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Victoria 2: Ahistorical fairy-land Latin America, what the fuck Paradox?

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I was playing some Victoria 2 AHD those days, and HOLY FUCK, I can't play any Latin-American country anymore.
1836 Brazil is ridiculously fictional, there's no Cabanagem, no Sabinada, no Farrapos, Malê, NADA! Brazil gets a magical claim on Bolivia (despite there having 0.0 Brazilians living there in 1836, and the whole issue only happening during Rubber Boom), the Amazon is a totally okay place to march your doomstack around (lol) and all other countries are pathetic and fodder for your mighty army, your only worry really is getting attacked by European powers.

Tried Paraguay, ANOTHER magical fairyland country. Somehow has good relations with Argentina, the one country that refused to recognize its very existence and did everything to fuck over it and invade, and has strangely bad relations with Brazil, the one country that recognized its existence to fuck with Argentina.

Tried to play Haiti. You get ridiculous good relations with Kwanzania, the one country that HATED HATED HATED HAITI for all it stood for ("liberation of slaves? Black slave revolt? In MY Kwanza? FUCK THAT INVADE KILL MURDER RAPE!!" was the main Amerikwan stance on Haiti) and wanted to invade and raze Haiti to the ground and salt the ground. I had to wait, like, forty years to get one large-scale revolt, our Haiti was a hotbed of instability.

I'm not even touching super-tranqs Uruguay and Bolivia, the land of simultaneous three-country gangbang.
 

Vaarna_Aarne

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Didn't you get the news that Paradox games only properly model the large countries (and Sweden) every time around, less prominent countries be damned?

I spent effort into making a mod that improved the status of less powerful civilized countries precisely because it was so fucked up! Hell, it's a shame there isn't a proper modifier effect for troop performance, if there was anything I wanted to do, it was making it so that a GP invading a non-GP civilized country would be a casualty-heavy prospect because of a triggered modifier kicking in for brave and patriotic defense against imperialist pigs. Tentative idea for me would have been a GP needing a 3x/4x numerical superiority before reaching the point of "not getting ass whooped all over the place." Probably also an increased attrition modifier of some sort for GPs to reflect guerilla warfare. Generally the idea would be that a GP marching in over-confidently to a smaller country would no longer be a walk in the park for them. Of course, the modifiers would need a set of degrees that take into account population and country size as well.


I haven't yet ported over my other stuff and done modding on AHD though, getting extremely butthurt about the way the release version had broken features and bugged gameplay elements (ie, the no population growth at all bug I raged about extensively). I patched it a few days back though, I probably should finally check the deal with it, see if there are new modifier effects that could handle creation of viable gameplay for smaller countries better.
 

tiagocc0

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I bow before you, I can't even imagine how come you have the balls to delve into modding such a game!
 

Malakal

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Vaarne so you are making a fantasy fairy tale mod for fantasy fairy tale countries? Because in this time and age nations were conquered by armies not even represented by a single brigade in Vic 2. Especially in Africa. If you can call those nations.

Big attrition? Yes. Good defence? No way its historical. The only reason South America wasnt conquered was USA and Monroe. They only reason Africa wasnt... of wait it was. Asia? Same thing, even China got partitioned, with the notable exception of Japan.

As much as I would like minor nations to stand a chance (they are more fun to play as) its not historical or realistic.
 

Vaarna_Aarne

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Vaarne so you are making a fantasy fairy tale mod for fantasy fairy tale countries? Because in this time and age nations were conquered by armies not even represented by a single brigade in Vic 2. Especially in Africa. If you can call those nations.

Big attrition? Yes. Good defence? No way its historical. The only reason South America wasnt conquered was USA and Monroe. They only reason Africa wasnt... of wait it was. Asia? Same thing, even China got partitioned, with the notable exception of Japan.

As much as I would like minor nations to stand a chance (they are more fun to play as) its not historical or realistic.
In case you missed it, I mentioned that being civilized would be a prereq. Obviously most Uncivs are in deadly peril, but I did make the requirements for Westernization more reasonable (largely tech and time based, since gaining prestige and military score was rather hard and back then the player military score algorhytm was borkered) and immediate benefits of Westernization larger (the previous research point boost was a fucking joke).

As for smaller countries in Europe... Keep in mind that Austria-Hungary got its ass handed to it on a plate by Serbians. The British also had considerable difficulty fighting the Boers. List goes on. Generally I highly dislike the notion that GPs should have a walk in the park against smaller countries. If anything, David vs Goliath should be the standard norm. I also planned on making a modifier that provides increasing penalties to leadership and organization as your regiment max (so Mobilization is the best way to avoid this, more on my ideas for Mobbing later) exceeds 200-300 (I'd have to find a good point here), so that having a Russia style army really just paves way for the Germans killing your soldiers in their millions. I also increased the standard soldier->pop casualty ratio along with the amount of Military Hospital invention effects, so now you start with almost the 1 soldier dead -> 3 pops dead ratio and discovery of Medicine drastically drops it.

I also wanted to rework the Mobilization system, but couldn't figure out either system. First I thought about making Mobilized troops take more pop casualties, meaning that Mobilization can quickly rack up you with World War 1 casualties in GP vs GP grand brawl. This can't be done as far as I know, so I thought about turning Mobs into Irregulars. Can't be done either. So in the end I just nuked the mobilization base values so the game doesn't fucking crash or slow down to a crawl when 1900+ year GPs mobilize.

One thing often overlooked in my Vicky 2 modding is that I gave Japan a hard-maximum time limit on the decision to modernize, with Japan being GUARANTEED to modernize at the historical date in order for them to grow stronger. I also increased Japan's number of research points gained for becoming civilized exponentially so they would skyrocket to Great Power status in short order.

I also looked into, and probably will again, into making a factory that turns Timber into Coal, while significantly raising Timber production values. A massive problem in standard Vicky 2 is that GPs consume ALL the resources in the world that matter, leading to smaller countries without their own access to Coal and Timber provinces forever locked from Industrialization), which I originally solved by doubling base production for Coal and Timber so they aren't the most valuable goods in the universe (seriously, unmodded your primary concern in conquest was just getting more coal and timber due to them being so much more valuable than anything else in the game).

I bow before you, I can't even imagine how come you have the balls to delve into modding such a game!
Modding Paradox games is extremely easy, especially thanks to the more orderly and streamlined structure of Clausewitz compared to Europa engine.

Of course, the largest number of my modding went into improving the presentation of the Grand Duchy of Finland (I'm going to say it's even worse than South America, just to tease TBS) and give it the what-if decision path for expansion (ie, like Greece -> Byzantium run, though nowhere near as extensive) and improving the province cultural presentation, along with making Russia a lot less stable (combination of decision-driven locks on political reforms and economic expansion, along with adding a shitload of new potential countries from the New Nations mod) and multikult (removed all accepted minorities, introduced a Russification decision chain for assimillation penalty removal in exchange for angrier ethnic groups) as per history. A longterm plan was to convert most farmers and labourers into Slave pops to better reflect serfdom.

On the subject of touching up smaller countries and adding them "Greater _______" decision chains, I'm all ears. I think the most fun in Vicky 2 (aside from creating an Austrian Death Machine) is going from "zero to hero" so to speak with a minor country. One thing I'm proud of is adding a capital moving decision for Ottomans so that Greece can now actually create Byzantium without conquering ALL of the Ottoman Empire, and giving Poland a non-insane formation decision (you only need two of the three states of Congress Poland + Krakow province now) and an additional decision for making Lithuanian an accepted culture (will probably create a Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth country later on if I can be assed, currently it was just a for teh lulz decision, I guess I should add a mirror version of it for Lithuania if they control enough Potatoland).
 
Joined
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At least you can play with Brazil, most games just ignore it and sometimes even Portugal.

True. I blame the serious nordic european bias the internet has, hopefully the large influx of Brazilians (EHUEHEUHEUHEUHEAUHEUHAUHEUAHAEUHEA BR BR BR) will fight that.


Didn't you get the news that Paradox games only properly model the large countries (and Sweden) every time around, less prominent countries be damned?

Of course, the largest number of my modding went into improving the presentation of the Grand Duchy of Finland (I'm going to say it's even worse than South America, just to tease TBS)
I think the most fun in Vicky 2 (aside from creating an Austrian Death Machine) is going from "zero to hero" so to speak with a minor country.

True, EU3's Southeast Asia is for example, totally fictional and WTF worthy. Their Mesoamerica wans't much better, and I think so was their Africa.

Don't know about Grand Duchy of Finland, post more.
Yes, I agree going from zero to hero is awesome, and the game should support that.
I never saw a super-badass Paraguay like in our victorian times, for example.
 

Vaarna_Aarne

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Eh, I don't think you wanna call Paraguay super-badass considering Lopez managed to get most of the population killed with pants-on-head retarded decisions and megalomania.

EDIT: Basically the main thing with the Grand Duchy is that during that time Finland was an autonomous area in Russian Empire with separate currency, administration and common law, which resulted in it being light years ahead of the rest of the empire economically and socially by the turning of the 20th century. Vicky 2 doesn't reflect this at all, as Finland should start (or become, if we want to be max accurate) a puppet state of Russia with a Constitutional Monarchy government type. On top of that additional modifiers have to added to reflect the immense population boom (by 1900 the population should have tripled from starting amount, and that's after a famine event in 1870s that kills 10% of the population) and economic growth. The "Greater Finland" path is essentially just addition of cores to Estonia and Ingria (Finland starts with cores in all of Karelia, total ownership of which is required for the Greater Finland decision) along with accepted Estonian culture (I'd make it remove Swedish as accepted culture to reflect total Fennoman ideological victory, but no can do).

I also made a new Declare Independence event that can be used universally by puppet states, where in case of an ensuing war of invasion (multiple choice reaction event for the master, one is war of total conquest) by the former master country they receive a sizable bonus.
 

edda0199

Novice
Joined
Jul 25, 2012
Messages
2
I was playing some Victoria 2 AHD those days, and HOLY FUCK, I can't play any Latin-American country anymore.
1836 Brazil is ridiculously fictional, there's no Cabanagem, no Sabinada, no Farrapos, Malê, NADA! Brazil gets a magical claim on Bolivia (despite there having 0.0 Brazilians living there in 1836, and the whole issue only happening during Rubber Boom), the Amazon is a totally okay place to march your doomstack around (lol) and all other countries are pathetic and fodder for your mighty army, your only worry really is getting attacked by European powers.

Tried Paraguay, ANOTHER magical fairyland country. Somehow has good relations with Argentina, the one country that refused to recognize its very existence and did everything to fuck over it and invade, and has strangely bad relations with Brazil, the one country that recognized its existence to fuck with Argentina.

Tried to play Haiti. You get ridiculous good relations with Kwanzania, the one country that HATED HATED HATED HAITI for all it stood for ("liberation of slaves? Black slave revolt? In MY Kwanza? FUCK THAT INVADE KILL MURDER RAPE!!" was the main Amerikwan stance on Haiti) and wanted to invade and raze Haiti to the ground and salt the ground. I had to wait, like, forty years to get one large-scale revolt, our Haiti was a hotbed of instability.

I'm not even touching super-tranqs Uruguay and Bolivia, the land of simultaneous three-country gangbang.
"I was playing some Victoria 2 AHD those days, and HOLY FUCK, I can't play any Latin-American country anymore."i aree with you!
As you sai:
Did you even play the game Fairyland 2?have try it, maybe you will like the game. my friend and i PLAY IT CRAZY!
As an successor to Fairyland created by the same Taiwan-based developer Lager Network Technologies, the sequel will carry over the family-friendly gameplay, adorable and colorful, to a 3D virtual world where player can try out different professions, battle little creatures, make friends, adopt pets and experience fun and adventure in rich storytelling.


AND IT HAS MANY FEATURE!:retarded:!!
 
Self-Ejected

Ulminati

Kamelåså!
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someone just got trolled by a spambot :lol:
 
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poocolator

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Vicky 2 is completely accurate. History as you know it has been retconned by the kwa neoliberal power-base, so everything that you know about latin america is false. The Swedes have travelled back in time to determine the reality, and have produced the paradox games as a result.
 

Vaarna_Aarne

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I hope Paradox eventually patches in Military Tactics and other functionalities into the modifier list, like HoI3 now being able to give modifier bonuses to Hard Attack and Soft Attack (latest in their long line of ultimately futile attempts at making the Winter War a challenge for the Soviet Union in HoI3). If that happened, I'd get back in modding minor country playability, war balance and additional features for certain nations in a heartbeat, it'd solve the biggest problem right there (= doomstack curbstomps of small civilized countries by Great Powers).
 
Joined
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Vicky 2 is completely accurate. History as you know it has been retconned by the kwa neoliberal power-base, so everything that you know about latin america is false. The Swedes have travelled back in time to determine the reality, and have produced the paradox games as a result.

But... how do I remember it all?


Brazilian Slaughter just wants his Victoria 2 to be Call of Duty. Same shitty corridor every time.

Go back to Zaphorozia, you filthy Kipchak.
 

poocolator

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Vicky 2 is completely accurate. History as you know it has been retconned by the kwa neoliberal power-base, so everything that you know about latin america is false. The Swedes have travelled back in time to determine the reality, and have produced the paradox games as a result.

But... how do I remember it all?
Brazilian magicks, I suspect. I heard it on the tv, you know.
 

Cassidy

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The Victoria Improvement Pack mod fixed it in the first Victoria, featuring the Farrapos as an independent nation at war with BR and all the other revolts as rebel occupations. No need to mention the independent Farrapos was by and far the most difficult country to play in the mod, starting the game at war with BR, with its only advantage being an incredibly skilled general at start. It's definitively worth a LP although it is more fucked than Krakow. Too bad there was no V2 Improvement Pack that gives a general overhaul to all continents of the world to make them more historically coherent.
 

JarlFrank

I like Thief THIS much
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Obvious advertising plant, but I approved his post because it's just so incredibly hilarious considering the content and this thread's title.
 

edda0199

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On top of that additional modifiers have to added to reflect the immense population boom (by 1900 the population should have tripled from starting amount, and that's after a famine event in 1870s that kills 10% of the population) and economic growth.
 

kony

Formely known as Konjad
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Strap Yourselves In Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2
Just finished playing Victoria II today and yeah... any non-European ( I guess, except USA) is not meant to be played. The first time I chose Burma to play and played only about 3 hours. Three long and boring hours. That Asian country, labeled as "uncivilized" (every not westernized country is uncivilized, apparently), in which I could do practically nothing. No social or political changes, no building, no nothing. The only thing I could do was attack my neighbours, who were either protected by UK or were UK. Since I was "protected" by UK as well I decided to fight for FREEDOMZ!!! I waged war on the UK and in an instance my whole country became flooded by them giving me practically game over (I didn't want to wait another hour until they actually conquer my country).

The next time I played as Austria (and later changed into Austria-Hungary). That game was enjoyable. I was a superpower, but also placed between other superpowers, so it was quite a challenge (well, Russia was quite a challenge at least). This time I cold use all the game mechanics, not having them disabled. The game was fun enough to make me play it to the end, the year of 1936.
2E9076C11E39FCD4B2684382D711994B9E171484



So, if anyone wants to play Victoria II - play European, anything else is boring.
 

Kattze

Andhaira
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Playing Lat-ams is interesting as well (apart from the ahistorical inconsistencies that TBS hated). Nothing is more amusing than turning Bolivia (the traditional punching-bag of americas) into a great power.
 

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