Stellaris - Paradox new sci-fi grand strategy game

[Spectacle]

We're talking about space, not worlds. Space is mindbogglingly big, it just doesn't make any sense to have "influence" in a random area of the void.

If a species wants to send some ships to a star system to declare it off limits to others that would be fine, but a bubble of "influence" that radiates from colonies is too much treating space as clay, space should be treated like space and not like an extended planet.

Linear distance isn't necessarily all that important for the FTL options we've had presented, so just because you have a colony a few light years away it doesn't mean that you will have an easier time asserting your influence in a neighbouring system compared to another race whose closest outpost is much farther away.

 

[Kem0sabe]

Space is not a 2 dimensional plane. The zone of influence around a star system or groups of star systems would impossible to enforce, for such is the huge volume of space involved.

 

[Malakal]

Space is not a 2 dimensional plane. The zone of influence around a star system or groups of star systems would impossible to enforce, for such is the huge volume of space involved.

FTL is also impossible so fucking what. You bringing real world to the game now?

And actually its not impossible because of only select angles you can use to efficiently approach planets due to gravity wells and atmospheric entry. Plus its REALLY hard to hide in space so sending out ships to intercept is very easy.

 

[bonescraper]

Plus its REALLY hard to hide in space so sending out ships to intercept is very easy.

It's hard to hide but easy to intercept xDDDD

 

[Malakal]

Plus its REALLY hard to hide in space so sending out ships to intercept is very easy.

It's hard to hide but easy to intercept xDDDD

Umm yes? If you have space ships as in this game you obviously do.

 

[Kem0sabe]

FTL is also impossible so fucking what. You bringing real world to the game now?

And actually its not impossible because of only select angles you can use to efficiently approach planets due to gravity wells and atmospheric entry. Plus its REALLY hard to hide in space so sending out ships to intercept is very easy.

I dislike this particular abstraction.

 

[Inf0mercial]

Just imagine it as your people not wanting to colonize a planet that if war broke out would be flat out impossible to get to before the aliens rocked up and scoured it of all life, although i wonder how zones of influence will move when you rub up right against theirs, do you push theirs back if you have colonized planets on the outskirts of the zone and they don't?

 

[Nahel]

Zone of influence should be seen as areas where colonization or entry give limited casus belli, like raiding the worlds or seizing the ships. Basically a proclamation this area is yours but the other civs should be free to ignore it as long they don't fear the consequences.

 

[Raghar]

Space is not a 2 dimensional plane. The zone of influence around a star system or groups of star systems would impossible to enforce, for such is the huge volume of space involved.

Place active mine minefield around each planet, and missiles shot from these mines would enforce no entry zone?

 

[Turtle-Zone 3000]

Actively placing a mine field around a planet seems rather futile as theres a lot surface area.

 

[bonescraper]

Plus its REALLY hard to hide in space so sending out ships to intercept is very easy.

It's hard to hide but easy to intercept xDDDD

Umm yes? If you have space ships as in this game you obviously do.

When everyone can see each other in space, and when you have distance advantage nobody can intercept anyone if the "tresspassers" don't want to come into contact.

 

[Raghar]

Actively placing a mine field around a planet seems rather futile as theres a lot surface area.

An active mine is a mine that shots missile towards the ship, these mines can have quite a long range, and can be placed at either at planet orbit, or into planet resonance points.

If you can't imagine it. Look into surface navy mines that are shooting torpedoes. That's similar stuff. Or you can imagine them as a small automated battlestations placed on the orbit.

 

[IDtenT]

A spacefaring species would have little interest in colonizing planets either way; hence spacefaring.

It's just a game though. So who cares?

 

[Raghar]

It's just a game though. So who cares?

Gamers?

 

[Kem0sabe]

Would be cool if someone modded a completely space based race into the game, incapable of planetary colonization, resources only from asteroids, living off massive generation ships or space stations.

 

[Tytus]

Would be cool if someone modded a completely space based race into the game, incapable of planetary colonization, resources only from asteroids, living off massive generation ships or space stations.

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/7b/70/aa/7b70aa35914b5a6a2e96edf5e507739d.jpg

Or alternatively.


http://img11.deviantart.net/6a9f/i/...ction_comics_armada_by_wczasowicz-d4ypnuo.jpg

 

[Malakal]

Plus its REALLY hard to hide in space so sending out ships to intercept is very easy.

It's hard to hide but easy to intercept xDDDD

Umm yes? If you have space ships as in this game you obviously do.

When everyone can see each other in space, and when you have distance advantage nobody can intercept anyone if the "tresspassers" don't want to come into contact.

Uh ok? But you are arguing there are no spheres of influence in space so how can the trespasser enter the sphere if he is actively avoiding interception? This is exactly how a sphere of influence is enforced - you detect a violating ship, launch interceptor, the violating ship runs away. Wow sphere of influence in space enforced.

 

[Tytus]

Would be cool if someone modded a completely space based race into the game, incapable of planetary colonization, resources only from asteroids, living off massive generation ships or space stations.

I agree with your dreams but only to an extent. They shouldn't be incapable of colonization, but it should give them penalties. Like Mongols living on the Steps. When they became settled latter generations lost the abilities that made them strong. So by imperial decree all settled Mongols had to send off portion of the population to live on the steps. It should be something similar here. You get bonuses by living in an Armada - your aliens know better how to operate ships, fix them, better understand hyperspace lanes/wormholes are better fighters in zero-g, are better asteroid miners, deal better with space based anomaly reaserch, are better in space combat etc. But only when they live in an Armada. If a procentage of the population living on planets is too big the player looses these bonuses. But generations ships are not the best enviroment to increase your population or build new ships. So I would rather have a mechanic that you can colonize a planet with your own people/robots/slaves thus you grow your empire, but you have keep buidling up and sending more people to the Armada so you won't loose your bonuses. It would be a cool balancing game. Especially when you consider things like uplifting other races etc.

 

[IDtenT]

Actively placing a mine field around a planet seems rather futile as theres a lot surface area.

Reminds me of Homeworld though.

 

[rvm1975]

at least he honest

"Wiz - Former EU4 lead, currently on Stellaris AI"

I think the chance of us putting tactical combat into one of our Grand Strategy Games is somewhere between zero, never and absolutely not. If we were to do tactical combat it would be in a game explicitly designed for it.

 

[Norfleet]

Actively placing a mine field around a planet seems rather futile as theres a lot surface area.

Space mines that rely on enemies to come within a small radius are basically useless. Effective space-mines would basically be pre-launched missiles that hang around in space waiting for something to attack.

When everyone can see each other in space, and when you have distance advantage nobody can intercept anyone if the "tresspassers" don't want to come into contact.

"Not wanting to come into contact" amounts to "giving up on reaching and staying at your destination".

 

[coldcrow]

Result of not having any sense of scale or what vacuum actually means. It's hilarious when in sci-fi they talk about a few kilometers distance when in hot pursuit of another spaceship. It's like a distance of a millimeter and less between 2 racing cars.
On mines, another possible vector would be anything with a strong radiation effect, but the amount of energy to generate large gamma rays or neutron bursts effective at space distances is rather high.

 

[GarfunkeL]

Space mines are actually entirely viable when you go full on hard sci-fi because launch windows between stellar objects become important and there are very few viable approach vectors between two planets, for example. Plus the trajectory of each object can be calculated as well as all possible variations. Because if you start to actually count delta-V, your invasion fleet probably will not have enough fuel to whimsically boost itself anywhere in the endless space and will have to utilize the most economical trajectories for acceleration and deceleration. But rocket science is hard and requires actual math, so most sci-fi writers ignore it and only the easiest-to-utilize bits of Newtonian physics if even that.

And stealth is possible in space but - unless we handwave Alien Unobtanium Tech - only in very specific scenarios. One classic trick is utilized in Europa Strike (final book in the Heritage Trilogy by Ian Douglas) in which a Chinese science vessel embarks Earth to closely study the Sun. When it reaches the "other side" of the star, it is for all practical purposes invisible to all sensors on Earth and can unveil its massive rail gun, that is then used to destroy the American cruiser guarding Europa (the moon, not the continent), as its patrol route has been studied and is well known - hitting it is then only a mathematical exercise. This leads to the plot point of the book where USMC has to fight on Europa against the Chinese invasion while cut off from Earth and without air/space support for that classic underdog feeling.

And once you get outside of any solar system, the distances become so mind boggling that it would be easy to hide - not because you can mask your IR signature (which is impossible as far as we know) but because there is just so much space to track that without a very comprehensive sensor systems and sufficient computer software to analyze the raw data, it actually becomes possible to hide a ship in plain sight.

 

[Destroid]

GarfunkeL that's all over now we can detect gravity waves.

 

[coldcrow]

I can see the value of mines or weapon platforms in a solar system. Hell if you want to cut off a planet from space travel, you "just" have to induce a Kessler-syndrome.