Solasta Solasta II - Journey to the Lands of Neokos in the Unreal Engine - coming to Early Access - Demo Available

[IDtenT]

Haste is hardly the only buff worth casting and if your DM puts you in combat situations where Haste is always the go-to, then they're not doing a good job.

It's not only the DMs fault and there's no DM in a video game adaptation. The most sensible build option is to choose 1 spell with concentration (Haste if you have it) and everything else that doesn't require concentration. So even if you get into the very unlikely scenario where another buff would be better than Haste (extremely rare) then you won't have it memorized anyway. Even then, let's say you want to cripple yourself as much as possible and don't choose Haste, there's still only 1 spell with concentration you can cast and they are many. Many more than you'd think. It's not a good system.

Both Bane and Bless (as examples) can be better than Haste under many circumstances.

I hardly think that balancing for video games is a priority.

 

[Lacrymas]

Yes, other spells can be better than Haste before you get access to Haste. Balancing is absolutely mandatory for games, regardless of whether it's a video game or not.

Also, Bless would almost never be better than Haste. Under normal circumstances, the chance to hit when hasted compared to blessed is marginal at best (like 1-2ish %) and depends on how many attacks per round you make. Haste becomes exponentially better with fewer attacks. Now that I think about it, there are almost no circumstances in which Bless outperforms Haste in terms of damage. Haste just wrecks the action economy and is not a spell that should exist in the current ruleset.

 

[Nortar]

Yes, other spells can be better than Haste before you get access to Haste. Balancing is absolutely mandatory for games, regardless of whether it's a video game or not.

Also, Bless would almost never be better than Haste. Under normal circumstances, the chance to hit when hasted compared to blessed is marginal at best (like 1-2ish %) and depends on how many attacks per round you make. Haste becomes exponentially better with fewer attacks. Now that I think about it, there are almost no circumstances in which Bless outperforms Haste in terms of damage. Haste just wrecks the action economy and is not a spell that should exist in the current ruleset.

Are we talking about the same Haste from 2024 rules?
The one that can be cast on a single target (Bless has 3 targets) for a maximum of 10 rounds; and makes the target incapacitated after the spell ends?

This last bit opens up so many options for a DM (call him "encounter designer" if it's a computer game) wanting to wean players off being hasty.

Just have a lame goblin who comes to the battle a minute later and then coup-de-graces the incapacitated haster.
One-trick spellcasters deserve lame goblin solutions.

 

[Mortmal]

Crazy people vibes?

Chummed the waters for some intense sperging out over it. More than I thought there would be. I'm sure if there is a demand for 2014 rules then modders will abide anyway.

Sperging is a sign of a healthy RPG community and that we are indeed discussing an RPG. I’ve read the comments, it’s weird that there are grognards for 5E complaining about the 2024 streamlining, when the whole philosophy of 5E was to simplify and make things easier and faster, which it only succeeded at to some extent.

 

[IDtenT]

Grognard, that's the right word.

 

[Lacrymas]

Yes, other spells can be better than Haste before you get access to Haste. Balancing is absolutely mandatory for games, regardless of whether it's a video game or not.

Also, Bless would almost never be better than Haste. Under normal circumstances, the chance to hit when hasted compared to blessed is marginal at best (like 1-2ish %) and depends on how many attacks per round you make. Haste becomes exponentially better with fewer attacks. Now that I think about it, there are almost no circumstances in which Bless outperforms Haste in terms of damage. Haste just wrecks the action economy and is not a spell that should exist in the current ruleset.

Are we talking about the same Haste from 2024 rules?
The one that can be cast on a single target (Bless has 3 targets) for a maximum of 10 rounds; and makes the target incapacitated after the spell ends?

This last bit opens up so many options for a DM (call him "encounter designer" if it's a computer game) wanting to wean players off being hasty.

Just have a lame goblin who comes to the battle a minute later and then coup-de-graces the incapacitated haster.
One-trick spellcasters deserve lame goblin solutions.

I was talking about 2014 rules, but much the same applies to 2024 too. I doubt the DM will constantly throw in enemies which are conveniently 1 minute too late to the party. The vast, vaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaast majority of encounters won't be like that. You can always throw curveballs to the players regarding Haste even in the 2014 rules, but it gets repetitive fast and doesn't fix the fundamental issues with the spell. It just doesn't work with the way the entire rest of the game is set up and it's pointless to keep this spell in the game if you are constantly going to try to limit its usefulness or "wean players off" it. Fighting the symptom is dumb.

 

[Nortar]

You can always throw curveballs to the players regarding Haste even in the 2014 rules, but it gets repetitive fast and doesn't fix the fundamental issues with the spell. It just doesn't work with the way the entire rest of the game is set up and it's pointless to keep this spell in the game if you are constantly going to try to limit its usefulness or "wean players off" it. Fighting the symptom is dumb.

That's the point, - the whole reason this spell feels like an overpowered no-brainer choice, is that you don't get to feel the impact of it's downsides.
Broken concenration of the caster = best damage-dealer (or whoever got hasted) incapacitated.

If your players are not retarded it should not take more than 1 party-wipe for them to realise they should not take long rests inside the Big Evil Boss castle.
Or willy-nilly use spells that could almost guaranteedly erase one of the characters.

You're right that Solasta encounter designers are not the kind to teach players such lesson though. But it's not the spell issue.

 

[ERYFKRAD]

. I doubt the DM will constantly throw in enemies which are conveniently 1 minute too late to the party

Nigga here never heard of reinforcements.

 

[Lacrymas]

Oh, thanks for reminding me - the other problem of concentration is that the best way to counter *any* spell requiring concentration is to attack the caster until he fails his concentration roll.

 

[Lacrymas]

Nigga here never heard of reinforcements.

Reinforcements we always hate in video games à la DA2?

 

[Nortar]

Oh, thanks for reminding me - the other problem of concentration is that the best way to counter *any* spell requiring concentration is to attack the caster until he fails his concentration roll.

Bro, killing wizards is always the best way to counter spells.

 

[Mr. Magniloquent]

Weapon Mastery just seems like an attempt to avoid acknowledging that Battle Master should be the core fighter template, with archetypes built on top of it. I also get the vibe they took some inspiration from BG3 weapon actions, which I believe is Larian homebrew.

 

[Lacrymas]

Battle Master should be the core Fighter template, yes. However, other martial classes should get something equivalent as well, which they did in the 2024 rules. It's actually staggering how few combat options the martials have in 2014. They neither have combat options nor out-of-combat options, so playing as a martial class is super boring and one-note.

 

[ERYFKRAD]

so playing as a martial class is super boring and one-note.

No.

 

[ERYFKRAD]

Nigga here never heard of reinforcements.

Reinforcements we always hate in video games à la DA2?

Respawning outta nowhere is not the same as reinforcements, you sub-tactical moron.

 

[Jermu]

is there any place where I can find all differences between 2014 and 2024
probably just gotta browse through 2024 rules

 

[Lacrymas]

Nigga here never heard of reinforcements.

Reinforcements we always hate in video games à la DA2?

Respawning outta nowhere is not the same as reinforcements, you sub-tactical moron.

Explain the difference to me, o, mega-mind.

 

[Crichton]

Oh, thanks for reminding me - the other problem of concentration is that the best way to counter *any* spell requiring concentration is to attack the caster until he fails his concentration roll.

As it should be.

 

[Nortar]

is there any place where I can find all differences between 2014 and 2024
probably just gotta browse through 2024 rules

List of SRD 5.2 differences

From here: https://www.dndbeyond.com/srd

SRD 5.2 FAQ​

What are the differences between SRD 5.1 and 5.2?​

See the following table for the differences between SRDs. All content in SRD 5.2 has been updated to 2024 core rules wording and mechanics.

Section	SRD 5.2 Difference
Legal Disclaimer	Wording changes only
Table of Contents	New
Playing the Game	Added: Rhythm of Play, Exploration
Character Creation	Wording/mechanics changes only
Classes	Wording/mechanics changes only
Character Origins	Added 3 Backgrounds, 2 Species: Criminal (background) Sage (background) Soldier (background) Goliath (species) Orc (species) Removed: Half-Elf (race), Half-Orc (race) as these are not in the 2024 core rules.
Feats	Added 15 Feats: Alert Magic Initiate Savage Attacker Ability Score Improvement Archery Defense Great Weapon Fighting Two Weapon Fighting Boon of Combat Prowess Boon of Dimensional Travel Boon of Fate Boon of Irresistable Offense Boon of the Night Spirit Boon of Spell Recall Boon of Truesight
Equipment	Added: Weapon Masteries Musket Pistol Brewing Potions of Healing Scribing Spell Scrolls
Spells	Added 20 Spells: Aura of Life Charm Monster Chromatic Orb Dissonant Whispers Divine Smite Dragon’s Breath Elementalism Ensnaring Strike Hex Ice Knife Mind Spike Phantasmal Force Power Word Heal Ray of Sickness Searing Smite Sorcerous Burst Starry Wisp Summon Dragon Tsunami Vitriolic Sphere
Game Rules	Added: Rules Glossary Removed: “Between Adventures” section as that is not featured in the 2024 core rules.
Gameplay Toolbox	Added: Travel Pace Environmental Effects
Magic Items	Added 15 Magic Items: Bead of Nourishment Cloak of Invisibility Elixir of Health Energy Bow Gloves of Thievery Hat of Many Spells Potion of Invulnerability Potion of Longevity Potion of Vitality Quarterstaff of the Acrobat Rod of Resurrection Sending Stones Sentinel Shield Shield of the Cavalier Thunderous Greatclub Additionally, two items have a different name in SRD 5.2: Deck of Many Things has been renamed Mysterious Deck* Orb of Dragonkind has been renamed Dragon Orb**
Monsters	Added 17 Monsters: Allosaurus Anklyosaurus Archelon Bugbear Stalker Goblin Boss Goblin Minion Guard Captain Hippopotamus Hobgoblin Captain Pirate Pirate Captain Pteradon Sphinx of Wonder Swarm of Crawling Claws Tough Boss Troll Limb Vampire Familiar Updated: Monster names and stat blocks follow the Monster Manual. You can reference Monster Conversions in Appendix B for stat block conversions from 2014 to their 2025 equivalent.
Appendix	Removed: “Fantasy-Historical Pantheons” and “The Planes of Existence,” as those are not rules-bearing to play fifth edition.

Link to PDF

 

[Jermu]

ah alert one of the "mandatory" feats

nvm its weaker
still strong considering its background feat

vs

 

[Lacrymas]

A lot of stuff has been nerfed mostly for the better, yes.

 

[Mr. Magniloquent]

I'm inclined to agree that this Alert feat is an improvement. It's much less mandatory and gives the flexibility of "alerting" another character who might be in peril due to initiative.

 

[Infinitron]

 

[Infinitron]

 

[LabRat]

Paladin smites get absolutely ruined in 2024 D&D, along with the horse bullshit.

D&D 5.0 from 2014 is overall better.

Only 2024 Monk is good.