VoiceGate: Videogame voice actors considering a strike, want to unionize

[Daemongar]

lambasting

I don't think that word means what you think it means.

 

[Harg Harfardarssen]

Wisconsin's economy is doing well because of the NATIONAL economy but Minnesota is doing well because... uh... they don't have Scott Walker. Minnesota balanced their budget because of fairy magic, Wisconsin balanced their budget because of the NATIONAL economy. Glad you framed it for me, I might have actually thought about this for more than 2 seconds and seen how fucking stupid your argument is.

But still .. you don't have any.. you know, facts to back this up? Just talking points which people can get anywhere. He's dumb! Anyone who disagrees is dumb! Wow! I'll be honest, it really doesn't sound like you ever read anything about this. Other than petty insults, and calling people dumb, you don't seem to have too much to say.

Why would anyone listen to your opinion on labor unions and political events if you are just some partisan hack?

The evidence is that Wisconsin and Minnesota are demographically comparable. Minnesota has pursued the opposite polices as Wisconsin and has seen better economic outcomes. http://urbanmilwaukee.com/2015/07/15/data-wonk-why-is-minnesota-outperforming-wisconsin/

 

[Lightsinthesky]

Petite Bourgeois communists bitching and moaning about video games is possibly one of the funniest things the internet has produced so far.

 

[Daemongar]

The evidence is that Wisconsin and Minnesota are demographically comparable. Minnesota has pursued the opposite polices as Wisconsin and has seen better economic outcomes. http://urbanmilwaukee.com/2015/07/15/data-wonk-why-is-minnesota-outperforming-wisconsin/

I'll assume you are from Minnesota from your name, but it's not comparable because the story neglects probably the most important factor: the 3.5 Billion dollar deficit the previous administration left for Wisconsin which Walker inherited.
Also, Milwaukee is a huge sag on Wisconsin itself, and that can't be discounted, while Minneapolis has been a huge part of Minnesota's recovery.

Honestly, it would be easier to compare Illinois and Wisconsin, because they were in similar situations in 2011 or so, and proceeded differently.

 

[Harg Harfardarssen]

I'll assume you are from Minnesota from your name, but it's not comparable because the story neglects probably the most important factor: the 3.5 Billion dollar deficit the previous administration left for Wisconsin which Walker inherited.
Also, Milwaukee is a huge sag on Wisconsin itself, and that can't be discounted, while Minneapolis has been a huge part of Minnesota's recovery.

Honestly, it would be easier to compare Illinois and Wisconsin, because they were in similar situations in 2011 or so, and proceeded differently.

Not from Minnesota, I just like vikings and goofy sounding names.

Sure, direct state to state comparisons of this kind should be taken with a grain of salt b/c of the complexity involved. But if you are going to compare Illinois and Wisconsin, you can't ignore the fact that Illinois faced horrifically underfunded pension obligations while Wisconsin had an extremely well funded pension system. Does the inherited deficit to which you refer even that out? I don't think so, as Walker exaggerated the deficit and has exaggerated the degree to which he has "solved" deficit issues - http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...-deficit-and-tax-cuts-fact-checker-biography/

Minneapolis' success didn't come from nowhere however, it is the result of policy choices, particularly those that Walker would typically oppose, such as local tax equalization legislation and regulations encouraging affordable housing to be distributed throughout the city. Additionally many of the advantages held by Minnesota people cite, such as a more educated workforce, are ones that are due to policy choices that are antithetical to Walker's aim, like public education funding.

Additionally, although you could fairly argue that it has been too short a window to truly evaluate the results of Walker's tenure, the supply side economics to which Walker subscribes have been thoroughly shown to be ineffective when introduced elsewhere.

 

[Higher Animal]

Bu Bu muh Minneapolis! Muh Negroes in Chicagey!

Stupid or dishonest. No exceptions.

 

[Higher Animal]

Simple conservative retellings of the complex history of labor policy can't be taken seriously.

Unions were oppressed publicly and privately for most of the nineteenth and early twentieth century. Organized labor negotiations were meant to stop the bad publicity and public disorder that occurred when labor strikes took place. The 50% + 1 rule was meant as a government intervention into both labor and business power to regulate these disorders and produce a desired outcome for both parties. In exchange, labor unions have given up the right to wildcat strike as well as closed shop.

If regulation of monopolies is important to you, the place to start is major corporations. There are plenty of monopolies in the free market. In fact, Peter Thiel thinks monopolies are a great thing that need to be encouraged. Any IP you can think of is a monopoly. Any contract that isn't always subject to revision is a monopoly.

The other errata like being "forced" to support candidates you don't agree with is off topic culture wars stuff.

"in many cases" is not an argument. The point is general. Does paying people for labor produce better or worse quality goods and services? Does it encourage further R&D? Is the source of value people like Martin Shkreli or the people who discover, manufacture, market, and introduce the drugs he profits from? The answer is like physics. Always true, always universal.

 

[Daemongar]

Not from Minnesota, I just like vikings and goofy sounding names.

Sure, direct state to state comparisons of this kind should be taken with a grain of salt b/c of the complexity involved. But if you are going to compare Illinois and Wisconsin, you can't ignore the fact that Illinois faced horrifically underfunded pension obligations while Wisconsin had an extremely well funded pension system. Does the inherited deficit to which you refer even that out? I don't think so, as Walker exaggerated the deficit and has exaggerated the degree to which he has "solved" deficit issues - http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/fact-checker/wp/2015/09/18/scott-walkers-claims-about-wisconsin-budget-deficit-and-tax-cuts-fact-checker-biography/

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...-deficit-and-tax-cuts-fact-checker-biography/
Yeah, the "things weren't as bad as they seemed" card has been pulled out, its a new method of redefining history. Walker didn't make up the deficit as it was reported as such in 2011, as the article I linked pointed out. Also, your article confirms this. So saying he exaggerated things is not true.

Minneapolis' success didn't come from nowhere however, it is the result of policy choices, particularly those that Walker would typically oppose, such as local tax equalization legislation and regulations encouraging affordable housing to be distributed throughout the city. Additionally many of the advantages held by Minnesota people cite, such as a more educated workforce, are ones that are due to policy choices that are antithetical to Walker's aim, like public education funding..

Walker is now against "education" (ha) because he cut funding to the university system. The same system they found had a $1 Billion slush fund they weren't disclosing while raising tuition. So he cut their funding, and every article that writes on this subject that fails to disclose the slush fund, well, makes it easy that they are pushing talking points. Rather than spend any of that slush fund, the University system has threatened to close schools, lay off teachers, etc. But nobody calls them out for being "against" education.

 

[Higher Animal]

Scott Walker - Not a terrible record, just an awful one!

 

[Harg Harfardarssen]

Yeah, the "things weren't as bad as they seemed" card has been pulled out, its a new method of redefining history. Walker didn't make up the deficit as it was reported as such in 2011, as the article I linked pointed out. Also, your article confirms this. So saying he exaggerated things is not true.

Simple, his 3.6 billion deficit figure comes from the actual structural deficit inherited from the previous administration + budgets requested by agencies. In other words, it was a projected potential shortfall for Walker's own term not the actual inherited deficit from the prior administration. I don't know of a single person who describes unapproved budget requests as a deficit, instead they would say an agency's proposed budget will lead to a deficit. The deficit existed, but it was a billion dollars smaller than Walker claims (the state equivalent of the CBO put it at 2.5 billion). Meanwhile, as the article points out, Wisconsin is expected to run a deficit of of 1.8 billion for the upcoming period by that same agency.

Walker is now against "education" (ha) because he cut funding to the university system. The same system they found had a $1 Billion slush fund they weren't disclosing while raising tuition. So he cut their funding, and every article that writes on this subject that fails to disclose the slush fund, well, makes it easy that they are pushing talking points. Rather than spend any of that slush fund, the University system has threatened to close schools, lay off teachers, etc. But nobody calls them out for being "against" education.

I was unaware of this "slush fund" so, doing some research I found a more recent article from the same publication you site addressing this issue:

Of the $973 million, about $798 million is set aside for particular expenses — kind of like a family setting aside money to pay for a car or build up a college fund.

Of the remaining $175 million, $111 million is available for emergency use — like a family replacing a furnace or dealing with damage from a storm. The remaining $64 million is available for chancellors to use at their discretion, less than half what it was in 2012.

Not quite the slush fund that was earlier claimed.

Edit - incorrect reference to article date

 

[Daemongar]

Not quite the slush fund that was earlier claimed.

Look at the dates. Your article is 9 months older, and the UW's systems explanation was debunked.

 

[Harg Harfardarssen]

Look at the dates. Your article is 9 months older, and the UW's systems explanation was debunked.

I spazzed on the date, you are right, my apologies. However, the argument still stands. The editorial/opinion piece you cited mentions the reserve fund only in passing, as it is focused on a different issue. It does nothing to refute the breakdown I cited, as it is not interested in that dimension of UW funding. UW accounted for the reserve fund and it was nowhere near being a "slush" fund that could be dipped into.

 

[J1M]

WTB moderator to split this Scott Walker bullshit into a new thread titled "Viking Economics".

 

[Daemongar]

Sorry man, just to get it back on track:

They can solve this. Release a game with the audio optional. That is, here is your game - it's $30 for just the text on the screen, $50 for your text read to you (except for Oblivion, the prices would be reversed for that game.) Let people vote with their dollars. i'd bet it would be a small minority willing to pay the extra.

 

[pippin]

That is, here is your game - it's $30 for just the text on the screen, $50 for your text read to you (except for Oblivion, the prices would be reversed for that game.) Let people vote with their dollars. i'd bet it would be a small minority willing to pay the extra.

Considering people are willing to spend more on kickstarter tiers, dlc bundles, deluxe editions and whatnot, I wouldn' be so sure.

 

[Daemongar]

Considering people are willing to spend more on kickstarter tiers, dlc bundles, deluxe editions and whatnot, I wouldn' be so sure.

Wouldn't be a bad comrpomise. Voice actors get paid nothing, but get 50% of revenue from voice DLC or something. Then those of us who don't care, well, we don't get burdened paying too much for a game. Those who worry about inequity and the working class, well they can buy 5 copies of the voice download. Nobody would stop them.

 

[CrazyDiamond]

Some of the points these people raise actually have merit, specially the health issues. But the performance bonus is straight up bullshit, why do these pseudo-celebrities have such a big ego? It's not whether or not they deserve it; voice actors in games too story driven certainly do deserve it, but they're in no way priority for those considering the industry they work in.

But more importantly: why are people so obsessed with putting a -gate in the name of every minor controversy that shows up on internet? Are people still this obsessed with Watergate, or did this turn into some kind of meme?

 

[Clockwork Knight]

Having to hire nobodies would probably improve the quality of voice acting in your average AAA game.

Don't think so, doing VA is not as simple as it sounds (lol just read the lines nigga). Which is why you see otherwise decent actors doing a shit job, like the known Bethesda examples and Dinklage (the dwarf guy from GoT), who voiced the robot buddy in Destiny for a while and now Nolan North is in his place (they blamed a schedule conflict but they aren't fooling anyone since North re-recorded everything from the beginning)

 

[Harg Harfardarssen]

But more importantly: why are people so obsessed with putting a -gate in the name of every minor controversy that shows up on internet? Are people still this obsessed with Watergate, or did this turn into some kind of meme?

 

[CrazyDiamond]

Yeah that would be the logical conclusion.

I also found this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_scandals_with_"-gate"_suffix
It's worse than I thought.

 

[Hirato]

Yeah that would be the logical conclusion.

I also found this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_scandals_with_"-gate"_suffix
It's worse than I thought.

Most curious.
I don't see the previous "professional gaming journalist" scandal, aka doritosgate.

 

[Trotsky]

Petite Bourgeois communists bitching and moaning about video games is possibly one of the funniest things the internet has produced so far.

Better than flag saluting codex cuckservatives prattling on about the "free market" like corporate sheep.

 

[zlocish]

Well, I'm waiting for some third-worlders to come and "take their jobs" now.

 

[Unkillable Cat]

Well, I'm waiting for some third-worlders to come and "take their jobs" now.

Cue "They took our jobs" sketch from South Park with a new dub done by Pakis.

 

[Hobo Elf]

This strike will never take off since they are demanding that companies can't use in-house "VAs" (devs, friends and families) because of how frequent it is for some companies to do so. Blizzard being one of the most famous companies with Metzen doing the voices for everyone who Cam Clarke doesn't voice. Also imagine the agony they'd be putting on smaller studios / indie studios who can't afford professional voice actors. As has been stated before, there are legit points there like the health risks, David Hayter has probably permanently fucked up his voice because of Solid Snake, but then they drown the good points with retardo shit that only serves to antagonize the people they should be trying to appeal to.