

Just beat the entire game, took me 7.5 hours total.

Seriously excellent piece of art, but two things holding it back that I'm sure have been mentioned a number of times in this thread:

1. Dildo weapon was a seriously bad decision; it should have been included only as a tool.
2. The game needs multiple ending since the vanilla ending was total shit and too pessimistic even for a game this gloomy.

Other than that, the setting and ambient soundtrack were great, and I felt that the game was strongest in the first and final act but sort of dragged in the middle.

I really wish there were more puzzles like the nut cracking puzzle in the beginning in the game, unfortunately every other puzzle was too basic.

I was surprised by how the final act picks up and includes some of the game's best content, right up until the final scenes where the story falls apart.

The devs cut out 90% of the game so they could increase the polycount and rush it to release.

Here’s a playlist by a dedicated fan chronicling development:

Originally there were several more levels, including a battlefield, a ruined cyborg factory, a tower that harvested and distributed sentient meat slurry, and an enormous city where you’d extract your brain as a flying squid and switch between various mech suits to solve puzzles, you’d ride ziplines across the city, and replace the parasite with cyborg implants. It all sounds way more interesting than the actual game.

That does sound 100x better.

But many developers overpromise with their games and fail to deliver.

Another great game(s) this happened to was STALKER.

I read elsewhere that Ebb Software has started working on a fresh IP.

What I would really like is a sequel or partial remake that fixes the game they gave us.

I also discovered several mods for Scorn...

Maybe the modding community will fix it in the future and add missing content as well as fix the core gameplay too?