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Star Renegades - roguelite strategy RPG where you play as the rebels against an evil galactic empire

Discussion in 'General RPG Discussion' started by LESS T_T, Mar 13, 2018.

  1. HoboForEternity sunset tequila Patron

    HoboForEternity
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    basically it's a combination of turn based battle with into the breach.

    your "main character" is basically a dimensional hopper robot. he is on a mission to stop interdimensional invaders from overruning the galaxy. if your heroes die, he hop to other timeline and start again.

    combat: it's fully deterministic and works more like a puzzle. you have an action bar above, each actions takes time and determine who goes first. in a turn enemies movement are already decided so it's your decision to defend or attack. you can push enemies' turn action by hitting them before they act. if you push off the bar you will 'break' them and they will lose their action that turn.

    enemies have limited numbers of crits so you cannot break them forever and stun lock them. overall i think it's a solid mechanics.

    you start with 3 characters each levelled up by defeating enemies on the field. if the character dies, you lose them foerever, if everyone dies, you hop to other dimension and start anew. you have carry over resource called intel and tech. character levels and their equipment are lost when they die, but the the intel which give you permanent perks / buff effect to the party and tech you can buy stuff. these are not lost when you fail a run.

    story is pretty dissapointing and so far the characters are barely characters since they are all interchangeable. each have more personality than x-com soldiers, and they do have banters between each other and a little backstory, but that's it. in the end they are infinite pawns in infinite reality for you to use, then toss. the story is basically "stop the invader"

    other interesting aspect is you have shadow of mordor style nemesis system. the enemy have "generals" you can defeat. the generals that survived persist each run and they level up if they wipe out your party, so the next encounters with them are more dangerous. generals that die are replaced.

    gameplay is excellent, story is meh so far
     
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  2. racofer Thread Incliner

    racofer
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    Graphics are great and will be the main selling point of this game. However, the UI is indeed complete shit. All combat effects are shown with an icon, and there is no description whatsoever about what the fuck all of those icons mean. Mouse-over an icon to get a description? Nope, doesn't happen. Show a list of combat icons with their description? Nope, doesn't exist. Great way to fuck it all up.

    Also, my favorite part when playing the tutorial: (you can check it here as well: https://gamesgds.com/star-renegades-combat-guide-stats-damage-armor-and-more/)

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    So it is deterministic, but inaccurate. Meaning you can see what is going to happen, but anything can happen before it happens. What in the name of fuck. Just make it full turn-based already like it has worked for the hundreds of games that came before it.
     
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  3. Pope Amole II Prestigious Gentleman Nerd Commando Game Studios Developer

    Pope Amole II
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    Actually, that deterministic/random bit is very important - later in the game, there will be enemies who are doing massive damage to a random party member. And the visualisation system knows nothing better than to show the damage indicators as if they did that damage to each party member, meaning that it all hoes haywire and you have no idea how to plan your turn. Which can be sorta "lul ded" scenario in a 100% deterministic system.

    This, however, just boils from the fact that the combat system in this game is one of the worst systems in turn-based gaming ever. Into the Breach worked well with deterministic approach because its fighting grid and the depth of its abilities allowed for a highly combinative and branching combat. In each and every scenario you've had tons of options, with some of those options having heavy consequences on the following rounds and those consequences being predictable. Movement, repositioning, enemy vs enemy goading, terrain interaction, etc.

    Here, however, there's no combat grid so there's absolutely none of that. Instead, the entire game pretty much boils to the following simple chain of actions:

    1. Can burst an enemy without suffering damage > burst him.
    2. If not, delay/stun the enemy while slowly whittling down until you can burst him.
    3. If not, go full defense until you can do 2.

    Once you pierce through all the myriads of obfuscating numbers, you see that the game's mechanics are actually minimalistic. Given that, it's very easy to understand (well, mb not too easy given the glowing reviews in this thread) that in most scenarios you have exactly one course of action for every character. In other words, you have as much tactical agenda as in a freaking popamole shooter - the enemy shoots, cover. The enemy stops, pop. The combat is unbelievably, grotesquely, godlessly railroaded. Just do the commands as the game tells you.

    So it feels much less like a proper rpg-battler and much more like doing your math homeworks - you know the principle so you just patiently apply it one time after another after another. In other words, a fucking chore.

    Add to that that, while the combat is deterministic, the game will screw you with RNG. First, characters have heavily polarized compatibility. For example, marksman with saboteur and either archon or commando will work well. Marksman without these is utter trash and just a waste of character. Valkyrie or Aegis in a squad is a must-have. Two of them are trash, however. Empath as a fifth character will work well. Empath before that is useless. The party building is very limiting in this fashion and, because you don't really control 2 out of 5 party members, you can (and will) get shafted on that.

    Same applies for the weaponry - found good stuff, can do the final boss. No - well, screw you.

    Add to that most of mechanics not working that well (armor is a joke, for example; your armor, that is) and the overall torpidity of the game (it's clunky in all departments) and what remains, lol.

    But I'm sure tryhards who think "loadsanumbers = COMPLEXITY = QUALITY!!!!!!!" will praise it.
     
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  4. agris Arcane Patron

    agris
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    Nice analysis, thanks for that. This quoted part describes late-game BT4 combat to a T.
     
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  5. lightbane Arcane

    lightbane
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    Sounds like I should wait for mnore patches/DLCs/Enhanced Edition then.
     
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  6. Trash Player Scholar

    Trash Player
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    NC isn't wrong but those aren't really deal breakers to anyone who isn't into overanalyzing game design. The real deal breaker is the abysmal and unhelpful UI.

    If you like JRPG, "feel smart" combat, and roguelite, there is no reason not to try as it is on game pass now.
     
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  7. MadMaxHellfire Arcane

    MadMaxHellfire
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    you just praised "into the breach", then complained about how in this game there is one and one only way to fight, which is:
    1) a lie
    2) exactly "into the breach"
     
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  8. Tyranicon A Memory of Eternity Developer

    Tyranicon
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    From the store:

    So... they fuck? My interest went from a 4/10 to a 6/10.
     
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  9. Retardo Literate

    Retardo
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    Tried it for an hour, did tutorial and first map, than refunded.
    Its not entirely shit, but very bland.

    All encounters across the map were same - either a single strong robot, or a bunch of robots consisting of 1-2 shooters and shield stealer/buffer. All you have to do is use the same tactics of pushing enemies attack farther down the queue in order to attack first, crit for massive damage, and then defend. Then there are boss enemies, which are either weak and easily killed or too strong and undefeatable.

    The writing is plain bad and dialogues are cringeworthy. Every character tries to be funny, but fails and looks retarded.

    They tried to go the Octopath way with graphics, but didn't reach its level of quality so everything looks cheap.
    Character portraits are ugly.

    It is funny that Disgae 4, an older game with a (very roughly, I know) similar premise of grind thinly veiled by 'tactical combat', offers a lot more in terms of gameplay depth and complexity.
    Hell, even its plot and character dialogues feel as if written by a much more competented and talented writer - and I fully realize that plot, dialogue and characters in Disgaea are clichéd anime crap.
     
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  10. MadMaxHellfire Arcane

    MadMaxHellfire
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    proud wearer of that name.
     
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  11. Shackleton Cipher Patron

    Shackleton
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    Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Make the Codex Great Again! Pathfinder: Kingmaker
    I've been playing on and off all day, got to the third planet before dying to a boss I knew was going to kill me as I was going in at too low HP/ Armour. I do see the validity in the criticism that there's often 'one right move' you can make with your characters, but that doesn't stop the combat from being entertaining and rewarding. Later on it becomes more about 'which enemy do I break?' and 'how can I cover my squishies?' which does lead to some moderate juggling of priorities. I'd disagree about Valk and Aegis together being trash as Aegis can cover other party members while Valk does her Heavy Attack. There's a decent amount of chars to mix things up a bit so I've not found myself getting bored yet. On the contrary, it's definitely got that 'one more fight before bed' thing going on.

    Miles better than Halcyon 6. I usually get fed up of rogue-lites very quickly as I'm not a big fan of starting again from scratch but with the unlocks after death and different characters to try I'm a long way from getting fed up of this.
     
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  12. anvi Cipher Village Idiot

    anvi
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    [​IMG]
     
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  13. anvi Cipher Village Idiot

    anvi
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    The endless dialogue omfg, and there is no keyboard shortcut so you have to click every line. And there are lots of lines that are a single fucking question mark. Eg:

    Character1: This looks like the place, shall we? [click left mouse....]
    Character2: ? [click left mouse....]
    Character1: Shall we go inside? [click left mouse....]
    Character2: I thought we were going to wait for them? [click left mouse....]
    Character1: ? [click left mouse....]
    Character2: ? [click left mouse....]
    Character1: No lets go in. [click left mouse....]
    Character2: Ok if you say so! [click left mouse....]
    Character1: But wait [click left mouse....]
    Character2: ? [click left mouse....]
    Character1: What about the gem? [click left mouse....]
    Character2: Gem? [click left mouse....]
    Character1: The gem... [click left mouse....]
    Character2: ? [click left mouse....]
    Character1: Every game has a fucking gem... [click left mouse....]
    Character2: Ohhh the gem... [click left mouse....]
    Character1: ... [click left mouse....]
    Character2: ? [click left mouse....]
    Character1: Well yeah, lets get the gem and save the world and then go inside. [click left mouse....]
    Character2: k [click left mouse....]
    Character1: now or? [click left mouse....]
    Character2: yeah now [click left mouse....]
    Character1: wait [click left mouse....]
    Character2: ? [click left mouse....]
    Character1: If you are still reading you might actually like this piece of shit. [click left mouse....]
    Character2: Good to know. [click left mouse....]
    Character1: Lets go get that gem! [click left mouse....]
     
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  14. Infinitron I post news Patron

    Infinitron
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    Grab the Codex by the pussy Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Kingmaker


    https://store.steampowered.com/newshub/app/651670/view/2766856426230738693

     
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  15. Andhaira Arcane

    Andhaira
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    Why does this have such high requirements considering its pixel based?

    But still, intriguing. Am considering buying...are hero characters worth it and is there any magic/psionics?
     
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  16. agris Arcane Patron

    agris
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    I’ll write a blurb about it for ya later but it’s not story game it’s a run based game with a series of fights and some rng influences progression via items. Not entirely unlike FTL actually, which characters acting as different ship variations / unlocks and rng item access being 1:1 with FTL. The overworld in SR is a bit better than FTLs star system map and SR also has analogous random events including random dungeons.
     
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  17. racofer Thread Incliner

    racofer
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    Welcome to the wonderful land of Unity games.
     
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  18. agris Arcane Patron

    agris
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    Andhaira rusty_shackleford

    I'm not familiar with jRPGs so I'm going to describe SR the best way I know how: to use FTL as an analogue.

    The game, at its heart, is a turn based combat game with a maximum party size of 6. There are 4 "worlds" you play through in a linear fashion, and after each world is complete you gain a party member. You start with 3 members, end the game with 6. You choose the 3 party members you start with, and also choose who to pick up along the way. There is no option to play with more / less members.

    Here's where the FTL analogies begin. Starting party members plus those you pick up along the way are analogous to ships to FTL. Various in-game actions unlock party members, such that your 2nd or 3rd run can start with different party members (if you wish) than your first, and definitely will have more party members to pick from as the team size increases. Party members really equals classes, of which there's ~8 or so I think. I also think there is something like 20 characters, so multiple characters of the same class, yet each character within a class has some different abilities and level progression.

    You level from 1 - 10, and there is no RNG about the leveling process. In game information about what skills are gained at what level, and what they do, is poor. Right now external resources are required for planning. Gear is limited, each character has 3 slots (weapon / implant / armor) with each class having a unique weapon type (fist / sword / pistol / rifle) that are not usable by other classes who don't also use that same type of weapon.

    For 3/4 of the worlds, the progression through them is the same: you're on a big map, moving sector by sector, with each sector usually involving a fight plus some sort of resource (credits/items/health/armor). You can go to 3 sectors / day and have 3 days before you fight the boss of that world, and after each day passes some sectors are locked down. You can freely view the whole map at the very start, and so you plan a course through the sectors such that you're opening up the right resources for what you want to accomplish on that planet. For example, I've found its good to access (and thus keep from locking) a sector with a "heal full party" item. I never use it until I've run out of time and about to fight the planet's boss.

    This random sector lockdown / progression is also reminiscent of FTL. Further strengthening the comparison is that, at night (night triggers automatically when you use up your 3 sector accesses/day limit), there are random events. A cave that looked like map art during the day while you were going through sectors all of the sudden has a quest marker over it and it's the entrance to a dungeon, with multiple fights (and thus more EXP), as well as some items. You progress through dungeons in a similar sector by sector manner as the overworld map.

    There is in effect no story, no NPCs, no dialogue to speak of. There's the veneer of a story, but nothing more. I find it suits the game well, and I wouldn't want more than what is there. The most text is when you start a brand new save slot (not the same as a new game), as the tutorial area has some groan-inducing political swipes at people who love guns, and America's Republican party. I'm not as allergic to :agenda: as most people here, but it was offputting and I was worried that the rest of the game would have more obvious political messaging.

    Thankfully, it does not.

    I had no idea the game would be like this, I honestly bought it because I liked the art. I really enjoy the game for what it is, the combat is not easy, and while I found it hardish when I started, I'm now finding it a bit easy at Normal (edit there are two modes more difficult, and I think they change more than #s, they alter mechanics. I may be wrong about that point tho). Being a run-based game, after you beat it once, there's an in-universe explanation to starting all over again. There's a meta layer where whether you finish a run or die, you've accumulated resources that persist across runs (intel, monster kills) that allow you to unlock game-altering options. You can research arms and armor such that the random loot table now contains new types of loot, you can unlock new characters / classes (there are other ways to unlock them as well), and other meta-gamey stuff. Dying is not game over. You do start back at level 1, and the monster that killed you will persist into the next game having leveled up from stopping you.

    I like it, I'm not hardcore like Pope Amole II - I only have a handful of hours into it. No guarantee you'll enjoy it on your 50th hour, but for 15 or so I've found it enjoyable.
     
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  19. HoboForEternity sunset tequila Patron

    HoboForEternity
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    I ran into a run breaking bug, came into a planet and cannot click or move and have to alt F4 and abandon a world
     
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  20. Shackleton Cipher Patron

    Shackleton
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    Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Make the Codex Great Again! Pathfinder: Kingmaker
    Try pressing ` 5 times to open the console, then 'load combatsave'. That'll load your last turn in combat. No guarantee that it won't happen next time you get to that point though.
     
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  21. Thac0 Hopeless Optimist Patron

    Thac0
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    Very interesting game. I bought it after hearing it described as Grandia + Darkest Dungeon + FTL + The Nemesis system from the new LOTR games. And that was certainly an accurate description.

    Game has a very strong start, no big red flags currently, charming visuals, interesting gameplay.
    I would recommend it for the novelty alone, since no element is exactly 100% new, this game mixes elements which appear very rarely. Some, like the timing based pushback initiative, only appear once in a decade.
     
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