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Btw, I find you rather hypocrite that you rant and rant everytime a female chick is shown "overboobsied" for the male audience and then you make so bad feminine jokes. What happens if you accept one of Mara's "gifts" (he's so wise he metagames lol)? I hope he's not bi Xp
Since the ending path is locked, could you at least explain what happens on the other endings?
Great LP, too bad that I only watch the screenshots - I don't want to spoil my future experience with both SMT games by reading about the story (LOL @ story in dungeon crawlers).
Yes, what Deuxhero said. Though the only way of making the questions more obvious would be to go, like, Messiah, are you are a retard?
And don't take me so seriously, Lightbane. I mean, the bloody jokes are terribad at best, you can't take them seriously no matter how hard you try. And compared to the kind of chauvinist jokes the Codex has threw my way it is, like, kindergarten stuff, really.
And most of the time if you have to pick between she's being stupid and, like, she's being mean, you can bet I forgot to turn on my brain that morning, so chill out, don't worry and stuff. I'm just fooling around. :3
And about the other endings, sure. I'll also explain some weird things about the Shin Megami Tensei continuity while i'm at it and stuff. I also have to think for a better way to do the alignment thingies for the next Let's Play.
Also,
@ Deuxhero
I'm still waiting for that Let's Play of the Kuzunoha Raidou games! x3
Edity Edit:
Have you played Devil Survivor or the Hitlersona one, Mirror-Kun? So i pick something you at least can read without getting the first playthrough spoiled since you already got the basic plot, for the next one T-T I'm too nice.
Chapter the seventeenth; The Thousand Year Kingdom. In which our heroine invades Kether Castle, cuts a bloody path through Lucifer's armies, defeats Beelzebub for extra experience just because she can, and finally faces off against the morningstar, escapes his Plan B in the nick of time, and anihilates all life and sin from creation. Then Satan pulls a Geburah and the most epic battle ever is fought.
and judge of all in heaven and earth, demon and human! Lend your power to me and my retribution! Let us bring divine vengeance upon the head of Maou Lucifer!
Daitenshi Satan himself joins us, then, and the objective's clear. His sheet is simply crazy, and later on he will be pulling over 750 damage criticals on Lucifer's boss form and more than 550 damage criticals on you know who, when somewhat buffed. We then leave straight for Kether Castle, passing near the tower thingie I mentioned before as to screenshot it. As i said before the game does not want you teleporting straight to Chokmah but there is a way around it, since last time we saved it was in Chokmah's recording stone and Mariah's Toraport spell takes us straigh to the last place we saved in. :3 That saves me quite a walk, which is pretty important since with Satan in my party we are taking around 60 Magnetite each step.
Once in Kether Castle we near the gates and again the soul of the left and right gates try to keep us out. This time, however, as soon as they finish talking Satan decides to intervene.
Did he really think he could hinder me with such a simple device!?
And then throws the gates down, showing subtlety is not always the right way to approach a problem. Once inside, though, speed is of the essence as the last dungeon is huge and not even the almost 45k magnetite I have brought with me will be enough to reach Lucifer if I try to map every single square, not even taking into account the Magnetite i'll get out of killing each and every single demon I meet. So let's get going! First thing we find are three locals with some last pieces of random dialogue before the slaughter begins.
This is the palace of the Lord of the Abyss, Lucifer.
No more words to get in the way, it's straight dungeon crawling up to Lucifer, now. Let me first introduce you to the new victims we will slaughter while during our short visit to Castle Kether, the Manticore...
... the Gaap...
... the Loki...
... the Rangda...
... and this thing, whatever it is.
The only one we do not know from Shin Megami Tensei is Gaap. Also known as Tap he is a High Prince of hell and also a President, being one of the few demons to ever hold two titles and positions. In this way, Gaap has both Mercury and Jupiter as his favorites planets and both Mercury and Tin as his favorites metals. Before the fall he was one from among the potentates, which is another name for, if i am not mixing them up, the powers. The arcane closer to his nature is the seven of swords, and he is more powerful during the the last decane of Aquarius, from february 9 to february 18, during the day.
Curiously, his main office is to spread ignorance and a lack of good sense, but at the same time he is able to give knowledge in philosophy and all the liberal sciences, and he may also sow both hatred and love and carry the witch great distances, to wherever she pleases. Also, he's able to free from their service the familiar spirits of witches and sorcerers as long as they are also under the dominance of Amaymon, the king whom he serves, and he can also, i believe, give unto the witch familiar spirits from among those. He knows the past and the future, and can teach the witch the sacraments and consecrations of Amaymon.
It is said that, in days past, dark wizards would offer sacrifices to him, and more. He also seems to have some kind of story with Beleth, and will be unable to stand in the presence of a witch who has known that demon, so bad is their relationship. He rules sixty six legions of infernal spirits, also from the order of Powers, i guess.
Along with those new ones come countless Volvo, Titania, Old One, Nyarlatothep, Agares, Girimekhala, Hecatonchires, and Tezcatlipoca. So now that we know the enemy...
... LET'S DANCIN'!
The first floor is kind of cross like, divided in four great segments. Those segments are linked by three corridors you get to by staircases at the end and begining of each segment, the only exeptions being the begining of the first segment, where the gate back to the overworld is located, and the end of the fourth segment, where the staircase to the next level is located. Once you know the general shape it's kind of easy to go straight to the next staircase, even if the segments are anything but straightforward.
The second level is a kind of circular maze around a kind of square tower. Along the base of this tower there are four staircases, each going to a diferent part of the interior. Two of those staircases, the first and the third, go to empty segments that are useless to invade. The second one goes to a somewhat twisting path that leads to Lucifer, but right now the fourth one is the one that we are interested in. Again, the path is no straightforward but if we advance straight to the base of the, like, tower and follow it around, leaving it only long enough to circle an obstacle and the like, we will find the four staircases with just the bare minimun of wasted steps.
Taking the fourth staricase we go through a really smallish dungeon until we come across...
Who dares enter the hall of the great Maou Beelzebub uninvited!? You! You're Koneko! What are you doing here!? Have you come to be killed by Lord Lucifer!?
... No, you aren't worthy of being dispatched by Lord Lucifer himself.
This guy's not hard, but he's bothersome. He reflects bullets, uses that Tentarafu spell that confuses your demons, and has bite, rampage, and his basic attack thing. And a ton of HP, but he has a really hard time killing anyone, and is far easier than his Devil Survivor incarnation, or than his Imagine one. The Imagine one, in particular, is so totally brutal is worth a million Experience Points. :3
To think I would be the one to end up being killed...
That done we return below and go to the second staircase up the tower, counting from the entrance comunicating the second main level with the first one. The first part is basically just like the one for Beelzebub, ascending a small dungeon. Then, though, we reach a square level with floors that force you to slide in a certain direction, and several doors along the wall. Most of those doors lead to a pit that will drop you back to the tower's base, but inside the wall, in a secret niche with a one way door going back to the maze. You should check your back before leaving through the door, because one of those niches has a corridor going to the innermost area of the tower, and now we ascend many many levels until we reach the top, were someone's waiting for us.
I am a close associate of Master Lucifer. My name is Lucifuge. I am in charge of organizing many of Master Lucifer's affairs. The creation of makka is just one such a responsability of mine. I am please to make your acquaintance.
Oh! What power! I must inform Master Lucifer at once!!
That's Lucifuge Rofocale, one of the seven princes of hell and, like, the demon dedicated to most of the bureaucracy and the administrative tasks of ruling hell, leaving for Lucifer just the matters of great importance or significance. As such, though, he's not a demon of much importance for witches and sorcerers, since he is Hell's Administrator to Lucifer and administrative tasks aren't what most demonologists are interested in. Given his importance in the hierarchy, though, many religious groups, like infernalist cults and pseudo religious orders with demonological elements, pay him a lot of attention and respect. That's not my kind of thingie, though. If some day I want to turn religious I'll pick the side with hot bishies with fluffy wings. :3
In any case, we follow Lucifuge deeper into the tower. When we reach Lucifer's chamber, though, he has already been notified of our arrival, and he isn't pleased about our presence.
Down from your lofty place in Heaven to judge and destroy Maou Lucifer, eh? But is it all right for one so "holy" and "pure" as yourself to be aiding those "sinful humans" over there?
You know, Luci Lu? I think you are cool and everything, but every now and then you kind remind me of Nines Rodrigez. And, like, Nines Rodrigez is cool aand stuff and he kills werewolves in mortal kombat and doesn't affraid of anything, but you should be coming through as classy instead, and the little kitty hates people who breathes politics and through whose veins pumps social strife. That's so boring.
Satan
A fallen angel such as yourself has no right to talk to me like that! What do you think you are doing -- do you dare defy God's will?
Lucifer
If God's will is to obliterate everything on the face of he earth, and repopulate it with humans that are no more than brainwashed, mindless sheep, then yes! I have no intention of obeying!
Why not? Think of the bunnies. :3 And the flowers, and the little colorful birdies. And think you'll no longer need to have a giant stuffiethingie nor Lord Crowley as your degenerate subordinates, or that to watch your armies marchin will no longer be motive to fork your eyes out of their sockets, or that half of your court will no longer go work for the other guy just because someone offered to turn them back into kawaii pretty angels or gave them a more comfortable toilet on which to sit. That has to put a stop to even the carefuly laid plan.
Satan, Koneko, I know that no matter what i say there is nothing I can do to change your minds. The time for talk is over!
Let me prove to you that the only reason that you've survived this far is because I've permitted it!
Ewww. And to think I actually though you were cool and nice and sexy! Shoot the evil ugly thingie, for great justice and friendship and love and the coming of a kingdom of round green hills and hopping bunnies and fluttering butterflies and cuddles and happy feelings! Let's pew pew!
He has Diarama, Tentarafu, MahaBufula, a really high evasion, and reflects some kind of physical attacks, like Behemoth's and Ganesha's crush. He never got a chance, though. I did not even need to use Divine Retribution on him, though I should have fused my Nyarlatothep into a Pazuzu for greater power gaming ness since even with this party only the very final boss will be any challenge at all, and by that I meant, like, he actually killed someone and stuff.
... With my death, there will be nothing to stop your plans... You must be happy, Satan. As for you, Koneko... You will soon see just how mistaken you are. Witness the results of your actions, and never forget that what happens will be YOUR fault...
He dies, overwhelmed by our kawaiisa and the power of our friendship. :3 Then a great quake is felt, diferent from all those small quakes we have been feeling since the start of the game.
That damned Lucifer! He must have planned this as a contingency to destroy the Center in case he got killed!
Oh! Koneko! Look at this! The Kuzuryu has appeared in the Underworld!
The thingie keeps going up and up and up until it hits the Underworld's roof with great strenght and some massive damage. And remember the Underworld's roof is no other than Millennium's basements and undeground instalations. Lucifer's contingency plan was to send the uber stone dragon against a lot of civilians and destroy Eden just out of spite? Now that's a jerk for you.
As the Ark flies away we can see the Kuzuryu break through Millennium's floor and start breaking down things and roar and do the kind of stuff giant monsters do when left alone in a very populous city, but all the screenshots came totally ewww. So imagine big stone serpent breaking things in graphics so small and bad in none of the captures you could distinguish the serpent.
The Ark has escaped the grasp of your mother planet. Those that ride it are the chosen few who will live in the new world.
And it got a doomsday device to boot! I'm like Cat Vader now! x3
... the "Erase" function. This "Erase" is in the form of a huge energy weapon, the Megiddo Ark. Bathed in the holy light of the Megiddo Ark, all living things on the Earth will wither and die, like a weed exposed to a burning flame.
Wouldn't it be, like, totally cool if sunday's sermons were actually like this stuff? Like, and after routing the Infernal Legions and kicking Lucifer's butt in one last epic battle the Messiah, the Holy Mother, Satan, and the Heavenly Host's super black ops squad will teleport back to their Sacramental Battleship, the Megiddo Ark, and blow both Sin and Sinners to smithereens with holy flame and great pew pew! Totally amen, nya.
Humanity has commited uncountable grave sins against God, and because of that the Earth has fallen into ruin. Even if those remaining tried to rebuild and live on, with the knowledge Lucifer gave them, they would only repeat their sins...
That's why we chose a handful of superior humans that understand the truth and are willing to foresake their knowledge for God, so that a true utopia can be built. The Megiddo Ark will erase all others from the face of the earth, as if they had never been. This is the judgement that I shall exact, as was ordered to me by the Lord God himself. All those not among the chosen must be judged for their sins, and retribution enacted!
And the world ends with fireworks for kitty to say woa, so super pretty! and stuffies. After a while of small explosions dotting the surface and a small build up of power, the true might of the Megiddo Ark is unleashed in a bright flash of light. Afterwards, everything is silent. Only darkness is seen beyond.
:highfive:
Voice
Well done, Satan! Take Koneko with thee, and come unto my countenance!
We are carried away to a strange void, darkness in all directions but forward. We advance through a bluish platform that dissappears behind us. The voice repeats the congratulations and the command, and then, a bit later, it adds...
We then reach a platform floating in this darkness, in each corner of it a pillar. And, after a moment of great expectation and baited breath, the owner of that voice becomes manifest before us. And there's only one thing in the Cosmos that would talk like that and not feel mortal shame, so there's no doubting what we see! The truth is out there, for us to reach!
Ok, maybe there are two things in the universe that would do so without feeling mortal shame. I was refering to the other one, thank you.
Praise my name! O Koneko, O Mariah, both of thee hast done magnificently! I welcome thee into my countenance! Thou art truly worthy saviors! And Satan, thou hath done well in exacting my divine judgement unto the world! The light of Megiddo has cleansed the Earth of all its life, and paved the way for the glory of a world filled with my thralls!
Satan
... O Lord, my judgement is not yet complete. There is one more not amongst the chosen that must be judged... One that has committed the grave sin of genocide... Yes, Lord, the one I must now judge... is the one, highest god, my creator... You, YHVH!
YHVH
Satan! My chosen judge and enactor of retribution, dost thou dare even think of going so far as to judge thy creator? Insolent worm! Feel the wrath of my divine lightning, and plummet into the bowels of hell, burning in its unending flames!
Demons! Evil humans, who hath sold thy souls to demons!
This is it, boys and girls and trannies. The true boss, God himself. And the real one, at that, no bad imitations like we did before. The only thing between us and a complete reset of creation is to kill the God that has, through his creation, known sin.
He has Deka-Ja, which turns off all your buffs and which he loves to cast, and Rika-Ja, which turns off all the debuffs you have casted. His evasion is totally high, and is almost impossible for a character to hit him without using combat techniques. Certain damage types, like Behemoth's and Ganesha's crush, are reflected too. His basic attack does some pretty good damage, and also has a let out his voice attack that insta-kills one of your demons. Finally, he has Megido and Megidoraon. And he has a ridiculous amount of HP, so much that the first couple of Divine Retributions are going to be taking around 4k away from him, and he will barely notice that until the Retributions and your combatants skills start to really pile up.
This battle is pretty much about making your plan as you go. Buffing can be useful or useless, depending on how much he likes to use Dekaja. You need several characters with revival spells and the protagonist with revival items, and have a lot of Orbs to use without restraint. 999 HP on Satan can look like a lot, but only untl you notice he spends 110 a turn with his Deathbound, and that he will be the one getting hit for the most damage by Divine Retribution, if you don't mind hurting yourself to devastate YHVH. Without that spell the battle would have been much longer. And offensive magic is all but useless against him: Satan megidothingie did, like, 70 damage when I tried it. Not worth the hassle.
YHVH's voice
To be judged and punished by mine own creations... Thou hath refused my extended hand of salvation. Without me to guide thee, dost thou truly think thou wilt be able to find thy path?
But remember this... Humanity is not strong enough to live without one to cling to or rely on. As long as people continue to seek my salvation, the will of the universe will reacreate me, again and again and again...
This is a pretty important and often overlooked fact of this game. Though most people ignore it, and I myself did not notice it until my Ex kind of pointed it for me, Shin Megami Tensei is built around the concept of cyclical ages, as common in the western mysteries as in the eastern ones but a lot more buried below all the politicking and stuffies here. We have not killed God itself, but the local manifestation of God, what Qabalah knowns as the Little Creator, who for them is also the God of the Old Testament, just a local aspect of the thing in Ain Soph born between creation and the Divine Will that flows from up there. Killing this God would be the only way to clean the slate completelly, the only thing that would accomplish would be a full reset.
And Nocturne is actually thought to be a sequel of this one game.
Just happening in the next cycle thing, and with Hijiri, the occult newspaper guy with a dark secret, being Teh Messiah's perpetual reincarnation, bearing a divine curse to for ever watch the worlds come and go without being able to do nothing to save them nor lighten their suffering.
Owie, owie, owie. Totally, owie. The other interesting thing to point out about the continuity is that while there are several alternate ones, more or less paralel universes, this does not seem to affect the demons themselves, who in many cases seems to conserve knowledge of experiences had in the other continuity thingies, and even keep the character development they have gone through, the most infamous example of this being the four main seraphs every now and then going emo about what happened in Millennium in continuities where Millennium never happened at all. The other, less noticed, example is that...
... God goes from being a total jerkass in the original two Shin Megami Tensei games to being a kind of compassive, sincerely caring, and very understanding guy, while still severe and Lawful, in Devil Survivor and beyond. This also follows one of the main occult concepts, that of the entire point of this being not the the thing in Ain Soph being bored and deciding to play The Sims to pass eternity on but the entire of creation being a reproduction, in the Primal Chaos, of it's thought patterns and intellectual interactions and psychological developments. To the point many hebrew scholars, western occultists, and others consider the Great Work not to be personal enlightment or perfection, but perfection of the thing in Ain Soph through the systematic polishing of every single piece to perfection, each cycle reflecting the sins and virtues of all previous ones as kind of a divine subconsious or something.
So the most embraced theory right now about the Megami Tensei universe is, like, kind of a Multiverse of many diferent continuities, like the Shin Megami Tensei one and the Persona one and the Raidou one, but that the main supernatural elements are common to all of them, not as in being similar or identical but as in them being the very same ones, always.
But this party is kind of dying down, so let's see where this goes now. After defeating God we find ourselves back at the Ark, and Gabriel is waiting for us here with some totally heartwrenching partying words.
I am a servant of God, but now that God is no more, I no longer have a purpose or place to go... but you two do.
We say goodbye and do as she says, going through Eden by means of the first door, just behind her. Satan is waiting for us, and more heart breaking ensues.
The residents of Eden are waiting for you. Go to them. My job is done here... There is no future for me.
Then Mariah, now The Holy Mother, decides to finally show some maturity and backbone and strenght of character. Geez, I guess she only needed to, like, slaughter the legions of hell and half the heavenly host and most of the ridiculously powerful beings in the universe, personal combat like, to grow some personality!
We need to go and build a new ideal world from what is left!
And then the Ark is seen returning to the world, now free of all sin and corruption. A true Garden of Eden where to build The Thousand Year Kingdom of prophecy, ruled by The Messiah and inhabited only by the just and the good and the virtuous.
The game then does the same backwards journey through the main plotline events as the first did. Then the credits roll, and as they do a strange golden female figure is seen flying around. Who it is? What does this means? I don't have the slightest idea, and neither do the only two other girls I have met that are as geek as i am in Megami Tensei thingies, so your guess is as good as mine.
I really like this ending, regardless of the fact we just genocided all but, like, a couple of each kawaii animal and a handful of faithful. I would even dare to say the bodycount is several orders of magnitude greater than in the Neutral path, were you must fight all bosses and armies but you never get to shoot the Megiddo Ark. I also like that the stories actually come to a close in a much smoother way than in the other two endings, and here the Savior actually brings salvation to the world instead of just beating up random doods and letting things kind of sort themselves out. Is actually cool to see a group of people rebel in a game with an actual plan and an actual objective instead of just out of a dislike for autorithy and random rethoric about freedom, and then go to build a funcional society with a clear agenda instead of, like, now let's improvise a perfect world, nya! Or instead of, like, let's leave humans to sort it out by themselves, since that's what got us into this mess to begin with.
I also like that this ending turn the Seraphs and the Center Bishop into well intentioned extremists instead of evil crazy jerks, and actually makes them right instead of going the politically correct way. They may have gone way too far, and they may have gone totally insane out of their love and dedication and clingyness to God, but they actually did it! They created the vessels and God gave it the souls and spirits they needed, and in Millennium they actualized the means for the wheat to be separated from the chaff, and stuffies. And, like, if you don't want to cry in Satan's and Gabriel's last scenes you are jerk and i'm not your friend, you evil heartless monster you.
Finally, i think the image of the Pyramid's tip flying away and becoming a new Pyramid in a new world, a new Malkuth, is totally awesome and brings the somewhat screwed up occult symbology in the game to a really cool conclussion that makes us forgive how much they screwed up at times. It is also a pretty cool representation of the Tetragramatton, with Millennium being the Yod and The Abyss being the He and the Underworld being the Vau while the Megiddo Ark is He Final, dividing and oppossing the world that spawned it, and thus becomes her own Yod, just like the He opoossed the Yod. In any case, you'll get to have a rest out of my weird ramblings and rants and stuffies and thingies for a while. xP
About the two other endings, now. In the Chaos One...
The Kuzuryu destroys Millennium, but in the nick of time the Megido Ark flies away and prepares to open fire. Then you, Lucifer, Mariah, and the rest of the party get Gomory'd to the Megido Ark, where they must fight through the heavenly host and the armies of demons that joined with God to escape punishment, and three aspects of God acting kind of as generals and guardians of each level. Then you fight Satan to stop him from going pew pew on Sin and Sinner, then you fight God. In the end since you destroyed both the Megido Ark and Millennium the demons, the gaians, and the mutants, who were allies of Lucifer and the Gaians all along, can build a happy world of might makes right and stuffies.
... and in the Neutral one...
You defeat Lucifer just as we did. And, just as it happened, the Kuzuryu awakens and decides to have some Millennium for breakfast. With Steven's help you return to The Underground, and must fight the Kuzuryu to stop it, though the battle itself is kind of easier than Lucifer. Then Steven teleports you to the Megido Ark, where you must do the same stuff you do in the Chaos Ending. In the end they return to Earth and everyone goes back to do their own thing, and stuff.
I liked Shin Megami Tensei neutral ending because, like, in that one Neutrality was actually a clear philosophy with elements of Taoism and stuff instead of just the totally improvised and directionless thing it is in this one. Like, picking Neutrality was an active choice for an active, well defined thingie. You have Lao Tse to guide you in the neutral path and stuff, so when you are making your choice you are actually allying yourself with a philosophical and mystical viewpoint and perspective and making a last stand for it. In this one, when you get the choice it is, like, do you want to join me? No. And me? No. Ah, ok, sorry to have bothered you. Then you just start killing everyone at random, without any plot or direction, until you kind of reach Kether and shit happens. And Lucifer even goes like but what are you fighting for? and the characters, like, *blank stare* It's cool if you are into, like, Kratoss and stuff, but it isn't precisely, like, serious storytelling or a mature message. That's the best ending from a gameplay perspective and the one I kind of wanted to show you because you get to do a crazy boss rush and stuff, but i think it didn't work as bad after all.
In the end you are picking between, like, people fighting for ascension and utopia, which is kind of respectable even if you are not in the target for their kind of utopia or enlighment, people fighting for power and pleasure and so called freedom from civilized boundaries, which is kind of stupid and dirty, and people fighting to not have to choose but keep the right to go on being mediocre.
Now the little pretty kitty will go play Blades of the Rose Cross to try and clear the bloody tutorial once and for all and she will also take a vacation, and then we'll see what she wants to Let's Play next. It will probably be Devil Survivor if i manage to make Desmume to run in my notebook at a barely playable speed, or maybe If or some Persona i have still to finish so you can all laught at me stumbling through games I don't totally know by rote, or maybe Koudelka and the Shadow Hearts games for the same reason. Or maybe Baroque, or something. I have that reputation of the girl who plays games full of occult references so she can rant on and on and on to live up to, now. Or maybe i'll do something cute like Rhapsody or My World My Way or Princess Debut, or totally girly like Yo Jin Bo, to troll the Codex a bit.
That's it, then. And so Shin Megami Tensei II did came to an end. I hope you enjoyed the trip and liked the totally and i hope i'm not reading too much into this, but... kind of interpretation and stuffies. Comments, opinions, advice, *hugs*, *petpet*, *earpull*, and other forms of attention are welcome. Also, if you want to argument for one of those possible future games, against it, or for another one not listed here, please do.
A quick question, Kuroneko-sensei: what's a good place to start for people new to SMT? Should I go all the way back to 1 and 2? Try (presumably) more user-friendly Nocturne/Persona/Devil Survivor? Are other spin-offs, Devil Summoner and Digital Devil Saga, worth bothering with?
Devil Survivor is a kind of role playing strategy game whose story is kind of a remake of the first Shin Megami Tensei game, keeping with that stuff about the cycles, but done in a much more modern way, mixing the old school harcore gameplay with a narrative style more like the Persona games, and with a lot of truly awesome choice and consequence, to a point that in my opinion leaves certain much mentioned holy games of the Codex ashamed and going all *sobity sob sob*
Strange Journey is a straight dungeon crawler like the old Shin Megami Tensei games we just played through, but with modern technology, or at least as modern as a DS can be seen to be. It has most of the old gameplay elements, just refined, and a plot that's both amazing and perfect for a Dungeon Crawler, though it gets totally preachy.
And i personally like the Raidou Kuzunoha's games a lot, they have a very fun and kind of light hearted style, where the Megami Tensei universe is kind of a depressive shithole usually. Those, though, are more of Action Role Playing Games.
The old Shin Megami Tensei games, being those two and If, are kind of hard to get into today. The next batch, with the soon to be translated Soul Hackers and the first couple persona games, strike a pretty cool balance between old school hardcore ness and modern storytelling. I personally can't come to grips with the non persona 3d games, Nocturne and the Digital Devil Story games, but that's a matter of personal taste, i don't like the perspective nor the engine, though they are good games, and Nocturne's take on the franchise's philosoraptoring is more, like, mature than in the old games.
Persona 3 and Persona 4 are kind of cool, i do like, but they have too much Dating Sim and Visual Novel and kind of Roleplaying elements, and at the same time they force a character upon you. That kind of, like, breaks the point. I mean, if you are a guy and can relate to the main characters, sure, they can be a lot of fun, but if you are a girl or despise the main character the games just died for you, since you are suposed to not only dungeon crawl and stuff but get into the character, live his daily life, make friends, date people, etc. That's why i want to play the new Persona 3 Portable thingie, where you get to pick your bloody gender.
@ MirrorKun
No sacrifice at all :3 I'm happy you liked it, though.
Well done, for your dedication to endless heresy and chaotic stuff when the Emperor decides to re-appear your death will be swift and painless
Now seriously well done. If you have to decide I reccomend Kouldeka, and then Shadow Hearts, these are like Earthbound meets ocultistm stuff, even more and more inane with each new game.
And lastly, I recommend Digital Devil Saga games for a begginner, then Nocturne. DDS has all of the "usual stuff", like
God being a dick (more or less), bayexploding apocalypse (and in the series not one but THREE apocalypses/world destroying events), somewhat interesting characters, an androginous main character (who turns even more androginous later somehow), mindfuck, and ball-crushing bosses (even more with the optional ones, the ultimate boss of DDS1 will make you scare shitlless). The only downside is that it's still a jrpg, and has an HORRIBLE MARY-SUEISH CHARACTER THAT YOU WILL WANT HER TO DIE AGAIN AND AGAIN AND AGAIN. Oh, and it has a true butthurt codexian style tranny, for real, specified ingame.
Lastly, that God of sorts not only was an extreme troll, but apparently retard. First rule of the evil guy who creates killing machines TM:
Never, ever, allow your creations to turn against you, and all laws will forcibly ignore you if it was to cause harm.
PS: I seriously dislike Persona 3/4 games, I don't like the characters and even more the sim part, I just want to dungeon-crawl and kill stuff, not hear enless whinning.
PPS: I suppose you could call the neutral ending the "orky" one, where you fight the good fight because you can.
PPPS: Where's my Cthulhu? Perhaps I missed it on the last screens, but I do not recall seeing him.
Decided to give the original SMT a whirl, and it's actually a very fun game. My only complaint is that it looks like crap compared to MM III-V that came out at about the same time.
Hey, right now i would qualify as Radical Inquisitor! Show some respect! xD
What I have played of the Koudelka and Shadow Hearts games kind of confirms your description. Even my pretty precious Goetic Demons appear on those! Though I have played mostly, like, halfway through Koudelka, and then a bit of the first two Shadow Hearts games on my Ex's playstation 2 thingie, so if i choose that one it will be watch Neko Nya Nya get slaughtered over and over and over for your perverse enjoyment! Ah, yes, and so you don't think i got sick or abducted by aliens:
...Koudelka's clothes...
...fan servicing chauvinistic pigs...
...males, males never change...
. There, out of the way that went.
Cthulhu only appears in the Chaos and Neutral paths, along with ludicrous amounts of Old Ones. I never managed to understand if in those paths Cthulhu allies himself to the Heavenly Host to escape anihilation, something I do not believe either YHVH would accept nor Cthulhu try to pull, or if they were trying to go commando on the Megiddo Ark just like your strike party is.
You surely will be familiar with that Satan form, i think, and that's the shape it takes if you have to fight against him. If you want to see any particular demon, like all the Seraphs we missed because they are fussion only, or the high level angels we did never meet because they appear just to protect the Megiddo Ark if you have to invade it, just ask.
And Satan's female ish ness and fish ness I think comes from the fact that Geburah, which is the Sephira most closely related to Satan, is aligned with the Pillar of Form, which is both extremely Female ish and Water ish. Though that's just my opinion on it and i may be reading a lot into it. It's really Slaneeshi, too.
Oh, and by Mary Suish character do you mean Sera and Varnani? C'mon, find your heart! She's kind of cute and sweet, and has the power of magical song, and super PSI powers, and the entire universe revolves around her, and her magical girl demonic form is neon pink! Do not be a hatter! x3
@ MiniKalos
Shin Megami Tensei, the first one for the SNES? Yes, that game is hard on the eyes, and it would be murder if it weren't for the really pretty and surreal art. Shin Megami Tensei II has much better art already, and from IF and Persona onwards they are at least as playable as any old adventure game is today.
Oh, and by Mary Suish character do you mean Sera and Varnani? C'mon, find your heart! She's kind of cute and sweet, and has the power of magical song, and super PSI powers, and the entire universe revolves around her, and her magical girl demonic form is neon pink! Do not be a hatter! x3
Oh well, Cthulhu is somehow japanized and made even more inane than I expected. And no, Sera is not mary sue at all, she's just a loli, has an unhealthy attraction to the main character, has an annoying voice, 3 of every 4 of her lines is screaming the main character's name, the party nearly FIGHT for her at more than one point,
she destroyed the world and once and whe she goes Shinji Ikari nearly destroys it AGAIN, and it's her fault that the deadly trip to the EGG instalation and the Energy Plant was for nothing (if she had warned of the futility of the quest half of the party wouldn't had to die goddamit)
she gains super demonic powers for no real reason, etc, etc. Totally likeable at all... /sarcasm
PS: Oh, and I almost forgot, for some reason despite being the responsible of mass destruction and inanity Sera wants to help everyone and lame stuff.
PPS: I have not played Kouldeka, so I don't knwo much about it, I heard that you can rename almost any item on the game for some laughs, it is true?
Lucifer is complaining that people will be made into emotionless sheep?
Shin Megami Tensei somehow has Jewish Satan, Catholic archangels, Jehovah's Witness heaven (the badly researched Hollywood version anyways) and the opposite of LDS Lucifer. Weird. At least when other conflicting creatures they aren't working with eachother (or in the case of Asura/Mahakala, who are the same guy, they note it).
Kether castle almost made me cry when I played. Such a horrible, horrible maze. And I found the Cathedral of SMT to be a fairly interesting romp.
Nocturne or Strange Journey are probably the best beginner games. Nocturne if you want to be strictly old-school balls-to-the-wall, Strange Journey if you want to be handled gently. The original SMT is also a pretty good start, but you have probably already read the LP anyway. Devil Survivor is great, but its really different from the rest of the series in terms of organization and gameplay, so it may be better saved for the second game you play.
I really didn't like DDS. The blind/deaf/dumb main character felt like he (and therefore you) had no idea what was going on, so whenever something happened you always relied on your plot-NPC friends to tell you what to do next. The leveling system was kinda annoying as well, instead of fusion you have a ton of grinding because you didn't level x skill for a boss that nearly requires it. Also, the plot and setting is mostly influenced by hinduism, which is for most people probably far less recognizable then the influences of other SMT games, so I felt like I was missing a lot of it.
Vs King Abaddon (A quick look at the manual tells you everything important about the first game, which I hear is not nearly as good) is a pretty good option as well. A little on the easy side, but includes alignment, fusion and an interesting story.
Persona 4 (stay away from 3, the plot dies half way and gets replaced by lots of angst) isn't bad, but it's not quite a good example of the series
Overweight Manatee said:
I really didn't like DDS. The blind/deaf/dumb main character felt like he (and therefore you) had no idea what was going on, so whenever something happened you always relied on your plot-NPC friends to tell you what to do next..
Strange, I did not grind much in DDS except when fighting the optional bosses (to get much more experience it's better if you eat alive the enemy, literally). My major complaint was the low running of Serph and the lots of lots of lots of combat (somewhat lowered on DDS2).
Hmm, well I certainly felt like I grinded significantly more in DDS then Nocturne or any other SMT games. I was eating nearly every enemy I could, and I still had to run around for 10-15 battles sometimes just to get some skill for a boss. DDS2 was far worse, the final bosses manhandled me and at the rate I was gaining experience it would have taken a ridiculous number of battles to do anything so I gave up. In Nocturne I just fused a new demon and generally had no problems grinding anything.
deuxhero said:
Overweight Manatee said:
I really didn't like DDS. The blind/deaf/dumb main character felt like he (and therefore you) had no idea what was going on, so whenever something happened you always relied on your plot-NPC friends to tell you what to do next..
Not so much the lack of background, but the lack of personality. You are supposed to be the leader, but in reality you do nothing except what everyone else tells you to do. It feels way too JRPG-ish as the different areas seem to be connected by no more then what your party members felt like you should do. Granted this happens in all RPG's to some extent, but the other SMT games did it a lot more fluidly and at least gave the player a sense of control.
Holy crap, I just stunlocked motherfucking Thor with tranquilizer rounds. This game is amazing! If the quality is mostly consistent throughout the franchise, I may have found my new favorite RPG series.
Overweight Manatee said:
The original SMT is also a pretty good start, but you have probably already read the LP anyway.
I really didn't like DDS. The blind/deaf/dumb main character felt like he (and therefore you) had no idea what was going on, so whenever something happened you always relied on your plot-NPC friends to tell you what to do next..
Not so much the lack of background, but the lack of personality. You are supposed to be the leader, but in reality you do nothing except what everyone else tells you to do. It feels way too JRPG-ish as the different areas seem to be connected by no more then what your party members felt like you should do. Granted this happens in all RPG's to some extent, but the other SMT games did it a lot more fluidly and at least gave the player a sense of control.
My problem isn't exactly that you have no idea whats going on, its that the rest of the group DOES seem to know. It makes you feel like a complete incompetent in comparison to the group. Too much of the story is done through your own party's exposition, which makes you feel stupid for not already knowing what was going on because storywise you should have known it. It's the smart guy (Cielo? I think) who annoys me to most. It seems that half of the game's plot revolves around him being 10x smarter then everyone else and explaining to you everything.
"Oh, and I almost forgot, for some reason despite being the responsible of mass destruction and inanity Sera wants to help everyone and lame stuff."
That's just normal Japanese Moe. Don't pay attention to it. Like, say, meet Liebea Palesh.
She loves all living things, is so sweet it gives you caries and a complete pacifist, has pink hair, is less assertive than an egg, and gets stressed really easily and then turns the weather into killer rain. And then starts sobbing, because it was an accident and she didn't meant to kill you and everyone in four square kilometers!
It's a very common archetype and stuff. I personally don't mind it, it can be used to break the cutie in several ways, using TvTropes lexicon.
"I have not played Kouldeka, so I don't knwo much about it, I heard that you can rename almost any item on the game for some laughs, it is true?"
I haven't the slightest idea, it never even happened through my mind to even try.
@ Deuxhero
"Shin Megami Tensei somehow has Jewish Satan, Catholic archangels, Jehovah's Witness heaven (the badly researched Hollywood version anyways) and the opposite of LDS Lucifer."
It's the greatest crossover evel told.
@ Cenobyte
"Why the hell does Cthulhu have a dick?!?!?"
Because he has tentacles and this is a japanese game, duh.
"Otherwise, well done and good LP, Black Cat."
Thankieeees :3
@ Overweight Manatee
I think the first three personas are the kings and queens of dungeons conected by what your characters want at any given time.
@ MiniKalos
"This game is amazing! If the quality is mostly consistent throughout the franchise, I may have found my new favorite RPG series."
The quality is consistent in that, at least in what has reached the western and civilized world, Shin Megami Tensei's dungeon crawlers are truly awesome dungeon crawlers and Shin Megami Tensei's JRPGs are truly awesome and amazing JRPGs. It is a very cool franchise all around, it just depends on how much each kind of genre and gimmick they have tried their hand at does for you. :3
Btw, nowadays people is being converted into brainless sheep that buy everything they see no matter how shitty it is, so in a way this Lucifer was doomed to fail :twisted:.
And compared to the kind of chauvinist jokes the Codex has threw my way it is, like, kindergarten stuff, really.
We say goodbye and do as she says, going through Eden by means of the first door, just behind her. Satan is waiting for us, and more heart breaking ensues.
and she will also take a vacation, and then we'll see what she wants to Let's Play next. It will probably be Devil Survivor if i manage to make Desmume to run in my notebook at a barely playable speed, or maybe If or some Persona i have still to finish so you can all laught at me stumbling through games I don't totally know by rote, or maybe Koudelka and the Shadow Hearts games for the same reason. Or maybe Baroque, or something. I have that reputation of the girl who plays games full of occult references so she can rant on and on and on to live up to, now. Or maybe i'll do something cute like Rhapsody or My World My Way or Princess Debut, or totally girly like Yo Jin Bo, to troll the Codex a bit.
