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The Outer Worlds: Spacer's Choice Edition - Obsidian's first-person sci-fi RPG set in a corporate space colony

KeighnMcDeath

RPG Codex Boomer
Joined
Nov 23, 2016
Messages
12,865
Uh oh!
zombie-chimp-boys-costume.jpg
 

gurugeorge

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Aug 3, 2019
Messages
7,437
Location
London, UK
Strap Yourselves In
Still playing TOW, and I'm puzzling over trying to further pin down what's unsatisfactory about it, despite it being fun in parts. I think it's 2 things:-

1) The "Pavlovian" nature of the design, as I said in my earlier post. It's like it's been designed to push one's buttons, and one feels like a lab rat. Now of course all games have some element of that, but I feel it's all been done in a rather soulless way with this, as a mechanical exercise. One might almost say it's too competent in this regard. Virtually everything that's player-facing in the game is designed to elicit a player reaction. Even the humour is designed in a particular way, for a particular kind of audience (social-status aware SJWs).

This is in contradistinction to a game where there's some intent to design a virtual world that has things just because that's how the world is. The game lacks a sense that these places have a life of their own, they're just so blatantly designed to invite the player to certain thoughts and actions, to present POIs in a logical flow, etc. It also makes exploration oddly unsatisfying, because you don't get the illusion that you're actually discovering something - you're always aware that you've been led by the nose to the discovered thing (e.g. like noticing a path up the side of a hill - you just know there's going to be something there, as opposed to it being a mystery whether there will be something there or not, it might just be a part of the landscape that doesn't reward you for exploration).

It's almost like the devs are deathly afraid to disappoint the player in any way. But the problem is, where there's no risk of disappointment, there's no excitement of discovery.

2) The dialogue. This is tricky because I actually like some of what they've done with the dialogue - there's an attempt in the dialogue to make the player's responses more logical (as in, what someone might be inclined to say in that given situation), as opposed to being options that just move the player along the plot in certain ways. It's almost the opposite problem of 1), where there's a lot of flavour in the dialogue that actually disguises what the optimal choices might be. But the problem here is that the chat is too Fourth Wall-ish, too self-aware, too winking, and not just that, but (again) its sense of humour is that of SJW-infected college graduates, a very narrow band of humour that walks on eggshells and can't really afford any visceral humour (because that relies on truth).
 

Wesp5

Arcane
Joined
Apr 18, 2007
Messages
1,755
It's almost like the devs are deathly afraid to disappoint the player in any way. But the problem is, where there's no risk of disappointment, there's no excitement of discovery.

This sums it up quite nicely. It's like a modern Disney blockbusters, ticking off items on a list so that every fanservice is give, while loosing the heart and soul of its story...
 

Diggfinger

Arcane
Joined
Jan 6, 2014
Messages
1,200
Location
Belgium
To me its mainly that the skill system is so shallow. You get wayy too many perk points, and with too few useful skills to choose from you get the best ones very quickly. I played at the 2nd to hardest difficulty (no way Im skipping quicksaves, screw that).

The world and dialogue was pretty amusing, an obviously there are many paths through it.

But man did it feel like a slog. Got so fed up near the end - and I only played around 15hours!
 

gurugeorge

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Aug 3, 2019
Messages
7,437
Location
London, UK
Strap Yourselves In
I will say though, that the music and audio are amazing. Justin Bell and his audio team at Obsidian really knocked it out of the park with TOW.

It's almost a shame, because the theme tune is so stirring, one feels it ought to be for a better game :)
 

gurugeorge

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Aug 3, 2019
Messages
7,437
Location
London, UK
Strap Yourselves In
(TOW again) I just got so bored with my Normal playthrough I decided to start a Supernova playthrough to see if it improves the gameplay.

And it does somewhat. Everything's a bit more meaningful with the extra difficulty - still not hugely challenging, more like a standard "hard" difficulty would be in an old school game. But a bit more meaty and "proper," so that you need to min-max a bit and eke out the extra buffs from foods/drinks and armor.

Only trouble is the difficulty setting mixes up better gameplay with "survival" stuff that's out of place in a game like this that has a day/night cycle that's measured in minutes and that's basically a cramped space with POI shoved down your throat every 10 seconds. And it's not as if you're even all that challenged for ammo, parts and food - they're still fairly abundant, pretty much enough for what you need, with a bit of rep and vendor perking (although that's better than on Normal where you get so much of everything it's just silly). It does make the inducement to look in every nook and cranny more meaningful.

Also, the companion death is just annoying rather than adding to the challenge or immersion, because unless you invest in them they're made of paper and they're going to die pretty quickly on Supernova no matter what you do, so that forces you down a certain path - I suppose either solo or companion investment. Or just have them on passive so they don't get aggro? (but then you might as well go Lone Wolf)
 

Cpt. Dallas

Learned
Joined
Dec 15, 2020
Messages
515
Location
Keep on the Borderlands
Damn you for keeping this thread alive. At some point in a game drought this will go on sale for 5 bucks and I might be tempted to buy it, but I shouldn't.

LudensCogitet said: ↑
I actually can't see myself recommending this game if it was free.
I effectively got it for $1 (because of Gamepass on PC) and I had to force myself to finish it.
MadMaxHellfire said: ↑
i got it literally for free and i had to force myself not to vomit. stay away from this crap, even cyberspunk is better. enough said.
BlackGoat said: ↑
Yeah 1 dollar play thru on game pass and it felt like a job
Hoaxmetal said: ↑
Don't give those degenerates any money.
Riddler said: ↑
Less than 0. I got it for free on gamepass and I want my time back.

:despair:
 

jackofshadows

Magister
Joined
Oct 21, 2019
Messages
4,488
Or just have them on passive so they don't get aggro?
Yes, that's the only reasonable way to keep them alive. I still walked alone half the game time though but that's me, I like to play solo in games like this. Overall supernova enchance the experience (no matter how shallow it may be) but the overabundance of recources nulifies it all anyway, gameplay speaking.
 

gurugeorge

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Aug 3, 2019
Messages
7,437
Location
London, UK
Strap Yourselves In
Still haven't played it. Am I missing anything?

See my posts above. There's some fun to be had, but it's not that great. Someone said that Cyberpunk 2077 is better - I'd agree. I put CP0277 at 6/10, maybe 7 in places, and this is just below 5/10 on Normal, but it just about gets to 6/10 on Supernova.

It's an okay shooter in places, and the bullet time thing is well done, it's got some RPG elements but they don't matter unless you play on Supernova. There's some mild amusement to be had from the story and the characters, but it's chock full of SJW box-ticking, to a degree that some might find painful. Music and audio are great.
 

Nano

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Mar 6, 2016
Messages
4,647
Grab the Codex by the pussy Strap Yourselves In
There's a much more efficient way to avoid the characters in this game, ya know.
 

Zeriel

Arcane
Joined
Jun 17, 2012
Messages
13,379
Still playing TOW, and I'm puzzling over trying to further pin down what's unsatisfactory about it, despite it being fun in parts. I think it's 2 things:-

1) The "Pavlovian" nature of the design, as I said in my earlier post. It's like it's been designed to push one's buttons, and one feels like a lab rat. Now of course all games have some element of that, but I feel it's all been done in a rather soulless way with this, as a mechanical exercise. One might almost say it's too competent in this regard. Virtually everything that's player-facing in the game is designed to elicit a player reaction. Even the humour is designed in a particular way, for a particular kind of audience (social-status aware SJWs).

This is in contradistinction to a game where there's some intent to design a virtual world that has things just because that's how the world is. The game lacks a sense that these places have a life of their own, they're just so blatantly designed to invite the player to certain thoughts and actions, to present POIs in a logical flow, etc. It also makes exploration oddly unsatisfying, because you don't get the illusion that you're actually discovering something - you're always aware that you've been led by the nose to the discovered thing (e.g. like noticing a path up the side of a hill - you just know there's going to be something there, as opposed to it being a mystery whether there will be something there or not, it might just be a part of the landscape that doesn't reward you for exploration).

It's almost like the devs are deathly afraid to disappoint the player in any way. But the problem is, where there's no risk of disappointment, there's no excitement of discovery.

2) The dialogue. This is tricky because I actually like some of what they've done with the dialogue - there's an attempt in the dialogue to make the player's responses more logical (as in, what someone might be inclined to say in that given situation), as opposed to being options that just move the player along the plot in certain ways. It's almost the opposite problem of 1), where there's a lot of flavour in the dialogue that actually disguises what the optimal choices might be. But the problem here is that the chat is too Fourth Wall-ish, too self-aware, too winking, and not just that, but (again) its sense of humour is that of SJW-infected college graduates, a very narrow band of humour that walks on eggshells and can't really afford any visceral humour (because that relies on truth).

I found the C&C not really mattering at all more of a deathknell. If you're gonna do the C&C thing and make it your selling point and then it actually doesn't matter and just feels hollow... well, why else am I playing your game? There are plenty of better shooters with environments that are more fun to explore and have more stuff to find, better shooting mechanics, etc.

On the one hand I could say it was a huge disappointment in that it was supposed to be Cain & Boyarsky's return to grace... but that would imply I actually thought it was going to be. It was more that I was hoping against hope they would prove themselves, and instead they met my cynical expectations that their best days are behind them and they're just riding out their days until retirement. I guess with all that went down at Blizzard we now know why Boyarsky wanted to "downgrade" to Obsidian.
 
Joined
Jan 14, 2018
Messages
50,754
Codex Year of the Donut
everyone is fuckin offensively ugly, all the jokes overstay their welcome and then are beaten to death especially anything involving terminals, the writers don't know how to write so they substitute personality with gender race and sexuality, nothing matters because it's a "lol so zany" comedy game except it tries to be serious at times but the writers aren't capable of doing it so it's even worse than if it was just a comedy, the stealth is fuckin atrocious and some of the worst I've ever seen, perks or w/e they're called are worthless therefore the phobia system is worthless, nearly all the doors are just painted on and is especially painful in the last area where it's just a bunch of hallways with painted on doors, I remember disliking the companion AI or someshit idk I barely remember the game's RPG mechanics at all so they must have been dogshit in general
on the upside, you can kill nearly anyone and you're going to do it because nearly everyone you encounter is a fuckin ugly retard

nobody would have given two shits about the game if it wasn't released shortly after the Fallout First blunder
the next time you see anything advertising "from the creators of [thing you like] comes [shitty product]", run away. Good products don't need to namedrop.

I liked Vicar Max though.
 

Zeriel

Arcane
Joined
Jun 17, 2012
Messages
13,379
The constant "corporations are bad mmkay" commentary in every single quest, lore tidbit, and piece of dialogue definitely started to wear its welcome out after a while. It's one thing to have some meta commentary in the setting, but I guess dangerhairs couldn't keep it subtle and had to slam you over the head with the crowbar of the theme constantly. Commies gonna commie.
 
Joined
Jan 14, 2018
Messages
50,754
Codex Year of the Donut
The constant "corporations are bad mmkay" commentary in every single quest, lore tidbit, and piece of dialogue definitely started to wear its welcome out after a while. It's one thing to have some meta commentary in the setting, but I guess dangerhairs couldn't keep it subtle and had to slam you over the head with the crowbar of the theme constantly. Commies gonna commie.
Corporations are bad, all they gave us was interstellar travel and colonization of alien planets.
 

jackofshadows

Magister
Joined
Oct 21, 2019
Messages
4,488
I just started playing this a while back and deleted my saves and started over just to avoid recruiting Parvati.
You could've just shot her in the face, you know. Or yeah, play something else. It's not like Parvati is the only game's problem.
 

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