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Incline ToEE is fucking fantastic

Volourn

Pretty Princess
Pretty Princess Glory to Ukraine
Joined
Mar 10, 2003
Messages
24,924
It's not shit but it's not good.

It has great rules implemenation but the actual combat isn't that good for a multitude of reasons.

The writing, the story, the 'exploration' is all shit.
 

GloomFrost

Arcane
Joined
Dec 9, 2014
Messages
993
Location
Northern wastes
Yep, absolutely correct. Still one of the best looking 2d games up to date, God like ambient, well thought out combat encounters, no tedious grinding, not too short, not too long. The legendary Troika managed to turn a combat heavy module into a cRPG masterpiece. Now that is CLASS, SKILL and TALENT!! Why have you abandoned us TROIKA?? Come back please and make Arcanum 2 on TOEE engine!!
 

King Crispy

Too bad I have no queen.
Patron
Staff Member
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Messages
1,876,560
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Future Wasteland
Strap Yourselves In
Dear Codex Relatively New Person,

You are currently dealing with Volourn. Volourn is a rather special member of our community. Please do not expect him to ever do any of the following:

- Explain himself

- Make sense

- Be logical

- Be rational

- Be friendly

- Care what you think or say

If you bear in mind that none of these things are ever going to happen, then dealing with him will be a much less painful experience.

We hope this little bit of advice helps you and enhances your stay at and enjoyment of RPG Codex.

Thank you.
 

Trashos

Arcane
Joined
Dec 28, 2015
Messages
3,413
Has the savegame bug been fixed? It has been several years since I last tried.
 

cretin

Magister
Douchebag!
Joined
Apr 20, 2019
Messages
1,347
I just got done with the Lareth fight and totally did not expect the game to throw 2 more significant encounters at me while I was looking to scurry away and lick my wounds. Harrowing but all the more rewarding when I finally came out the other side with a ton of fat loot.

This is co8 fan content, not Troika's work (or Gygax's for that matter).

Well those co8 cunts lied to me then, because i installed the patch that claimed to not have any new content.
 

Roguey

Codex Staff
Staff Member
Sawyerite
Joined
May 29, 2010
Messages
35,653
Well those co8 cunts lied to me then, because i installed the patch that claimed to not have any new content.

Their definition of "new content" is the same as wesp's in that they think minor alterations to what's already there doesn't count as new content.

Standard versions contain mainly bugfixes, rules compliance modifications, AI tweaks, and content restoration, in addition to a few actual mods like the Rannos and Gremag revenge scenario and the Moathouse Ambush. These are 'mini-mods' compared to the major expansions, and we include them in the standard modpack because we don't feel they significantly impact the balance of the game, and because our longterm feedback indicates that over time, they have become considered part and parcel with the basic game. Many players don't even know that they are mods. The standard modpacks also contain all our custom portraits, voice sets, items, worldmap, et al.

Modders gonna mod.
 
Joined
May 28, 2021
Messages
179
Location
Nairaland
I have never played it but I guess I'm going to because people post about it here nonstop. Really never got into D&D lore enough to play the video games, it's fine for tabletop but meh, if the systems aren't A+ then I don't care.
 

Sykar

Arcane
Joined
Dec 2, 2014
Messages
11,297
Location
Turn right after Alpha Centauri
Well those co8 cunts lied to me then, because i installed the patch that claimed to not have any new content.

Their definition of "new content" is the same as wesp's in that they think minor alterations to what's already there doesn't count as new content.

Standard versions contain mainly bugfixes, rules compliance modifications, AI tweaks, and content restoration, in addition to a few actual mods like the Rannos and Gremag revenge scenario and the Moathouse Ambush. These are 'mini-mods' compared to the major expansions, and we include them in the standard modpack because we don't feel they significantly impact the balance of the game, and because our longterm feedback indicates that over time, they have become considered part and parcel with the basic game. Many players don't even know that they are mods. The standard modpacks also contain all our custom portraits, voice sets, items, worldmap, et al.

Modders gonna mod.

This is why you should use the True Patch.
:popcorn:
 
Joined
Jul 8, 2006
Messages
2,930
What a fantastic rpg. Why does this not get shilled here more often?

After I got through the video game equivalent of ambien that is hommlet, this game opened up into one of the best rpgs I've ever played. Excellent combat, deep character building, gorgeous artwork and animations, great atmosphere, and an interesting soundtrack.

I just got done with the Lareth fight and totally did not expect the game to throw 2 more significant encounters at me while I was looking to scurry away and lick my wounds. Harrowing but all the more rewarding when I finally came out the other side with a ton of fat loot.

And the best thing about this game is I don't have to listen to morons and neurotics babble every 2 seconds, or hear some fag's life story about how he got exiled from his village by bigots, for smoking cock.
awesome game, wish they had kept making games in that engine :negative:
 

anvi

Prophet
Village Idiot
Joined
Oct 12, 2016
Messages
7,530
Location
Kelethin
What a fantastic rpg. Why does this not get shilled here more often?

After I got through the video game equivalent of ambien that is hommlet, this game opened up into one of the best rpgs I've ever played. Excellent combat, deep character building, gorgeous artwork and animations, great atmosphere, and an interesting soundtrack.

I just got done with the Lareth fight and totally did not expect the game to throw 2 more significant encounters at me while I was looking to scurry away and lick my wounds. Harrowing but all the more rewarding when I finally came out the other side with a ton of fat loot.

And the best thing about this game is I don't have to listen to morons and neurotics babble every 2 seconds, or hear some fag's life story about how he got exiled from his village by bigots, for smoking cock.
I think I made a thread that even got an authoritative stamp of approval. It's fun as hell for anyone who likes tactical combat. It also still looks really nice. I didn't get along with CO8 but temple+ was essential.
 
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Lagole Gon

Arcane
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Joined
Nov 4, 2011
Messages
7,279
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Retaken Potato
Insert Title Here RPG Wokedex Codex Year of the Donut Pathfinder: Wrath
I just got done with the Lareth fight and totally did not expect the game to throw 2 more significant encounters at me while I was looking to scurry away and lick my wounds. Harrowing but all the more rewarding when I finally came out the other side with a ton of fat loot.

This is co8 fan content, not Troika's work (or Gygax's for that matter).

Well those co8 cunts lied to me then, because i installed the patch that claimed to not have any new content.
I think some of it supposed to be "restored content".
And I'm pretty sure "restored content" in practice means "let's take any unused voice lines and do something with them. Anything."

There are unused voice lines about selling Melany to the gypsy woman in Nulb (???). Modders took them and turned into a...
...anime harem comedy.
Untitled-1.png

Untitled-2.png


Of course, NPC content is still barely there. Shame, it seems they intended a bit more.
 
Last edited:
Self-Ejected

Thac0

Time Mage
Patron
Joined
Apr 30, 2020
Messages
3,292
Location
Arborea
I'm very into cock and ball torture
Dear Codex Relatively New Person,

You are currently dealing with Volourn. Volourn is a rather special member of our community. Please do not expect him to ever do any of the following:

- Explain himself

- Make sense

- Be logical

- Be rational

- Be friendly

- Care what you think or say

If you bear in mind that none of these things are ever going to happen, then dealing with him will be a much less painful experience.

We hope this little bit of advice helps you and enhances your stay at and enjoyment of RPG Codex.

Thank you.

So Volourn is this irl?
u1Tzch0.jpg
 

luj1

You're all shills
Vatnik
Joined
Jan 2, 2016
Messages
12,870
Location
Eastern block
And the best thing about this game is I don't have to listen to morons and neurotics babble every 2 seconds, or hear some fag's life story about how he got exiled from his village

Because that is what RPG have traditionally been about, combat simulations not story.
 

jackofshadows

Magister
Joined
Oct 21, 2019
Messages
4,488
It's more exciting than your mom.
See? Like the game, like its defenders. The dullest.

Anyway, ToEE is not a shit game, it's a good game actually, if you're a D&D enthusiast. Especially since it looks fantastic and has nice soundtrack (and an extremely annoying radial menu but that's passable). But if you're not, then the chances are you will die from boredom way before the finish line. The game lacks mystery, sense of exploration, any real hook outside of being a decent D&D adaptation, like I've said already. At the very least it doesn't have dices the half of screen size every time the game suppose to throw "dice".
 
Last edited:

Darth Canoli

Arcane
Joined
Jun 8, 2018
Messages
5,687
Location
Perched on a tree
And the best thing about this game is I don't have to listen to morons and neurotics babble every 2 seconds, or hear some fag's life story about how he got exiled from his village by bigots, for smoking cock.
Because that is what RPG have traditionally been about, combat simulations not story.

There's still villagers drama in Hommlet but fortunately, you can skip it.

Also, as much as i like ToEE's engine, there is a couple of flaws, mostly the excessively long projectile animation, because Temple+ fixes most bugs and also adds some race & classes variety, vanilla ToEE is barely re-playable due to the very standard and limited character creation options.
 

Volourn

Pretty Princess
Pretty Princess Glory to Ukraine
Joined
Mar 10, 2003
Messages
24,924
"if you're a D&D enthusiast."

L0L But, no. L0L

A true D&D enthusiast like me, don't want games to just do basic rules. They actually want them to be actually good. Anyone can use D&D rules to run a campaign. But, how many use them to make a good one? Shitty D&D campaigns make use of D&D in pnp, and are still shitty. That is what TOEE is, thoguh it isn't the worst. It is playable but it has way too many flaws to be considered actually good.

WATCH OUT, BUGBEAR COMING THROUGH!
 

Pink Eye

Monk
Patron
Joined
Oct 10, 2019
Messages
5,793
Location
Space Refrigerator
I'm very into cock and ball torture
Meh. Going from Knights of the Chalice to this, is a pretty flaccid experience. The game has the cardinal sins of allowing you to effectively cheese an encounter before hand. Prebuffing in a tactical turn based game. Stoopid enemy artificial intelligence. Radial menu - seriously, who conceived of this abomination. Awful early game. You have to rush to the Temple as quickly as possible! The Temple is where all the good content is at. Everything before is really bad. Half assed hot key system; you can't rebind keys that are already in use, so you have to interact with that silly radial menu. Lame encounter design. For example, within the Temple of Elemental Evil, I came across many rooms where there was over twenty basic fighter guys. I formed a choke point at the door way. Then spent several minutes whacking them to death while they all rushed my front line, repeatedly. The most egregious ones were those that only had two or three; that's not an encounter, guys. That's a waste of my time. The other thing is the animations, while they're beautiful to look at, they take forever! I don't need to see my monk do needlessly long winded punching animations. A simple punch to the face would have been sufficient.

Dark Sun had it figured out:

Dark Sun had a lot of things figured out.

Lastly, the most frustrating thing. The demoness fight. I expected so much from this encounter, instead of whatever the heck this was:

Anticipation of fighting Balors, Devil Lords, or something grand were quickly met with disappointment. When fungus demoness did nothing smart or tactical except summon a bunch of fungus. Then whack at me while whiffing every single attack. No spells. Nothing. Just auto attacks. Flaccid indeed.

Level design is good though. Had much fun exploring the Temple. It's no Ravenloft: Stone Prophet in terms of level design, but it comes close.
 

RatTower

Arcane
Developer
Joined
Apr 24, 2017
Messages
468
Tried ToEE (+Co8) a while ago. I only really played the moathouse so far.
The combat is challenging, the graphics are great. It has a very classic charm to it, even if you aren't familiar with the original D&D modules.
My only issue with it is the movement/positioning. I repeatedly had problems trying to get my characters into the right place (for example to block a hallway or defend my spellcasters).
The pathfinding adds insult to injury here. I think it would have helped if the combat was entirely grid-based and that grid was a little more generous (larger cells).
Necessarily there is an invisible grid going on in the background - you can vaguely guess it by pressing Alt but that doesn't really cut it.

I generally thought the movement bar was an odd design decision. I imagine they tried to implement something inspired by the original wargaming aspect of D&D here. The original AD&D rules, for which Village of Hommlet and ToEE were written, contain movement rules where everything was (literally) explained down to the inch. Back in the day that made sense, cause most tabletop wargames (which basically spawned D&D) had ruler-based movement. Warhammer for example still has it. But the thing is: To my knowledge, nobody ever played D&D like that. Everyone always simplified the movement rates for grid-based movement (even some of the original module maps do that by stating that "one square equals x feet"). Of course, you can try playing D&D with a ruler, but generally, it just isn't worth the hassle. Even if it is automated (as it is in ToEE) it just makes the whole thing way more fiddly than it needs to be.

I think Troika tried to be too "real" for their own good here.

Eventually, I played (and finished) Knights of the Chalice instead, which scratches roughly the same itch. I might come back to ToEE some time in the future though.
 

Darth Canoli

Arcane
Joined
Jun 8, 2018
Messages
5,687
Location
Perched on a tree
My only issue with it is the movement/positioning. I repeatedly had problems trying to get my characters into the right place (for example to block a hallway or defend my spellcasters).
The pathfinding adds insult to injury here. I think it would have helped if the combat was entirely grid-based and that grid was a little more generous (larger cells).

You get used to it eventually, it's not too bad and being able to set waypoints to avoid zones of control is a nice touch.
Still, the engine is 20 years old, keep in mind it wasn't released yesterday, did the recent PoE(s) and PK did any better and released the perfect game?
Nope, Party-based TB cRPG fans still look up to ToEE.

KotC engine is great but nobody modded it there's 3 classes only so at some point, you'll play KotC 2 augury of chaos, hearkenwold and you'll realize you really want to play ToEE with Temple+ (Co8 is alright for the arena, i guess) because Realms Beyond never happened PK is a real pain to play and the Pillows saga is just garbage.
 

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