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Wasteland Wasteland 3 + Battle of Steeltown and Cult of the Holy Detonation Expansions Thread

DeepOcean

Arcane
Joined
Nov 8, 2012
Messages
7,215
is all the zany clown stuff and other stuff is supposed to be amusing, or bizzarre or satirical? or like grimdark twisted? is humor in the game like some american thing?

any time I find more "bizzzzarr" stuff in game I just look at it with sort of stone like expression and my face doesn't even twitch. it's like bethesda stuff. (or outer worlds writing)

just give me more radfrogs to drive over with tractor.
Yes, it is cringey if you expect any kind of post apoc realism with this game but the writing isnt so bad, they are a deranged raider gang high on drugs that that use clown outfits and pretty much kill and rape anything in their path and have some kind of strange cult. Recently on South Sudan civil war there are gangs of deranged people high on drugs killing and raping anything in their path, if eventually they formed a kind of strange cult wouldnt be so unbelievable. If this was Bethesda, we would have 200 year ghouls with cursed egyptian artifacts, trees literally growing on characters heads or a city made only of children right close by from mutants and slavers, or super heroes on the wasteland, it doesnt get to that level of shit.
 

Roguey

Codex Staff
Sawyerite
Joined
May 29, 2010
Messages
31,475
is all the zany clown stuff and other stuff is supposed to be amusing, or bizzarre or satirical? or like grimdark twisted? is humor in the game like some american thing?

any time I find more "bizzzzarr" stuff in game I just look at it with sort of stone like expression and my face doesn't even twitch. it's like bethesda stuff. (or outer worlds writing)

just give me more radfrogs to drive over with tractor.

Fargo's obsessed with clowns for some reason. I think it may have something to do with trolling Avellone.
 

agris

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Apr 16, 2004
Messages
5,478
Roguey as someone who updates his blackisles.txt regularly... why do you say that?
 

agris

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Apr 16, 2004
Messages
5,478
I sincerely hope that you, to pull those links, went to your “Brian Fargo - Clown Tweets (Avellone)” bookmarks folder.
 

680x0

Learned
Joined
Dec 27, 2019
Messages
108
I thought "dumbfuck" was a capricious and arbitrary title at first. I now realize it is a serious pathological condition.
 

Ventidius

Savant
Joined
Jul 8, 2017
Messages
547
Got this with the 1$ game pass, and just finished the Faran Brygo quest. I'm pleasantly surprised so far, this actually seems like it could shape up to be a pretty good game. Definitely seems like an improvement over the rather bland WL2. I might even end up buying it down the line, depending on how well it keeps up the level of quality.
 

Takamori

Learned
Joined
Apr 17, 2020
Messages
466
Hope the future expansion be more daring with the OST. The few parts where you had OST it done the game justice.
 

Shadenuat

Arcane
Joined
Dec 9, 2011
Messages
11,605
Location
Russia
sneak through level
hard scripted NPC down the level ignoring dialogue check attacking: "So it was YOU who shot the whole place!"

i really appreciate that you can potentially make even char without any weapons useful in combat (say mechanics + weird science + 3 leadership dip).
i don't appreciate team initiative and that all combat encounters are fundamentally broken due to them. it's more or less same as DOS2: the tools to make things fun are there, but since game is biased/broken towards single approach (for dos it was breaking shields), it's all a waste.

also the difference in enemy hp between difficulties is also dos2 style. and yet, you can land crits that one-shot them. whole system is so skewed towards offence no wonder it all feels wrong.
 
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Shadenuat

Arcane
Joined
Dec 9, 2011
Messages
11,605
Location
Russia
Why does game spoonfeed you things like searching for Patriarch past? even though it doesnt paint him in negative light upfront, it's so boring to getthis stuff through radio as compared to some proactive stuff from player like in Deus Ex 1

anyway, continuing to be gut rpg boi who plays games for 100 hours before giving revio and then they tell me you played 100 hours so you like game even though it's not good etc.

the combat, I am already quite disappointed. the story, eh, at this point, I honestly prefer banal fantasy with elves and dwarves over any hurr amerikwa shit.
if you have powerful writing team you can do amerikwa shit alright (New Vegas), but I don't feel here it's the case.

tbh, being "old" I find i am only interested in rpg if

a) it's in a very unique setting and premise, unseen by western rpg player before, which breaks the standard roleplaying stereotypes (hence Atelier jrpg - larping alchemist girl who just tries to pay the bills is more interesting than any world saving)

b) it does rpg something to an extremely high level even if sacrificing everything else. (super character development but no balance: pkm; super character building you can play in char editor without even game itself: path of exile; actual good writing that feels made by mature people who understand how humans behave and empathy: KCD)

c) it at least has some decent waifus.

wasteland, so far, seems to have none of

02.jpg


oh ok.





some extra serious stuff. There is quite a list of features W3 has which probably costed them a penny, yet some things are horribly underdeveloped.
the tractor map is fun for first 20 minutes, until you realise map is not developed in particular and seems smaller than W2. it's pretty, but looks like more material for loading screens. (there is no survival elements akin to Expeditions series)
game has voice acting, yet it has no proper sorting in unventory by say item level
scotchmo has retarded special effect yet i wouldn't call grafix very eye catching by itself compared to something older/pre-rendered.
also muh combat log?? what, can't read it from your plasma TV screen?
muh enemy info?
info on status effects?? (bar time when you're suffering them and can hover over icon)
simultaneous movement for enemies is great though (although jrpgs/wargames still do it better by just allowing you skip animations)

I feel the heavy hand of console design honestly.

I hope they fix the initiative and XP balance in super duper, ultimate, complete, no more Enhanced Editions, edition, because rote missile launcher sneak attacking - the game is just killing me same way DOS2 shields & level scaled loot killed game for me.

btw, you know how to fix lack of weapons of particular levels? don't fucking break weapons into MMO tiers to begin with, fuck. skills already give you boni&perks with them why u need levels i donteven
 
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Daedalos

Arcane
Joined
Apr 18, 2007
Messages
5,168
Location
Denmark
Why does game spoonfeed you things like searching for Patriarch past? even though it doesnt paint him in negative light upfront, it's so boring to getthis stuff through radio as compared to some proactive stuff from player like in Deus Ex 1

anyway, continuing to be gut rpg boi who plays games for 100 hours before giving revio and then they tell me you played 100 hours so you like game even though it's not good etc.

the combat, I am already quite disappointed. the story, eh, at this point, I honestly prefer banal fantasy with elves and dwarves over any hurr amerikwa shit.
if you have powerful writing team you can do amerikwa shit alright (New Vegas), but I don't feel here it's the case.

tbh, being "old" I find i am only interested in rpg if

a) it's in a very unique setting and premise, unseen by western rpg player before, which breaks the standard roleplaying stereotypes (hence Atelier jrpg - larping alchemist girl who just tries to pay the bills is more interesting than any world saving)

b) it does rpg something to an extremely high level even if sacrificing everything else. (super character development but no balance: pkm; super character building you can play in char editor without even game itself: path of exile; actual good writing that feels made by mature people who understand how humans behave and empathy: KCD)

c) it at least has some decent waifus.

wasteland, so far, seems to have none of

02.jpg


oh ok.





some extra serious stuff. There is quite a list of features W3 has which probably costed them a penny, yet some things are horribly underdeveloped.
the tractor map is fun for first 20 minutes, until you realise map is not developed in particular and seems smaller than W2. it's pretty, but looks like more material for loading screens. (there is no survival elements akin to Expeditions series)
game has voice acting, yet it has no proper sorting in unventory by say item level
scotchmo has retarded special effect yet i wouldn't call grafix very eye catching by itself compared to something older/pre-rendered.

I feel the heavy hand of console design honestly.

I hope they fix the initiative and XP balance in super duper, ultimate, complete, no more Enhanced Editions, edition, because rote missile launcher sneak attacking - the game is just killing me same way DOS2 shields & level scaled loot killed game for me.

btw, you know how to fix lack of weapons of particular levels? don't fucking break weapons into MMO tiers to begin with, fuck.

Good observations, absolutely jarring about an otherwise fun game.
 

Falksi

Arcane
Joined
Feb 14, 2017
Messages
8,784
Location
Nottingham
They need to tune down the number of skill points per level or reduce XP gain in half. You can pretty much max out three skills per character with books by level 14 and that way before capturing Valor.

What you reckon are the chances of that happening in a patch?
 

GloomFrost

Cipher
Joined
Dec 9, 2014
Messages
805
Location
Northern wastes

Shadenuat

Arcane
Joined
Dec 9, 2011
Messages
11,605
Location
Russia
jailed first kiddo

first main quest location is definitely better designed than all starting locations and all side quests and left positive impression on me. the only weakness is that americans believe that amerika klyukva is interesting to everyone - it isn't; but then Wasteland always was amerikan klyukva amiwrong?

the techpriestess platonic love to robot was somewhat cute, sadly, she was insane. the noble savages also, were insane. so i shot everyone on the map so far, only cute communist robots might survive. but, it's 3 factions crammed inside one map with various things so good locations, I approve this.

fighting out of crazy reagan temple was entertaining, and it was super, super cool that you get radio signal about enemy presense and when going outside I even got control over my car. it, however, increased amount of enemy shooting through walls, and also showed what I feel is a big flaw for melee characters in this game: you cannot climb. even elevation that looks like it could easily be climbed you need to spend ap to go around it. this problem was solved entirely by Nu-Xcom which has massively more powerful map geometry in comparison. W3 just tries putting ladders at some places but it's not the same as systemically traversable terrain.

all good things were slightly reduced in goodness due to me being horribly overleveled even though I didn't even finish some side quests (one bugged out) and didn't explore rest of the map so far, as my charcs have 10 points in skills that matter (like cowgirl now a grandmaster of repairing toasters and can make team toasts) already.

btw what made devs put that "events are all fictional" in beginning of gaem? is it cause bad patriarch not totaly bad, good daughater not good, and local savages are savage murderers? or is it because of honkhonks?? i dont get it
 
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DeepOcean

Arcane
Joined
Nov 8, 2012
Messages
7,215
They need to tune down the number of skill points per level or reduce XP gain in half. You can pretty much max out three skills per character with books by level 14 and that way before capturing Valor.

What you reckon are the chances of that happening in a patch?
Reducing XP gain in theory is just messing with variables, it isnt hard to do it but the problem is that I think the random encounters have some level of level scaling and the game assumes you are at level 17 minimum by the time you deal with two of the major missions as there is a huge gap between capturing Valor: level 9 quest and dealing with the other two Patriarch sons that are Level 17 and 19, so, if you are a casual normie speedrunning on normal, you might end underleveled on end game content if you cut xp gain too much but I was level 15 by the time I started Valor's quest with the Gippers, that is way too much. I think a 20-30% xp gain cut would be nice.

An alternative is to make skill investment more expensive or you receiving less skill points per level. There is something wrong when you are still on the first 1/3 of the game and look to doors with level 8 lockpicking stat checks (Maximum 10 levels of skill in the game) and just look at it as free xp of how easy it is to get skill points.
 

Saduj

Arcane
Joined
Aug 26, 2012
Messages
2,198
"the only weakness is that americans believe that amerika klyukva is interesting to everyone - it isn't; but then Wasteland always was amerikan klyukva amiwrong?"

Honestly with the alternate spelling I don't even know exactly what you're trying to say but the main decision the game is asking you to make is to choose between siding with a dictator who makes brutal choices but is a net positive on the whole (and who will personally help you and yours in return) or sticking to high ideals above all other concerns with the chance that it ends in disaster. I would think many people could find the choice interesting enough for a video game plot regardless of the setting. If the game were really sticking tight to American mythology, the latter choice would be portrayed as the unquestionable pure and good option. But the game doesn't do that at all.

I get that all the window dressing is American and presented in an intentionally over the top way, which may annoy some people, but if there are people alive today who have faced the choice the game presents, they weren't living in America at the time.

Edit: Shadenuat - Didn't mean to quote you without alerting you....
 

LJ40

Arbiter
Joined
Jul 16, 2014
Messages
450
Location
Wizardry/Ultima/Goldbox
All questions of who is right and wrong aside,

Angela asking me how I could possibly gun down innocent people after chasing her across Colorado Springs because she was gunning down innocent people was fucking hilarious.

Seriously, what an utter cunt she started as ended up.

Edit - Also, probably already known but if you're clearing out the Godfishers for the Reaganites, be careful not to anger the East and West Ruins during the same fight. I only got credit for clearing the East ruins and the mission was unfinishable.
 
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Infinitron

I post news
Patron
Staff member
Joined
Jan 28, 2011
Messages
91,210
RPG Wokedex Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Kingmaker
FYI, Game Pass price going up to $10 on the 17th. If you planned to use it and haven't yet, you might want to subscribe before then so you get to play a full month for $5.
 

Shadenuat

Arcane
Joined
Dec 9, 2011
Messages
11,605
Location
Russia
main decision the game is asking you to make is to choose between siding with a dictator who makes brutal choices but is a net positive on the whole (and who will personally help you and yours in return) or sticking to high ideals above all other concerns with the chance that it ends in disaster. I would think many people could find the choice interesting enough for a video game plot regardless of the setting
Not really, it has been done to death, like in Tyranny, New Vegas and many quests in RPGs. Well, "done" would be a strong word for this - Tyranny for all its name was some crazy superhero road to freedum, for example. Had to release separate patch/dlc to allow to actually join, well, Tyrant.

Also, Patriarch at this point is not a dictator, not really, and there aren't any problems of dictatorship I can see. If anything, he is a Monarch, with a common problem of gavelkind not working him any favours. In this premise idea of a family conflict is a correct one (although I wouldn't call it genre specific or "postapoc", or dealing with nature of postapoc in particular), but the problem is, for a world of postapoc, a ruler like Patriarch who can unite and hold something in an iron glove is an ideal, and judging by what he has, it is indeed so - there is a relatively prosperous city with giant greenhouses and working, even if caricaturely cruel, police force; and well there were some bandits and cartels but you deal with this pretty much in the beginning of the game. Without a "secret" prison with "political prisoner" which is so secret, your crazy old psycho Deth knows it and feeds it to you, you wouldn't probably see anything bad about said "dictatorship" except obligatory teenager evictions for old crazy cat ladies.

And since Patriarch is, well, so good, especially when multiplied by setting of postapoc and crazy honkers, there is no conflict; and since there is no conflict, there is no fun.

We have little investment into all of this from your own party either - it is pregenned afterall, and you're a new face in town, well except Wesson girl I guess; or mechanical stakes - is there anything you can truly lose during choices, is there something that can kick the shit out of the player and make them uneasy, is there at least a good old timer that counts down until you stop dicking around highlighted green quests and do what Monarch asks of you? Doesn't look like it to me. You say Patriarch is the only one who can give what Rangers need? I mean, k, make it so. Make it that if he loses faith in you, you lose access to equivalent of Gun Runners and BOS in F1 both. Then taking some other path and surviving would be really challenging and possible story more rewarding.

Of course, that's all storyfaggotry. Someone will find selecting from a list of choices at the end of the mission fun. And I don't expect developers to make realistic dictatorship simulators, especially western ones, as we write things based on what is around us. Neither it is super important for a combat party game. Although crazy computer counting your every choice was pretty nice.

It's gameplay where it's all at. And I barely began the game and am already overleveled and stomp everything. And that's just bad. And AI is so kind to carefully maneuvre itself to get shot en masse by railgun.

I get that all the window dressing is American and presented in an intentionally over the top way, which may annoy some people
It's not annoying because it's american but because at this point, it's just overdone. Somewhere since Bethesda raped Fallout or so with its let's hunt down pres Lincoln's hat or whatever. And the font at some parts of the game reminds me of Bioshock. And designers made their own Fallout-style robot mascots. Like Outer Worlds also did.

It also makes game world feel not like a world, but like a carnival where you get fed tickets to another show, run by freaks, made by designers who tried to outdo each other in how retarded their NPCs could get. I may overreact to this though due to how beginning of the game is generally structured.

I feel like this game does a untraditional thing of making main quests better than side quests.

Dammit why is weapon range on little revolver is same as on big ass automatic pistol? I hate sawyerism :M
 
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