Underrail [PRE-RELEASE THREAD, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Smashing Axe]

PSI, dude, PSI.

That PSI attack (I forget what it's called) can stun robots and does severe damage with electricity attacks. It stuns them for like 2 rounds or some shit. I remember playing my PSI/melee guy and I literally plowed through the robots at GMS and others.

Can Thought Control do anything against robots or is it entirely useless?

 

[Hobo Elf]

PSI, dude, PSI.

That PSI attack (I forget what it's called) can stun robots and does severe damage with electricity attacks. It stuns them for like 2 rounds or some shit. I remember playing my PSI/melee guy and I literally plowed through the robots at GMS and others.

Can Thought Control do anything against robots or is it entirely useless?

Useless.

 

[Eyestabber]

Any other ideas to make stabbing robots a bit easier?

Expose Weakness?

Need a bit more melee skill for that.

Intinium
Can't add psy to this guy. Dumped will. Release version maybe...

 

[Blaine]

You can also just wander off somewhere else and find an electric hammer for sale, or in some loot.

In my armor 'n' hammer playthrough, I was able to destroy the sentry bots, although with difficulty, without bending over backwards to do it. Damned if I can remember exactly what I did or what I used, but I definitely remember being pissed off that the little shits could chain their flashbangs when working together.

 

[mixer]

Can anyone shortly explain PSI schools? I get that Psychokinesis is mostly for Robots, but never tried the other two.

 

[Eyestabber]

I like how the game presents a tough challenge in the very first "real" mission (sentry bots). The first time i killed them i had to go back to craft a new armor and a new AR. There is enough difficulty to make you go "mmm...what are my options here?" Instead of left clicking everything to death.

Sign of a good game in my book

 

[Kem0sabe]

I made a thread to discuss spoilers, gameplay, mechanics, tips and whatnot - http://www.rpgcodex.net/forums/inde...turn-tricks-tips-and-discuss-gameplay.105384/

 

[Eadan]

From some steam negative "previews".
"I know this is a thinking persons game but I just find it too difficult. Nearly every encounter I feel overwhelmed."

I believe this is a troll preview.

Fuck you, character creation is one of my favorite things in rpgs. This is not a storyfag game, but either way, the story would be spoiled for potential future playthroughs anyway, after all you actually experienced it once before.

I have no problem with chracter creation, but how and when you do it. If it isn't a storyfag game, then there should be even more focus on familiarizing the players with the gameplay before expecting them to invest stats/skills/perks.

I think this is a great opportunity for my first join date quoting. Errm...

Joined: Oct 22, 2015

Glad to get that out of the way:D

Sssshhh! This is the Codex. Games should require 15 failed attempts before teaching you enough to actually play them. Anything less is

I chose this game to talk about this issue because Underrail seems to be a favorite of most around here. Bad games have mostly bad systems, so a criticism of the failure of the evolution of character creation in RPG genre would go unnoticed under those games.

I am not particularly creative, but I would hope some developers would at least try to solve the issue of having to build your character (semi) blindly. It has been practically the same way since the genre's appearance, and I don't think "since it has been the same way since the start, it should never be questioned."

The only feasible way of dealing with character creation I can think of is instead of focusing on character creation, developers should focus on world creation (or development) based on the character you create (or develop).

The only thing you can mess up anyway are your base stats, really. You need to be courageous and drop some of them all the way to the minimum value so you can maximize something else.

I already managed to mess my EA char then, with 7 7 6 and rest 5 distribution.

What the fuck man, where is your sense of discovery and problem solving?
I'm sure we'll see your negative steam review soon.

TOO MANY SKILLS, RNG DECIDES EVERYTHING, THE GAME DIDN'T TELL ME THAT HACKING EARNED 10% MORE GOLD ON AVERAGE THAN LOCKPICKING

Unless the game becomes impossible or really tedious to finish with certain characters, I will have no issue with difficulty. Another aspect I mentioned was hidden content, by which I mean access to dialogue options, zones, items, quests, etc. that are only accesible to certain characters. I have more of an issue with the game becoming less fun or immersive than it becoming more difficult based on your character.

 

[Hobo Elf]

Can anyone shortly explain PSI schools? I get that Psychokinesis is mostly for Robots, but never tried the other two.

Psychokinesis is mostly for robots? What? No! Psychokinesis is good for Unarmed characters who want to enhance their Unarmed combat with Psi powers plus it has a total badass chain lightning spell that stuns. This is your bread and butter spell if you go full Post-Apocalyptic Wizard. I mean the chain lightning totally wrecks Robots, but it's very good against pretty much everyone else as well.

Thought Control is utility, mostly crowd control. Psi abilities to make enemies hostile to each other, incapacitating enemies and a super duper good panic inducing Psi ability that may not seem the best at first but you get a Feat that makes it into an AoE Psi ability, which is godlike. Causes panic for 4 turns.

Metathermics is your generic fantasy Wizard stuff with fireballs and icebolts. Not that great.

 

[Inf0mercial]

Can anyone shortly explain PSI schools? I get that Psychokinesis is mostly for Robots, but never tried the other two.

If you want stuns and danage go Kineses, if you want crowd control for organics go thoughts control, if you want pure damage Metathermics is way to go, so basically Psychokineses is best for hybrid build, thought control comes next but it lacks the damage and stuns together that kineses has then 3rd is thermo.

Oh and wall for kinesis is a 3x3 impenetrable wall that blocks sound and sight lassts for 2 turns and 4 with a perk and it ends start of your 5th turn, yes it is as awesome as it sounds.

 

[Sykar]

Can anyone shortly explain PSI schools? I get that Psychokinesis is mostly for Robots, but never tried the other two.

Psychokinesis is mostly for robots? What? No! Psychokinesis is good for Unarmed characters who want to enhance their Unarmed combat with Psi powers plus it has a total badass chain lightning spell that stuns. This is your bread and butter spell if you go full Post-Apocalyptic Wizard. I mean the chain lightning totally wrecks Robots, but it's very good against pretty much everyone else as well.

Thought Control is utility, mostly crowd control. Psi abilities to make enemies hostile to each other, incapacitating enemies and a super duper good panic inducing Psi ability that may not seem the best at first but you get a Feat that makes it into an AoE Psi ability, which is godlike. Causes panic for 4 turns.

Metathermics is your generic fantasy Wizard stuff with fireballs and icebolts. Not that great.

Purely speaking from gameplay experience it is very good but yes it is very generic overall.

 

[Hobo Elf]

Can anyone shortly explain PSI schools? I get that Psychokinesis is mostly for Robots, but never tried the other two.

Psychokinesis is mostly for robots? What? No! Psychokinesis is good for Unarmed characters who want to enhance their Unarmed combat with Psi powers plus it has a total badass chain lightning spell that stuns. This is your bread and butter spell if you go full Post-Apocalyptic Wizard. I mean the chain lightning totally wrecks Robots, but it's very good against pretty much everyone else as well.

Thought Control is utility, mostly crowd control. Psi abilities to make enemies hostile to each other, incapacitating enemies and a super duper good panic inducing Psi ability that may not seem the best at first but you get a Feat that makes it into an AoE Psi ability, which is godlike. Causes panic for 4 turns.

Metathermics is your generic fantasy Wizard stuff with fireballs and icebolts. Not that great.

Purely speaking from gameplay experience it is very good but yes it is very generic overall.

No, it's not very good. It's doable just like everything else is, but between Metathermics and the two other Psi schools, it's kinda ehh. I did two Psi characters and the one that didn't focus on Metathermics or use its abilities was far stronger. The Metathermic abilities eat up a lot of AP so you don't have much room for versatility, only damage. But Psychokinesis and Though Control abilities aren't such AP hogs so not only can you easily CC peeps, you also do a shitload of damage anyway.

 

[Daedalos]

Guys... one word. Alpha. Why are you still debating a fucking 10 month old build, when the new 1.0 version is 45 minutes away. Methathermics has been buffed alot in newer builds. Contain your autism

 

[Blaine]

You do know this is the Codex, right?

Also, forgot to mention earlier: The hard counter to Bilocation is to run full-blast in one direction without stopping until you're three towns over.

 

[Inf0mercial]

Pure psi build should be able to area bilocation then wall yourself off into a corner lol fuck me gotta try that now, only question is dodging and stealth or Armour up?

 

[Sykar]

Can anyone shortly explain PSI schools? I get that Psychokinesis is mostly for Robots, but never tried the other two.

Psychokinesis is mostly for robots? What? No! Psychokinesis is good for Unarmed characters who want to enhance their Unarmed combat with Psi powers plus it has a total badass chain lightning spell that stuns. This is your bread and butter spell if you go full Post-Apocalyptic Wizard. I mean the chain lightning totally wrecks Robots, but it's very good against pretty much everyone else as well.

Thought Control is utility, mostly crowd control. Psi abilities to make enemies hostile to each other, incapacitating enemies and a super duper good panic inducing Psi ability that may not seem the best at first but you get a Feat that makes it into an AoE Psi ability, which is godlike. Causes panic for 4 turns.

Metathermics is your generic fantasy Wizard stuff with fireballs and icebolts. Not that great.

Purely speaking from gameplay experience it is very good but yes it is very generic overall.

No, it's not very good. It's doable just like everything else is, but between Metathermics and the two other Psi schools, it's kinda ehh. I did two Psi characters and the one that didn't focus on Metathermics or use its abilities was far stronger. The Metathermic abilities eat up a lot of AP so you don't have much room for versatility, only damage. But Psychokinesis and Though Control abilities aren't such AP hogs so not only can you easily CC peeps, you also do a shitload of damage anyway.

Meta has inbuild CC in several of their damage spells or can get CC from feats.

 

[blamzooie]

Guys what's a good first build?

 

[Sykar]

Assault Rifles with Heavy Armor and crafting is a pretty safe bet. Just fairly boring imho.

 

[ST'Ranger]

Can't wait for the game to release, if only to stop all these plebeians shitting up a perfectly good thread with their "I've never played this game or so much as watched a gameplay video, but here's how to cater directly to me, Styg". Their kind will be the first to feel the sting of the Holy Sword of Underrail release, and from their gaping wounds will gush a river of negative steam reviews.

 

[Alfons]

Pure psi build should be able to area bilocation then wall yourself off into a corner lol fuck me gotta try that now.

I tried it, it works. Only thing I did differently is to wall the enemies with the clones as opposed to walling myself off from the enemies. Locust of control is the most powerful ability in the game.

Assault Rifles with Heavy Armor and crafting is a pretty safe bet. Just fairly boring imho.

Yeah, until you grab commando you don't get to do much in your turns.

 

[Eadan]

Hate it when games want the player to pick skills before they are at least somewhat familiar with the game. What is the ratio of locked doors/containers to hackable computers?, How do the rewards and hidden content behind them compare?, How good is melee versus ranged?, etc.. This pretty much guarantees your character customization will be uninformed in the first playthrough, and the story will be spoiled for potential future playthroughs.

I know what you're saying, but that's just the minmaxer in you that needs to be reined in.

Years of playing RPGs and strategy games are directly responsible for the yearning to optimise and the annoyance of playing blind. There was a period in my gaming 'career' where I wouldn't start a fresh new RPG/strategy without reading up on it a lot or watching decisions pro players make on YT. Where's the dump skills? Which items seem like junk but become useful later? Many RPGs have some weapon classes that are simply inferior to other options, should I go with swords instead of axes? It kinda fuelled a hate for arbitrariness some of the video game design systems have. Invest in the wrong skills, you're gimped. Sold that item? Too bad cause 3 hrs later there's an NPC asking for it. Picked the 3rd choice at a branching moment? Too bad, cause the two others offer rewards that would've been much nicer to have considering your playstyle, etc etc.

At the same time, there's something really off with games that offer ways out (like RPGs with respecs), or are designed around each choice being equally good. There's something very fun and exciting about choices being final, and even about having to make the most out of a poor skillset/item selection/unit roster. Respecs just cheapen the experience and make your choices seem irrelevant since you can do a U-turn at any moment and just completely switch your build around. The 'balanced' approach can be even worse.

In principle, I agree with PoE's design. In practice, I found that I much preferred the BG series' approach of "here's your character, make the most of his skills and deal with his limitations" as opposed to the game being fine with you doing most things with most classes. It rendered most of the choices regarding building characters and decking them out totally void of flavor and excitement.

Seems like you might be on the same path so my suggestion is - leave the optimal build for your 2nd playthrough and enjoy the game blind, and try to make the most out of the resources you limited yourself to with your poor choices. Lots of fun to be had that way! And if you do want to keep on optimising, have you tried playing roguelikes? Cause that's a genre that openly welcomes pursuit of the games' systems best (ab)use.

I find the struggle of min/maxing self destructive. If you are playing the game for the difficulty then you are basically destroying your own fun by making it less difficult. I am not one for speedruns or participating in leagues of ARPG s either.

The reason I assume a min/maxing mindset is the game encouraging it with the amount of customizability it offers even as you start the game. I know a playthrough will answer most of my questions, but it would be sıubpar, and although it doesn't matter much for a single game, the time wasted on several games in this manner add up.

 

[Hobo Elf]

Meta has inbuild CC in several of their damage spells or can get CC from feats.

Sure, but you need to spend a feat for fireball cc and it's not reliable. The icebolt slows but is not very effective against shooting enemies. I don't know how much Meta got buffed, but in this build I'd say go with Throwing rather than Meta. It does the same stuff, mostly, but is more reliable.

 

[Xzylvador]

Psychokinesis is mostly for robots? What? No! Psychokinesis is good for Unarmed characters who want to enhance their Unarmed combat with Psi powers plus it has a total badass chain lightning spell that stuns. This is your bread and butter spell if you go full Post-Apocalyptic Wizard. I mean the chain lightning totally wrecks Robots, but it's very good against pretty much everyone else as well.

Thought Control is utility, mostly crowd control. Psi abilities to make enemies hostile to each other, incapacitating enemies and a super duper good panic inducing Psi ability that may not seem the best at first but you get a Feat that makes it into an AoE Psi ability, which is godlike. Causes panic for 4 turns.

Metathermics is your generic fantasy Wizard stuff with fireballs and icebolts. Not that great.

Psychokinesis's as good at crowd control as Thought Control imo. Stun, stun, mass stun and an inpenetrable wall... And applicable to pretty much all enemies, unlike TC.

 

[ArchAngel]

Hate it when games want the player to pick skills before they are at least somewhat familiar with the game. What is the ratio of locked doors/containers to hackable computers?, How do the rewards and hidden content behind them compare?, How good is melee versus ranged?, etc.. This pretty much guarantees your character customization will be uninformed in the first playthrough, and the story will be spoiled for potential future playthroughs.

I know what you're saying, but that's just the minmaxer in you that needs to be reined in.

Years of playing RPGs and strategy games are directly responsible for the yearning to optimise and the annoyance of playing blind. There was a period in my gaming 'career' where I wouldn't start a fresh new RPG/strategy without reading up on it a lot or watching decisions pro players make on YT. Where's the dump skills? Which items seem like junk but become useful later? Many RPGs have some weapon classes that are simply inferior to other options, should I go with swords instead of axes? It kinda fuelled a hate for arbitrariness some of the video game design systems have. Invest in the wrong skills, you're gimped. Sold that item? Too bad cause 3 hrs later there's an NPC asking for it. Picked the 3rd choice at a branching moment? Too bad, cause the two others offer rewards that would've been much nicer to have considering your playstyle, etc etc.

At the same time, there's something really off with games that offer ways out (like RPGs with respecs), or are designed around each choice being equally good. There's something very fun and exciting about choices being final, and even about having to make the most out of a poor skillset/item selection/unit roster. Respecs just cheapen the experience and make your choices seem irrelevant since you can do a U-turn at any moment and just completely switch your build around. The 'balanced' approach can be even worse.

In principle, I agree with PoE's design. In practice, I found that I much preferred the BG series' approach of "here's your character, make the most of his skills and deal with his limitations" as opposed to the game being fine with you doing most things with most classes. It rendered most of the choices regarding building characters and decking them out totally void of flavor and excitement.

Seems like you might be on the same path so my suggestion is - leave the optimal build for your 2nd playthrough and enjoy the game blind, and try to make the most out of the resources you limited yourself to with your poor choices. Lots of fun to be had that way! And if you do want to keep on optimising, have you tried playing roguelikes? Cause that's a genre that openly welcomes pursuit of the games' systems best (ab)use.

I find the struggle of min/maxing self destructive. If you are playing the game for the difficulty then you are basically destroying your own fun by making it less difficult. I am not one for speedruns or participating in leagues of ARPG s either.

The reason I assume a min/maxing mindset is the game encouraging it with the amount of customizability it offers even as you start the game. I know a playthrough will answer most of my questions, but it would be sıubpar, and although it doesn't matter much for a single game, the time wasted on several games in this manner add up.

Maybe you should give up gaming than if it is such a struggle for you.

 

[Sykar]

Meta has inbuild CC in several of their damage spells or can get CC from feats.

Sure, but you need to spend a feat for fireball cc and it's not reliable. The icebolt slows but is not very effective against shooting enemies. I don't know how much Meta got buffed, but in this build I'd say go with Throwing rather than Meta. It does the same stuff, mostly, but is more reliable.

You just need high values then it is reliable. I had a full PSI character and the fireball fear close to never failed to apply.