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Warcraft III: Reforged - now with lowest user metacritic score of all time

Discussion in 'Strategy and Simulation' started by Dawkinsfan69, Nov 2, 2018.

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  1. deuxhero Arcane

    deuxhero
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    A last chance they'll blow, but when they blow it everyone that isn't a totaly shill won't care about what they do.
     
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  2. The Brazilian Slaughter Arcane

    The Brazilian Slaughter
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    Does anybody even care about Blizzard anymore? They squandered all the good will they had a while now.

    I remember talking about it with my cousin in the early 2000s. To us, Blizzard delivered perfect games with incredible production value and could do no wrong.

    Today: pfffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff.

    Its just another brand name now.
     
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  3. Preben Arbiter

    Preben
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    No.
     
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  4. Great Deceiver Arcane

    Great Deceiver
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    I haven't cared for Blizzard since WotLK came out, 13 years ago. Even then, it was already a shit company, nothing compared to their halcyon days.

    Now it's just another faceless, corporate hamster mill churning out serial shit, no different from EA. Corporate overlords are just like the mafia - they milk their shell businesses dry and then discard the lifeless, empty husks before moving on to the next thing. Blizzard has already been bled dry of all talent, profitability will follow eventually.
     
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  5. Jaedar Arcane Patron

    Jaedar
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    Yeah. I really liked Wings of Liberty, and I think all of sc2 is pretty great, but it's also clear that blizzard will probably never make another RTS. And they haven't really done anything new since (somewhat generously) warcraft3, since then it's all been retreads or copies of other popular genres. It's taken an admirably long time tbh, but it seems they really are just a walking husk at this point.
     
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  6. Storyfag Perfidious Pole Patron

    Storyfag
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    :prosper:
     
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  7. Preben Arbiter

    Preben
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    Wings of Liberty was hilarious in how bad the story was. Imagine journalists asking uncomfortable questions to an actual dictator. Protip: they would never, all medias would spew out propaganda 24/7.
     
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  8. Jaedar Arcane Patron

    Jaedar
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    Yes. It was absolutely awful. But the gameplay was super good. I revisited starcraft and warcraft 3 last year however and I have to say that while they were clearly better, they're not exactly great stories either. I don't think blizzard writing holds up in general (I have not revisited anything earlier than starcraft though or D2, so ymmv).
     
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  9. Preben Arbiter

    Preben
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    SC1 original storyline was pretty good. It went downhill with Brood Wars.
     
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  10. Storyfag Perfidious Pole Patron

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    Eh, Brood War gave us UED, for the betterment of Mankind. I'm willing to forgive them the low points of the story.
     
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  11. Preben Arbiter

    Preben
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    UED arc was extremely stupid. They appeared out of nowhere like some sort of Deus Ex Machina without any hint or foreshadowing. For some reason they used (almost) the same technology as their wayward bumpkin colonies despite decades of separation. Finally, they conveniently disappeared and never bothered anyone anymore. If they were watching the Koprulu colonies so closely, shouldn't they react in some way to the fact that they were attacked by a race of Ctulhus from another dimension?
     
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  12. Olinser Savant

    Olinser
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    Blizzard is gone, and has been for a long time. Literally everything that made them one of the best game developers ever is gone.

    It's Activision Blizzard now.
     
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  13. Average Manatee Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    Average Manatee
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    According to the timeline it was hundreds of years since the separation between the Terran colonization force and the UED, along with the fact that much of the Terran tech and units are described as improvised, so yeah that's a big problem. But the UED not returning is probably because of the travel time, it'd take decades for a new force to arrive and the entire SC1/2 timeline has to be squished into like 5 years because Blizzard wants to keep all the same characters around looking and acting pretty much the same.

    The UED is in kind of an odd place though. The Terrans were just a small colonization sent out made up of convicts (ala Australia) 250 years ago with no further support. And despite this not-Australia being constantly dividing and in civil war with itself it manages to stand up to the fully powerful zerg and protoss forces. You'd expect the united force of earth and its normal colonies (not the one-off convict colonization mission involving a few thousand people sent across the galaxy basically done as a vault-tec level prank/social experiment) to be monstrously powerful and be able to roll in and swat the protoss and zerg like a fly. Granted they already almost did that with the UED fleet (and were doing it until basically everyone decided to help Kerrigan), but there's no indication that they couldn't be sending a much bigger one next.

    It's also kind of funny that the Protoss and Zerg are just contained within a small sector of space while as far as we know the UED is the actual galaxy-spanning civilization that could be fighting any number of other races completely unmentioned in Starcraft.
     
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  14. Storyfag Perfidious Pole Patron

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    As far as the tech is concerned, real life reason is budget cuts at Blizzard. The UED were originally intended to be a full fourth faction. The in-universe explanation, clunky though it is, is that the a signicifant portion of the UEDs forces were actually enthusiastically allied anti-Dominion insurgent forces a'la Duran's militia, or press-ganged former Dominion forces a'la the garrison of the Dylarian shipyards. Further, a large portion of the UEDs naval presence were battlecruisers captured in the same shipyards. All local tech.

    As for sending a second fleet, yeah, time. The original fleet personnel had to use cryo-sleep to get to Koprulu.
     
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  15. Jaedar Arcane Patron

    Jaedar
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    I don't really but the travel time argument. The zerg only become known to humanity with the events of SC1 afaik, and the UED's mission in the korprulu sector is mostly to nip that threat in the bud. And the timeskip between sc1 and bw is really short. And yeah, UED not showing up at any point in sc2 is pretty weird too, but if you are expecting canonical consistency from blizzard you're never going to avoid disappointment.
     
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  16. Preben Arbiter

    Preben
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    In one dialogue Mengsk claims to have seen some Zerg a year before the events of the first campaign, which may or may not be a lie. However, humans in Koprulu became aware of a massive invasion only at the time of the original Terran campaign. This rules out a long delay between the UED sending their fleet and its arrival in the sector. At best, the "long cold sleep" mentioned by the adjutant in the first briefing in the Brood War Terran campaign was no longer than a few months.
     
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  17. trais Arcane Patron

    trais
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    Zerg main objetive was Protoss' homeworld, not Koprulu sector. Humans only became a side project for Overmind because of Ghost project and them starting to dabble into psi tech. And not even important side project, because once Overmind stumbled upon knowledge of Auir's location, it immediately moved most of his race to capture it, leaving zergified Kerrigan behind.
    So while, Terrans and Zerg definitely had made contact before the timeline of the game, Zerg had no interest in wiping Terrans out, because they were focused on Protoss and didn't really care.

    As of UED, the in game explanation why they have the same units was that UED acted like conquistadors in South America - they were but a small initial force which allowed them to exploit local divisions and assume leadership, but brunt of actual fighting was done by locals (rebels) vs locals (Dominion).
     
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  18. trais Arcane Patron

    trais
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    Overall, Starcraft's writing was genius, not because the story itself was a particularly great work of art, but because it was consistently compelling enough to hold your interest throughout all of its campaigns, managed to avoid major plot holes, and was flexible enough to explain away in plausible fashion what would be otherwise unusual matchups, like ZvZ or PvP. So it fulfills all of its requirements and does so in relatively good fashion.

    As a novel, it would be "meh" at best, but as a game script it's absolutely brilliant.
     
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  19. Nahel Arcane

    Nahel
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    Agreed. Same with WC3 which just worked and had a fun antagonist and fall from grace story.

    Now WoW current lore and SC2 show the state of blizzard. But this decline is kind of general. No more creativity, just michael bay shit
     
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  20. [UCHIHA]XxDarkSasuke420xX Prospernaut Shitposter

    [UCHIHA]XxDarkSasuke420xX
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    Blizzard bad
    giv brofist
     
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  21. Average Manatee Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    Average Manatee
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    Aiur is in the Koprulu sector according to the wiki. It's weird but according to lore basically the entire strength of the Protoss and Zerg race is contained in a relatively small section of the galaxy fighting a small fringe element of humanity on the other side of the galaxy from Earth. At least according to lore the high protoss were always around Aiur and the majority of the Zerg swarm were concentrated to invade Aiur. At most the forces of Protoss and Zerg significantly outside the Koprulu sector amount to some Dark Templar and some scattered Cerebrates who broke free from the Overmind.

    According to the timeline the Confederacy knew of the Zerg 14 years before the events of SC1. The UED is mentioned as having monitored the situation in the sector from the start of the colonization. It's possible they had spies or collaborators in the Confederacy.

    Months wouldn't really make sense in the lore since if the UED could get to Koprulu in months then all the planets in the sector would be reachable from one another in a matter of hours, and this would be at odds with how major invasions are described as requiring time and planning to coordinate. If everyone could just zip around from place to place within a day then a lot of stuff doesn't make much sense.
     
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  22. trais Arcane Patron

    trais
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    It very well might be, but that just indicate that Koprulu Sector is a rather huge swath of space, if Zerg weren't able to find Auir despied looking for it for how long exactly? Millenia? But it also in no way contradicts the fact that Overmind wasn't interested in expansion in Koprulu for the sake of expansion itself, but rather singularly focused on planting its spiky butt on Aiur. Because Xel'naga or something, something.

    I can also buy that Humanity as a whole is way bigger and more powerful than Protoss and Zerg combined. After all, Khalai Protoss are the old, stagnant isolationist empire with no natural rivals to challenge them and spur them into action. Other than the Zerg of course, but they managed to keep them in check up until events of the game. Or at least they were convinced they were keeping them in check. E.g. Those walls of text between missions in Terran SC campaign, were describing how protoss fleet was cruising around Terran colonies, glassing every planet that got infested with the Zerg. Which could explain why Zerg wasn't overrunning the whole sector either, with possibility of Overmind simply wanting to keep Zerg real strength and numbers as a surprise.
    And with Protoss being high tech race with advanced AI and robotic constructs doing any heavy lifting for them, I can see how they might had, at some point in the past, decided not to bother anymore with all this "colonizing other planets" nonsense, which Terrans are so universally fond of.
     
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  23. Average Manatee Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    Average Manatee
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    The Zerg haven't been in the Koprulu sector their entire existence. They originated near the center of the galaxy whereas the Koprulu sector has to be near the edge (since it's 60,000 lightyears from earth). They've been searching a long time and assimilating new races the whole time while searching. I'm not exactly sure what happened in between their original creation and finding Aiur and reading the wiki brings up a lot of bullshit that SC2 rewrote that I'd rather pretend didn't exist.
     
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  24. Jaedar Arcane Patron

    Jaedar
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    Yeah, I got the feeling in the first game that the zerg had been looking for a long time, and weren't from too close (they're inspired by the tyranids after all). In sc2: heart of the swarm they retconned it so that the overmind was a chump and that the zerg basically existed as is on their original homeworld, no tinkering or assimilation needed. Which is very dumb.

    And on the topic of sc1 lore, I got the feeling that the UED invasion fleet actually was a pretty significant part of the UED's total forces and not just a handful of battlecruisers and the schematics for nano-sutures (or whatever it is medics use) and valkyries. And that using local rebels and material was more out of expediency and a desire to limit "important" casualties. I also got the impression that they were at least somewhat concerned the zerg might be or become a threat to them, which kinda limits the size of the directorate to not that big.
     
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  25. Average Manatee Prestigious Gentleman Arcane

    Average Manatee
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    Trying to figure out the UED's strength is hard. Everything suggests they should be massively powerful. They should have colonized a lot and had orders of magnitude more people than the Terrans. They are depicted as wholly united militaristic empire ala Starship Troopers. The know enough about psi-stuff to directly control the overmind and the swarm. You'd expect them to, if not win efficiently, be willing to exhaust massive amounts of forces to overrun the sector and put a stop to any eventual threat.

    On the other hand, as far as I can tell it's not actually stated anywhere that the UED is anything other than Earth. So... the UED just sat there on Earth for ~250 years since the Terrans started colonizing the whole Koprulu sector, doing nothing?
     
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