World of Darkness Vampire: The Masquerade – Bloodlines 2 - VTMB sequel from The Chinese Room - coming October

[markec]

CANCEL THIS SHIT AND NEVER RELEASE IT

But I want to see Paradox burning money.

 

[Sallow]

They probably got rid of the last couple of devs that worked on all the old walking simulators. It's just the new guys there now. Well... new as in from three? years ago.

 

[Roguey]

Those layoffs could be from the Still Wakes the Deep team.

I checked the credits, and nope. I'm not paying linkedin to find the exact list of who left, but I did find one guy who left this month who was a programmer on Bloodlines 2 https://www.linkedin.com/in/sebastian-ploch/?originalSubdomain=uk

 

[Jaesun]

Well that's only one dev from bloodlines. What about the other 9?

 

[Roguey]

Well that's only one dev from bloodlines. What about the other 9?

Ugh, fine. I'll do it the tedious way.

Sandrinne Neill, Lighting Artist there since November 2024 - not credited on Still
Qin Yi, Dialogue Designer since March 2024 - not credited on Still
Kjartan Tysdal, Senior Artist since 2019 - credited on Still and Still DLC but also contributed to Bloodlines 2
Adam Sharp, senior environment artist since 2022 - not credited on Still
Pascal Siddons - explicitly states he was a technical producer for Bloodlines 2
Colin Pearce, senior programmer since 2020 - credited with "additional programming" on Still, one can assume he was a full-timer on Bloodlines 2
Jacob Jackman-Tait, producer on Still and the Still DLC
One guy whose name is difficult to find but he was lead QA, and checking the Still credits and their photos, he wasn't on it
Bradley Adams, 3D animator since April 2022 - not credited on Still, credited on Still DLC
Ben Burns, animator since August 2023 - not credited on Still
Abbie Darling, producer since October 2022 - credited on the Still DLC and also says she worked on Bloodlines 2
Jamie Berry, VFX artist since September 2022 - not credited on Still, credited on Still DLC, and has a Bloodlines 2 header on his linkedin page

So there was a bit of Still DLC culling, but it looks likely to me that Paradox decided to reduce the budget now that the game is wrapping up and they had to let some people go. Most of the people gone are artists, writers, producers, only a couple of programmers, they're still pretty necessary.

Whoops, spoke a bit too soon. Some people decided to just tell everyone they were laid off through blog posts without actually indicating it elsewhere. I can't be bothered to keep track of all this but the ones I saw were a level designer and a technical game designer, both credited with "additional design" on the Still DLC but not Still itself, so full-timers on Bloodlines 2.

 

[Roguey]

https://www.pcgamesn.com/vampire-the-masquerade-bloodlines-2/jason-carl-interview

But the much-beloved Jason Carl, White Wolf's brand marketing manager for The World of Darkness and the storyteller of hit live plays LA and New York by Night, isn't worried about the specter the original Bloodlines casts over The Chinese Room's upcoming PC game. Instead, the focus with Bloodlines 2 is on moving forward and forging a new path for the brand after a busy but somewhat underwhelming few years.

"I think that [the original] Bloodlines is one of those videogame experiences that happened so long ago that the circumstances of its release are, if not generally forgotten, at least misremembered or misinterpreted," he tells me. "What it has become today, and what it means for people today, is very different from what it was on release and what it meant to people then. I think that's fascinating. It's got a legacy that casts a long shadow."

"What made Bloodlines the experience that people remember was a combination of many different elements, many of which were not intentional at the time. They coalesced into something that I think was greater than the sum of its parts, but it's hard to do that intentionally. So, for us, the process [of designing Bloodlines 2] started with really trying to dissect the elements of the original Bloodlines that still resonate today, and what made that experience so memorable. What are the parts that can't be duplicated - or shouldn't be duplicated - for modern audiences, and how do we make that work together in a way that delivers the kind of satisfying experience that people want, but without simply repeating ourselves? We really wanted to take care not to issue a 'greatest hits album,' or to repeat something that would then become formulaic. Nobody wants to do that.

"[Bloodlines 2] had to be its own unique story; it had to capture the feeling of what it's like to be a monster. That's one of the core elements of Bloodlines, as well as Vampire: The Masquerade and The World of Darkness. You are the monster, nobody else. All of these terrible things you're doing are your choices and yours alone, and you must deal with the consequences, for good or for ill.

"I think that the clear intention of our approach and the soul searching about what's great about Bloodlines actually benefits our players," he muses. "What they're getting is kind of the best of both worlds. [Bloodlines 2] won't be the same experience that they knew in Bloodlines - I'm not even sure that would be possible or even desirable. What they get is the benefit of 20-plus years of hindsight; they get the experience of great storytelling elements, new modern development techniques, and a completely different story about Vampire: The Masquerade from a very different point of view - the Elder. Yet it still delivers that visceral, bloody experience that you want from a Bloodlines game."

*gagging noises*
Have to hand it to him about being really consistent and gung-ho about the visceral experience of being a vampire. And sticking to to Hardsuit with that bit about how no one wants a formulaic "greatest hits album."

 

[SpoonFULL]

As expected, dampening expectations and distancing from the original Bloodlines - damage control!

 

[Sallow]

"...much beloved..."

Not even a mother...

 

[d1r]

That are the parts that can't be duplicated - or shouldn't be duplicated - for modern audiences, and how do we make that work together in a way that delivers the kind of satisfying experience that people want, but without simply repeating ourselves?

This is such a damning sentence. I can't believe that people are STILL excited about this game.

 

[Wesp5]

"What made Bloodlines the experience that people remember was a combination of many different elements, many of which were not intentional at the time.

This is completely stupid! What made Bloodlines great, e.g. Boyarsky's art direction, Schaffer's music and the characters and writing from Mitsoda creating a unique atmosphere were intentional.

You are the monster, nobody else.

This is bullshit too. The WOD is full of monsters and you are only one of them! Troika managed to make that pretty clear, e.g. by the Oceanhouse Hotel map showing you the limit of your power.

 

[Storyfag]

"...much beloved..."

Not even a mother...

Eh, watch him run a game or two. You will understand.

 

[Morgoth]

https://www.pcgamesn.com/vampire-the-masquerade-bloodlines-2/jason-carl-interview

But the much-beloved Jason Carl, White Wolf's brand marketing manager for The World of Darkness and the storyteller of hit live plays LA and New York by Night, isn't worried about the specter the original Bloodlines casts over The Chinese Room's upcoming PC game. Instead, the focus with Bloodlines 2 is on moving forward and forging a new path for the brand after a busy but somewhat underwhelming few years.

"I think that [the original] Bloodlines is one of those videogame experiences that happened so long ago that the circumstances of its release are, if not generally forgotten, at least misremembered or misinterpreted," he tells me. "What it has become today, and what it means for people today, is very different from what it was on release and what it meant to people then. I think that's fascinating. It's got a legacy that casts a long shadow."

"What made Bloodlines the experience that people remember was a combination of many different elements, many of which were not intentional at the time. They coalesced into something that I think was greater than the sum of its parts, but it's hard to do that intentionally. So, for us, the process [of designing Bloodlines 2] started with really trying to dissect the elements of the original Bloodlines that still resonate today, and what made that experience so memorable. What are the parts that can't be duplicated - or shouldn't be duplicated - for modern audiences, and how do we make that work together in a way that delivers the kind of satisfying experience that people want, but without simply repeating ourselves? We really wanted to take care not to issue a 'greatest hits album,' or to repeat something that would then become formulaic. Nobody wants to do that.

"[Bloodlines 2] had to be its own unique story; it had to capture the feeling of what it's like to be a monster. That's one of the core elements of Bloodlines, as well as Vampire: The Masquerade and The World of Darkness. You are the monster, nobody else. All of these terrible things you're doing are your choices and yours alone, and you must deal with the consequences, for good or for ill.

"I think that the clear intention of our approach and the soul searching about what's great about Bloodlines actually benefits our players," he muses. "What they're getting is kind of the best of both worlds. [Bloodlines 2] won't be the same experience that they knew in Bloodlines - I'm not even sure that would be possible or even desirable. What they get is the benefit of 20-plus years of hindsight; they get the experience of great storytelling elements, new modern development techniques, and a completely different story about Vampire: The Masquerade from a very different point of view - the Elder. Yet it still delivers that visceral, bloody experience that you want from a Bloodlines game."

*gagging noises*
Have to hand it to him about being really consistent and gung-ho about the visceral experience of being a vampire. And sticking to to Hardsuit with that bit about how no one wants a formulaic "greatest hits album."

I mean, he isn't wrong about too many people having misremembered VtMB.

The game has aged horribly imo.

 

[Salem]

https://www.pcgamesn.com/vampire-the-masquerade-bloodlines-2/jason-carl-interview

But the much-beloved Jason Carl, White Wolf's brand marketing manager for The World of Darkness and the storyteller of hit live plays LA and New York by Night, isn't worried about the specter the original Bloodlines casts over The Chinese Room's upcoming PC game. Instead, the focus with Bloodlines 2 is on moving forward and forging a new path for the brand after a busy but somewhat underwhelming few years.

"I think that [the original] Bloodlines is one of those videogame experiences that happened so long ago that the circumstances of its release are, if not generally forgotten, at least misremembered or misinterpreted," he tells me. "What it has become today, and what it means for people today, is very different from what it was on release and what it meant to people then. I think that's fascinating. It's got a legacy that casts a long shadow."

"What made Bloodlines the experience that people remember was a combination of many different elements, many of which were not intentional at the time. They coalesced into something that I think was greater than the sum of its parts, but it's hard to do that intentionally. So, for us, the process [of designing Bloodlines 2] started with really trying to dissect the elements of the original Bloodlines that still resonate today, and what made that experience so memorable. What are the parts that can't be duplicated - or shouldn't be duplicated - for modern audiences, and how do we make that work together in a way that delivers the kind of satisfying experience that people want, but without simply repeating ourselves? We really wanted to take care not to issue a 'greatest hits album,' or to repeat something that would then become formulaic. Nobody wants to do that.

"[Bloodlines 2] had to be its own unique story; it had to capture the feeling of what it's like to be a monster. That's one of the core elements of Bloodlines, as well as Vampire: The Masquerade and The World of Darkness. You are the monster, nobody else. All of these terrible things you're doing are your choices and yours alone, and you must deal with the consequences, for good or for ill.

"I think that the clear intention of our approach and the soul searching about what's great about Bloodlines actually benefits our players," he muses. "What they're getting is kind of the best of both worlds. [Bloodlines 2] won't be the same experience that they knew in Bloodlines - I'm not even sure that would be possible or even desirable. What they get is the benefit of 20-plus years of hindsight; they get the experience of great storytelling elements, new modern development techniques, and a completely different story about Vampire: The Masquerade from a very different point of view - the Elder. Yet it still delivers that visceral, bloody experience that you want from a Bloodlines game."

*gagging noises*
Have to hand it to him about being really consistent and gung-ho about the visceral experience of being a vampire. And sticking to to Hardsuit with that bit about how no one wants a formulaic "greatest hits album."

I mean, he isn't wrong about too many people having misremembered VtMB.

The game has aged horribly imo.

There's a certain feel and vibe with VtMB that resonated strongly well, thanks to capturing the perfect 2000s early LA charm, wrapped around a fantastic true-to-the-identity of the Vampire tabletop system. The source engine and gameplay just felt fun and engrossing when roleplaying, all backed up with that strong world full of rich narrative beats and cool characters that was purely 100 per cent authentic by the artists wanting to make a game they wish to do.

Jason Carl is doing a disservice with what he is saying because that was a game made in all authenticity and passion, and sure, the gameplay and everything on this side compared to today's standards is janky as hell, but you can bet a lot of people find it way more soulful and fun because it plays strongly to its great role-playing, giving the player freedom on how they wish to play.

It's hard to get a great vampire video game, let alone a role-playing one with multiple choices that is not diluted by poor subjective politics or others. Bloodlinesis the antithetical embodiment of modern gaming that is poorly screwed over by committee-driven nonsense.

Bloodlines 2 I have no hope the devs get why people love 1 and why it is special.

 

[Morgoth]

I get the adoration about the vibes and charms, but as a game, I think VtmB feels too shallow now to get sucked in again.

 

[Salem]

I get the adoration about the vibes and charms, but as a game, I think VtmB feels too shallow now to get sucked in again.

Hmm, maybe it's probably due to growing up and really liking that certain feel and style of how the game plays in all its ambiance and can get engrossed in that world with it all (like I do with Half-Life titles). It just feels alive in its own way when playing in that world that a lot of other games fail to replicate. It does for me and has its own community feeling the same, so it's probably one of them ones for your end; if it doesn't click, it doesn't click (nothing wrong with that).

I am going to hold judgment with this one on its own merits still because I love the IP and actually really enjoy the visual novel series and going in treating this project as something like that on a bigger scale. I can't see this topping the original in all its identity and soul however because of what it represents from being a game in those cool ass days.

 

[Morgoth]

I get the adoration about the vibes and charms, but as a game, I think VtmB feels too shallow now to get sucked in again.

Hmm, maybe it's probably due to growing up and really liking that certain feel and style of how the game plays in all its ambiance and can get engrossed in that world with it all (like I do with Half-Life titles). It just feels alive in its own way when playing in that world that a lot of other games fail to replicate. It does for me and has its own community feeling the same, so it's probably one of them ones for your end; if it doesn't click, it doesn't click (nothing wrong with that).

I am going to hold judgment with this one on its own merits still because I love the IP and actually really enjoy the visual novel series and going in treating this project as something like that on a bigger scale. I can't see this topping the original in all its identity and soul however because of what it represents from being a game in those cool ass days.

I mean, sure, it might just come down to mindset and mood... Maybe I shall give it a try again at some point, but my last two attempts have left me cold. Mind you I devoured every bit and piece of that game when it came out.

 

[Salem]

I get the adoration about the vibes and charms, but as a game, I think VtmB feels too shallow now to get sucked in again.

Hmm, maybe it's probably due to growing up and really liking that certain feel and style of how the game plays in all its ambiance and can get engrossed in that world with it all (like I do with Half-Life titles). It just feels alive in its own way when playing in that world that a lot of other games fail to replicate. It does for me and has its own community feeling the same, so it's probably one of them ones for your end; if it doesn't click, it doesn't click (nothing wrong with that).

I am going to hold judgment with this one on its own merits still because I love the IP and actually really enjoy the visual novel series and going in treating this project as something like that on a bigger scale. I can't see this topping the original in all its identity and soul however because of what it represents from being a game in those cool ass days.

I mean, sure, it might just come down to mindset and mood... Maybe I shall give it a try again at some point, but my last two attempts have left me cold. Mind you I devoured every bit and piece of that game when it came out.

Maybe try when you do give it another go get some mods and ensure you install the unofficial patch -
https://www.moddb.com/mods/vtmb-unofficial-patch

 

[normie]

"What made Bloodlines the experience that people remember was a combination of many different elements, many of which were not intentional at the time.

This is completely stupid! What made Bloodlines great, e.g. Boyarsky's art direction, Schaffer's music and the characters and writing from Mitsoda creating a unique atmosphere were intentional.

even wesp doesn't mention Jason Anderson (the actual god of Fallout, Arcanum and VTMB)

 

[Vincente]

even wesp doesn't mention Jason Anderson (the actual god of Fallout, Arcanum and VTMB)

chad moore and jason anderson are unsung troika heroes

 

[Cohesion]

https://www.pcgamesn.com/vampire-the-masquerade-bloodlines-2/jason-carl-interview

What are the parts that can't be duplicated - or shouldn't be duplicated - for modern audiences

I hate this shit. Modern gamedev for "modern audiences" ie popamole "press X to win" with mandatory LGBTBBQ propaganda.

In before: "b-b-but games were always woke".

 

[Roguey]

I mean, he isn't wrong about too many people having misremembered VtMB.

The game has aged horribly imo.

It's not particularly fun to play, but it's extremely funny to market your long-awaited sequel with "That game wasn't even all that good to begin with."

 

[normie]

even wesp doesn't mention Jason Anderson (the actual god of Fallout, Arcanum and VTMB)

chad moore and jason anderson are unsung troika heroes

imagine the disappointment in Hardsuit's face when they realised they needed Chad Moore but instead got fingerless gloves meme man Brian Mitsoda

 

[NecroLord]

There's a certain feel and vibe with VtMB that resonated strongly well, thanks to capturing the perfect 2000s early LA charm, wrapped around a fantastic true-to-the-identity of the Vampire tabletop system.

VTMB is the perfect Gehenna scenario and campaign, considering the rest of the Gehenna tabletop campaigns are abysmal and devolve into Antediluvian Marvel-tier cape shit.
Gothic Horror in L.A., they managed to capture the sleaze of the city itself (just look at Santa Monica or Downtown), a rather dysfunctional city full of crime (reminder that the game takes place in 2004, was L.A. worse in that period compared to the present day?).

 

[Wesp5]

even wesp doesn't mention Jason Anderson (the actual god of Fallout, Arcanum and VTMB)

The problem is that you can't easily pin down what he did. Aside from the Oceanhouse Hotel, there is little concrete info and compared to all the others I can't remember him talking about Bloodlines much. It's much easier to say that Boyarsky drew the concept art, Schaffer composed the music and Mitsoda wrote many of the most memorable characters, but it seems to me that probably he was the guy who brought all things together that made Bloodlines great!

 

[NecroLord]

even wesp doesn't mention Jason Anderson (the actual god of Fallout, Arcanum and VTMB)

The problem is that you can't easily pin down what he did. Aside from the Oceanhouse Hotel, there is little concrete info and compared to all the others I can't remember him talking about Bloodlines much. It's much easier to say that Boyarsky drew the concept art, Schaffer composed the music and Mitsoda wrote many of the most memorable characters, but it seems to me that probably he was the guy who brought all things together that made Bloodlines great!

Mitsoda also voiced several characters (Ji Wen Ja, Romero), as did Boyarsky (Carson, Gomez from The Deb of Night).
I don't think Jason Anderson did?