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SureAI's new project: Enderal - The Shards of Order (Mostly about Enderal SE now)

Yosharian

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Alright so 45 hours into my playthrough I think I'm done with the game, I've enjoyed it quite a bit but I've pretty much maxed out my character and I'm not really interested in the story or the quests so that's it for me.

My verdict on The Path is that it's pretty excellent even though it has some flaws as I explained above. Also it just got updated so it seems that the author hasn't abandoned it after all which is what I thought might have happened.

I have more thoughts on Enderal itself than The Path at this point. While it's a fantastic achievement considering the context - and the fact that it is free - it is still heavily flawed. To attempt to sum up some thoughts I have on it:

1) It's so janky in places - you can tell that it's a new game crammed into the shell of Skyrim and it's rather jarring and awkward. I know this is a vague criticism but I don't know how to explain it better.
2) There's some unfinished parts such as areas that have no English VA but instead have either German VA or the actors don't even say any audio (but their mouths still move and the subtitles play).
3) The quests are too numerous and the quality of them often suffers as a result, I feel like at least a third of the quests could be removed and the game would improve, if anything.
4) The quest design gets too fed-exy at times and it seems like the game borrows too heavily from Skyrim in this regard - they took one of the worst elements of Skyrim here IMO.
5) The game is most fun at the start where you are just organically exploring and discovering the map piece by piece - really getting to know the world. Once you hit Ark, the aforementioned fed-ex quest design takes over and you just feel like you're playing scuffed Skyrim.
6) The combat system feels quite dated for 2022, I should probably have tried to use more talents I suppose but I felt like my playstyle didn't evolve much over 45 hours. Once I got Fire Arrows I basically just used that forever. The dodge mechanics that The Path adds really helped make the combat more fun but it needs more. Maybe a mage/fighter playstyle would have been more interesting, I dunno.
7) The main quest, characters and writing overall is really not that good. It's 'OK', and much, much better than other things people have made for Skyrim, but it's still lacking. I just was totally unengaged by the main quest and didn't care at all about what was going on plot-wise.

That said, I really like the music.

So yeah. That's it.
 

thesheeep

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Yosharian I think 1) 5) and 6) are just inherited baggage from the engine they are using.
It's not wrong to criticize it, but you can't really get the Elder Scrolls out of the Creation Engine (is it still called that?), no matter what you try.

About 3) I agree that less would have been more but I still found their lesser quests more interesting than anything e.g. in normal Skyrim.

I don't know about 4). The way I play these games is that I take some quest and while going to the quest destination, I uncover and explore what's roughly on the way there. So even if a quest is more or less just "go here, fetch X, come back", I'm not really bothered by that at all.
I only find these annoying when they happen e.g. within a city and you've already been around the city so fed-exing just feels like endless backtracking.

7) I had the exact opposite experience :lol:. I found the main story quite engaging (mostly due to how different it is from the usual fare) and wanted to see how it ends.
That motivated me enough to actually finish the game, despite late game Skyrim/etc. always being the worst part gameplay-wise as every "challenge" is a complete pushover.
 

Yosharian

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Yosharian I think 1) 5) and 6) are just inherited baggage from the engine they are using.
It's not wrong to criticize it, but you can't really get the Elder Scrolls out of the Creation Engine (is it still called that?), no matter what you try.

About 3) I agree that less would have been more but I still found their lesser quests more interesting than anything e.g. in normal Skyrim.

I don't know about 4). The way I play these games is that I take some quest and while going to the quest destination, I uncover and explore what's roughly on the way there. So even if a quest is more or less just "go here, fetch X, come back", I'm not really bothered by that at all.
I only find these annoying when they happen e.g. within a city and you've already been around the city so fed-exing just feels like endless backtracking.

7) I had the exact opposite experience :lol:. I found the main story quite engaging (mostly due to how different it is from the usual fare) and wanted to see how it ends.
That motivated me enough to actually finish the game, despite late game Skyrim/etc. always being the worst part gameplay-wise as every "challenge" is a complete pushover.
Yeah that's totally fair, in a way it's unfortunate that they didn't have a different engine to work in. There were a lot of lighting bugs although I don't know if that was because of the ENB.

Fair enough with regard to the main story. I wanted so hard to be engaged by it but I just was forced to admit that I had zero motivation once I'd maxed out my armor etc.
 

Jasede

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You're missing out, the climax is so good! I thought it was really moving. But I guess it just wasn't for you.

Man, I feel so bad for you - not in a condescending way. I'm just sad you can't have that huge emotional impact I got from it.

"I led them to the light, I alone..."

I'll never be able to play it again, it's too sad...



For what's it worth, I didn't really warm up to the characters or story until much later in the game.
 

Jasede

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To put it into perspective, the ending had me so stunned I couldn't touch any other game for 3-4 months after, nothing could really fill the hole that game made in my heart. Similar to NieR: Automata ending E.
 

Paul_cz

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I'm not really interested in the story or the quests so that's it for me.
WTF. That's the best thing about Enderal. Have you even met The Father? Or Esme? Ryneus?

And I am surprised you "maxed out" at 45 hours. My playthrough took some 140 hours and I felt had stuff to spend money on for most of the playthrough.
 

thesheeep

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the ending is trash, everything you did the whole game doesnt matter because reapers something lelol.
How could you even come to that conclusion?
The ending is almost the opposite of Mass Effect. In ME3, the ending really makes almost all previous choices irrelevant as everything except Earth gets annihilated anyway.
All those planets visited / saved, the choices made on them? Doesn't matter one inch, all gone now and nobody will ever see em again.

In Enderal, on the other hand....
Your choice at the end actually makes sure that (almost) everything you achieved DOES matter, as there's still a world around for all the consequences of your actions to matter in.

Unless of course you pick the other ending and everything just dies :lol:
But it can be safely assumed that's not canon.

What you do is the equivalent of stopping the Reapers before they destroy most of the galaxy.
 
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thesheeep

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Unless of course you pick the other ending and everything just dies :lol:
But it can be safely assumed that's not canon.
There won't by any other game or mod made in this setting, so there's no canon ending.
What makes you think that there won't be another game in the series?
Nehrim was an Oblivion mod. Enderal is a Skyrim mod. Part III will likely either be a mod to the next ES game or just a game on its own.

SureAI is still around and kicking.
I don't see a reason to assume the story won't be continued, it's a no-brainer given the success of Enderal. It will just be a while until that happens.
 

thesheeep

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What makes you think that there won't be another game in the series?
they made their own company and proceeded to make some mobile-tier game about rafting
They made both Nehrim and Enderal as that same company.
It's not like they made Enderal and then decided to form a company, cutting ties to what they did before.

Developing smaller in-between-projects is nothing unusual, especially if it happens as a probable test-run for potential engines.
Not everyone wants to work the PB way of developing the same game in the same way for 10+ times in a row without a break :lol:

There is 0 reason to assume they don't want to get back to the series.
In all likelihood, their currently unannounced project is part III already or they are waiting for the next ES to drum up hype.
 
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Codex Year of the Donut
What makes you think that there won't be another game in the series?
they made their own company and proceeded to make some mobile-tier game about rafting
They made both Nehrim and Enderal as that same company.
It's not like they made Enderal and then decided to form a company, cutting ties to what they did before.

Developing smaller in-between-projects is nothing unusual, especially if it happens as a probable test-run for potential engines.
Not everyone wants to work the PB way of developing the same game in the same way for 10+ times in a row without a break :lol:

There is 0 reason to assume they don't want to get back to the series.
In all likelihood, their currently unannounced project is part III already or they are waiting for the next ES to drum up hype.
afaik the talent already got poached
 

thesheeep

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afaik the talent already got poached
Well, that would be sad news.
And going from their official forums, moderators there said that it is unlikely the team will return to the Vyn universe.

How sad, indeed.
And odd - they had such a surefire success on their hands.
But if the team dispersed after Enderal, there's little that can be done.
 
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Sharpedge

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Unless of course you pick the other ending and everything just dies :lol:
But it can be safely assumed that's not canon.
There won't by any other game or mod made in this setting, so there's no canon ending.
What makes you think that there won't be another game in the series?
Nehrim was an Oblivion mod. Enderal is a Skyrim mod. Part III will likely either be a mod to the next ES game or just a game on its own.

SureAI is still around and kicking.
I don't see a reason to assume the story won't be continued, it's a no-brainer given the success of Enderal. It will just be a while until that happens.
There was a post on reddit by the lead developers a while ago that said that even if there is another Elder Scrolls game, its very unlikely there will be another mod like this made. The tl;dr was that at the time of their life they made Enderal, they were studying at University and had a ton of spare time they could sink into a passion project without worrying about money. Now, they have left university, they have jobs and most of the team has drifted apart. Even if they wanted to make another game together, its unlikely they could get everyone together and working on a project in tandem. SureAI still "exists" but it isn't the SureAI that made Enderal.
 

Ivan

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To put it into perspective, the ending had me so stunned I couldn't touch any other game for 3-4 months after, nothing could really fill the hole that game made in my heart. Similar to NieR: Automata ending E.
Speaking of stunning endings, the only one I felt was stunning was that of Silent Hill 2. I don't remember anything about this one...just that I wanted it to be over. The quest I remember the most is the datematching one with the wizard. Cute stuff!
 

Popiel

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No, SureAI effectively lost this IP, which is the most funny caveat. AFAIK it's one of the former devs, not affiliated right now neither with SureAI nor Lietzau (novels' writer), who staked the claim, and because of how German copyright law works its now his. Hilarious.
 

pakoito

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No, SureAI effectively lost this IP, which is the most funny caveat. AFAIK it's one of the former devs, not affiliated right now neither with SureAI nor Lietzau (novels' writer), who staked the claim, and because of how German copyright law works its now his. Hilarious.
You had me at 'cos Germany.
 

Paul_cz

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fatherl3ebk.png
 

Yosharian

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No, SureAI effectively lost this IP, which is the most funny caveat. AFAIK it's one of the former devs, not affiliated right now neither with SureAI nor Lietzau (novels' writer), who staked the claim, and because of how German copyright law works its now his. Hilarious.
Wait what
 

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