Might and Magic The Might and Magic Discussion Thread

[Luzur]

well if i where allowed to vote more then one time i would have voted MM1-MM2-MM3, but MM3 left the biggest mark on of those 3.

 

[Stabwound]

I think this poll reset when they changed forum software, because I'm positive I already voted for this. And I voted for WoX.

 

[RyuRanX]

I can't decide between World of Xeen and The Mandate of Heaven. Probably the latter.

By the way, I still have my certificate from that game:

 

[Stabwound]

I love MM3-5, and I know MM6 is also a loved game, but I tried it for a few minutes and found it barf-worthy. Almost everything seems like a step back from the previous three games, and the combat is a complete clusterfuck. And I hate the free-roaming crap compared to grid-based exploration.

What the fuck is so good about the game that everyone likes so much? WoX worked so well; everything was polished and still looks awesome and holds up well today. MM6 looks like it was designed by Prosper and everything is clunky as fuck, especially the combat.

Is the game at all like WoX? I could only stand playing for about 20 minutes before I gave up.

 

[octavius]

I love MM3-5, and I know MM6 is also a loved game, but I tried it for a few minutes and found it barf-worthy. Almost everything seems like a step back from the previous three games, and the combat is a complete clusterfuck. And I hate the free-roaming crap compared to grid-based exploration.

What the fuck is so good about the game that everyone likes so much? WoX worked so well; everything was polished and still looks awesome and holds up well today. MM6 looks like it was designed by Prosper and everything is clunky as fuck, especially the combat.

Huge world to explore, superb loot whoring, excellent level design, lots of side quests and excellent character development with the need to find trainers.
Yeah, combat leaves a lot to be desired, but the same could be said of MM3-5. Personally I think the real time combat was a natural progression from the simplified (compared to MM1-2) combat mechanics of MM3-5.
And carpet bombing enemies with Meteor Swarm and Star Burst, especially when you are flying above them, is fun in MM6. :D

 

[groke]

I've never been able to get far into MM6< either, shitty controls (I need to keep swapping one hand from keyboard to mouse what is this shit), absolutely fucking hideous (Darkside is one of the most attractive RPGs I've ever played), RTwP, etc. The first 5 M&M games are some of my favourites of all time and then they got 3DO'd.

P.S. I wish I could have voted for one of the first three, but I gotta fight the good fight.

 

[Redlands]

I love MM3-5, and I know MM6 is also a loved game, but I tried it for a few minutes and found it barf-worthy. Almost everything seems like a step back from the previous three games, and the combat is a complete clusterfuck. And I hate the free-roaming crap compared to grid-based exploration.

What the fuck is so good about the game that everyone likes so much? WoX worked so well; everything was polished and still looks awesome and holds up well today. MM6 looks like it was designed by Prosper and everything is clunky as fuck, especially the combat.

Is the game at all like WoX? I could only stand playing for about 20 minutes before I gave up.

I kind of felt the same way, but fate forced me into giving it another go. It does take some getting used to, and I didn't really like it as much as WoX but it was still pretty fun. Maybe just take a break and play another game in between? I don't really remember the details of WoX, but MM6 is definitely a Might and Magic game.

Although I have to confess to having the same problem with MM7 and now MM8: the first time I played it properly put me off, and I had to restart it to get through the games (not restarted MM8 yet, but I may do even though I've heard it's easy and not good). They completely change the interface but keep the same engine for no reason as far as I can see (aside from to make it look like they've made lots of changes to the game engine, perhaps) and they have some really bad design decisions that just get worse as the series went on, but big surprise there.

 

[Luzur]

i never really had a problem when i started MM6 for the first time (i still remember the day i bought it, it was a very grey and rainy autumn wednesday, but i was happy as fuck cuz a new Might and Magic game was out!!!!.), just some slight bewilderment (and a moment of scare) when i accidently hit Enter in my first fight against goblins.

 

[Lonely Vazdru]

MM6 looks like it was designed by Prosper

 

[Stabwound]

I had to google search that because I literally couldn't tell if it was from MM6 or if it was a turd elemental. Sadly, it really is a MM6 monster.

I guess I'll hold back my vomit reflex and take another stab at MM6 once I finish Ultima 5, but good god is it revolting. It looks like some kind of surrealist art the way every part of the UI/world/graphics is so jarring and doesn't go together at all, and how the NPCs/monsters look like they're made out of paper that flops toward you like a horde of zombies with 2 frames of animation each. The cherry on top is the porn actor faces used as character portraits. Late 2D pixel art trumps early 3D (and arguably even modern 3D) so hard it hurts. But hell, Wizardry 8 came out only a few years after MM6 and not only looks much better but plays much better as well. The 3D free-roaming first person is the other thing that turned me off instantly. It feels like you're roller skating around and actually gave me motion sickness.

I keep hearing about how the actual gameplay itself is great despite everything else actively trying to make the game a piece of shit, so I'll try to give it another shot. I'm by no means a graphics whore (hell I'm a roguelike fanatic) but how can you go from the gorgeous artwork and engine of MM5 to the hideous and clunky disaster of MM6?

MM4/5

MM6... what the fuck

You have to see the game in motion to get an idea of how awful everything looks. But holy shit this is some grade A decline.

 

[Lonely Vazdru]

The cherry on top is the porn actor faces used as character portraits.

That one hurt really bad. Devs probably realized it because they dumped it in 7 and 8. Both still use the same ugly engine though.

As for the game themselves I also prefer 3-5 over 6-8 but they are all worth playing. I only regret that 6 doesn't feature the more developed skill system and the "moving during trun based combat" of 7/8 because it's otherwise superior.

 

[Rpgsaurus Rex]

@ Stabwound

M&M6 is a legendary game. You have to play it, or at least give it a try! It features probably the BIGGEST dungeons in the history of cRPGs, and the dungeon design is pretty good AFAIR. Temple of Baa. Tomb of Varn. These names still inspire rightful terror into those who have experienced them once...

You'll be thinking "ok, I've had a ton of stuff happen already, there I will probably see the end soon". Nah, you've just passed the intro hall!!!

The shitty graphics you stop noticing very soon, they're functional, and somewhat endearing after a while.

It is a *huge* game.

Biggest disadvantage is probably how you can abuse "exploits" in the engine once you figure them out. The solution is to discipline yourself and not to do that (not hard), or game becomes a bit easy.

And take breaks between playing - or the game will wear you out...

And use FAQs and guides, or take notes at least - remembering where to find trainers, esp. master and GM level, becomes tedious otherwise.

 

[Lonely Vazdru]

It features probably the BIGGEST dungeons in the history of cRPGs, and the dungeon design is pretty good AFAIR. Temple of Baa. Tomb of Varn. These names still inspire rightful terror into those who have experienced them once...

Castle Darkmoor went so far with this too big and too many enemies policy (plus the "dispel magic through walls" bug) that it's forever engraved in my reptilian brain.

I agree that the game is legendary and a "must play" for any M&M enthusiast (playing it for the first time is one of my fondest gaming memories), but WoX is still better so I also understand Stabwound's rant.

 

[Turjan]

I think this poll reset when they changed forum software, because I'm positive I already voted for this. And I voted for WoX.

Yes, I'm positive I voted on this, too. Well, voted again - for M&M6.

I absolutely loved the game with it's free-roaming world exploration and huge dungeons. I think my first playthrough took me something like 150 hours. Then I immediately started a second playthrough with a different party (2 druids, 2 sorcerers). I'm not sure whether I have that much time for games nowadays anymore, though.

 

[Luzur]

dont forget Castle Alamos.

 

[Eyeball]

Just finished playing MM7 as my first MM game. My overall reaction: I wish this was as good as Wizardry 8.

Almost all combat became exceptionally tedious by the end game and there was just so fucking much of it. I kind of died inside halfway through the Medusa and Behemoth infested tunnels to Giantland at the end. Wasn't hard, just took 30000 years.

And what the FUCK was up with all that sci-fi stuff in the end? Blasters? Robot assassin droids? Downed spaceships? Get the fuck out of here with that shit!

Nice spell system, though, although it seemed to encourage metagaming quite badly and some schools were essential while others useless. I don't know what the hell I'd have done without a water mage to cast town portal and water walk, but my psionic didn't seem to get many spells that really changed gameplay apart from blastin' foo's.

 

[Rpgsaurus Rex]

Thats why you need to take breaks from M&M's.

I agree, the Behemoth tunnels at the end of M&M7 were definitely the low point of the game...

And yes, the ending area of M&M7 was derp. o_O

 

[groke]

And what the FUCK was up with all that sci-fi stuff in the end? Blasters? Robot assassin droids? Downed spaceships? Get the fuck out of here with that shit!

Wiz 6-7-8 does exactly this?

and it ain't Might and Magic without Iron Wizards.

 

[DaveO]

Might & Magic has always been about finding the exploits to make the game easier. MM6 had the ICBM technique, MM7 and MM8 had Invisibility and Protection From Magic.

The M&M games have had sci-fi elements for a long time in the series, so seeing robots and technology stuff was a staple of the series.

 

[Rpgsaurus Rex]

It still felt a bit silly coming from a pure fantasy setting into science fiction... Esp. coming from a HoM&M background.

 

[Stabwound]

Wizardry did the same thing, mixing sci-fi into the fantasy setting, for some bizarre reason.

 

[hoverdog]

Just finished playing MM7 as my first MM game. My overall reaction: I wish this was as good as Wizardry 8.

Almost all combat became exceptionally tedious by the end game and there was just so fucking much of it. I kind of died inside halfway through the Medusa and Behemoth infested tunnels to Giantland at the end. Wasn't hard, just took 30000 years.

And what the FUCK was up with all that sci-fi stuff in the end? Blasters? Robot assassin droids? Downed spaceships? Get the fuck out of here with that shit!

Nice spell system, though, although it seemed to encourage metagaming quite badly and some schools were essential while others useless. I don't know what the hell I'd have done without a water mage to cast town portal and water walk, but my psionic didn't seem to get many spells that really changed gameplay apart from blastin' foo's.

So you didn't have a problem with sci-fi elements in Wiz8, though they were completely absurd, and found M&M blasters appalling?

 

[JarlFrank]

Fuck the haters, the sci-fi elements in M&M and Wiz are fucking awesome. Campy fantasy + campy scifi makes for the ultimate awesome setting.

 

[Darth Roxor]

Fuck the haters, the sci-fi elements in M&M and Wiz are fucking awesome. Campy fantasy + campy scifi makes for the ultimate awesome setting.

Can't brofist enough. Fuck you all fags

 

[Jaesun]

It was the 80's. Sci-fi and Fantasy were the thing then. That's why they were in there. And then Gariott went all batshit crazy with this in Ultima I.