gurugeorge
Arcane
Wow. Nobody likes Warlock...
What even is a Warlock?
Wow. Nobody likes Warlock...
Perpetual state of armed conflict.Wow. Nobody likes Warlock...
What even is a Warlock?
Wow. Nobody likes Warlock...
When it comes to classes my memory always trails back to Final Fantasy 11. I loved the Red Mage class, a decent offensive caster, nasty debuffer and can handle a sword in a pinch. I liked to sublass that with either Warrior or Samurai to boost my melee and defensive capabilities. So, Red Mage/Samurai was awesome, or Red Mage/Warrior, or even Samurai/Red Mage, but I liked to keep the Red Mage at the forefront mostly. Had a lot of fun with that character, good memories.
>standard fantasy class
>red mage
Bro, even in JRPGs that is a niche class. The first FF had it yes, but only like half off the mainline games after that.
For those with less eastern affinities, the Red Mage is a fighter/cleric/wizard all rolled into one class, but awfull at all off the above. Jack of all trades, master of none. Sometimes however he also gets really busted abilities like doublecast (2 spells per turn) added to his class. So red mages are usually either the worst or the best class in the game, which is a very odd spot for a jack of all trades type character.
They always have this red fencer aesthetic:
Don't know, but you should ask him since he is one:What even is a Warlock?Wow. Nobody likes Warlock...
I'm pretty sure the red mage class has existed in every single Final Fantasy that featured a version of the job system (FF's class system). Even the ones that don't feature job systems usually have Red Mage style characters. In FF6 for instance, (aside from the fact that you can make almost everyone into a red mage later on when the Esper system rolls around) both Terra and Celes are basically red mages.>standard fantasy class
>red mage
Bro, even in JRPGs that is a niche class. The first FF had it yes, but only like half of the mainline games after that.
For those with less eastern affinities, the Red Mage is a fighter/cleric/wizard all rolled into one class, but awfull at all of the above. Jack of all trades, master of none. Sometimes however he also gets really busted abilities like doublecast (2 spells per turn) added to his class. So red mages are usually either the worst or the best class in the game, which is a very odd spot for a jack of all trades type character.
I'm pretty sure the red mage class has existed in every single Final Fantasy that featured a version of the job system (FF's class system). Even the ones that don't feature job systems usually have Red Mage style characters. In FF6 for instance, (aside from the fact that you can make almost everyone into a red mage later on when the Esper system rolls around) both Terra and Celes are basically red mages.
But to me paladin is still the knight exemplar of chivalric virtues, not just anyone who acts as church's armed hand.
The Complete Paladin's Handbook is very much inline with this. IIRC, there's no requirement for you to even worship the deity that you serve implying that paladins have an inverse relationship with their deity as clerics do. That is, a paladin is so virtuous and righteous that a deity would choose them to represent their ideals in the mortal world.But to me paladin is still the knight exemplar of chivalric virtues, not just anyone who acts as church's armed hand.
if it's not lawful good it's not a paladin
My apologies if this is considered derailing the thread, but I'd like to explain why I do not mind Paladins that are not 'lawful-good'.
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Although Gary Gygax opposed the creation of paladin-equivalents for other alignments, ideas for such were already for being proposed in 1980 and even became an official part of (non-advanced) Dungeons & Dragons:The whole aligment system is based on absolutes.
For a compass to work there can be no different opinions on where is the North.
And in a world with relativisitic morality (which is objectively more realistic) where good and evil are "open to
interpretation" the alightment restrictions stop meaning shit, and you can call any murderhobo doing a god's work a paladin. And this is what we can see with alightment loosing it's importance in each new edition, and emergence of non LG paladins. But to me paladin is still the knight exemplar of chivalric virtues, not just anyone who acts as church's armed hand.
Think Gary failed to see the utility of anti-paladin as antagonist in stories, which was huge! Not as player classes (every evil party had one, but evil parties were rare) but for the most part as the ultimate bad guy - the guy the players aspire to kill, including the paladin in every pnp party.Although Gary Gygax opposed the creation of paladin-equivalents for other alignments, ideas for such were already for being proposed in 1980 and even became an official part of (non-advanced) Dungeons & Dragons:
BG2's keeps were boring chores that didn't even fit into the story of the game (but then again nothing does in BG2, it's all just a carnival funhouse of side quests). Icewind Dale is the IE game that bothered to implement actual class reactivity outside of the artificial "side quest for every class".Say what you want about BG2, it was probably the only game to try to integrate each class uniquely into the world, with keeps and such.
They worked into the story fine, and were engaging. They added a dimension to the game. Fitting into the story of the game doesn't make a heap of sense. The whole thing should be about finding Imoen and defeating Irenecus? Sounds rather unpleasant, and ignores the staggering amount of xps/side adventures required to level up in traditional AD&D. Also AD&D chars in the traditional sense (little known fact) at 9th or so level would be expected to construct a keep and have henchmen. Keeps fit in perfectly, and was a nice touch. Added something that few other games added to high level adventuring.BG2's keeps were boring chores that didn't even fit into the story of the game (but then again nothing does in BG2, it's all just a carnival funhouse of side quests).Say what you want about BG2, it was probably the only game to try to integrate each class uniquely into the world, with keeps and such.
Not for every class. I remember Paladin's and Druids having some unique options, that's about it. IWD was a great atmospheric game, but class options and c&c are not among it's highlights.Icewind Dale is the IE game that bothered to implement actual class reactivity outside of the artificial "side quest for every class".
Warlock exists exclusively due to D&D mechanics and this is general fantasy question. Learned magic vs. magic you're born with is established fantasy convention. All Warlock does is a very specific mechanical feature of weaker, but unlimited, spells.Wow. Nobody likes Warlock...
Considering that Gary Gygax himself in original D&D referred to clerics of chaotic alignment as evil anti-clerics, who cast reversed forms of many spells and lacked the turn undead ability, it's a bit odd he was so adamantly opposed to the concept of an "anti-paladin" even if the paladin archetype is narrower than the cleric archetype. Of course, in the context of AD&D's two-axis, nine-alignment system, evil anti-paladins should really be of lawful evil alignment, allowing them to mirror the paladin with evil replacing good just as with the OD&D anti-cleric, while chaotic versions of the paladin and anti-paladin should differ in other respects.But why call it "anti paladin"? Just call it death knight and give powers completely different than a paladin. Create rules for if the PC LG paladin commits an evil act, he becomes a death knight and the DM is encouraged to make him an NPC. Problem solved.
Yes it is lazy, but it was the naive mid 70s and therefore Gary, Dave and the rest have an excuse for this. But doing it still in the 2k10s like in the recent books releases, like in the Xanathar's Guide to everything with the Samurai Fighter Archetype, it is just lazy. Samurai Archetype like the entire Monk class belongs to to a Rokugan or a Kara-Tur Campaign book.I like the gameplay idea of monks (unarmed specialists), but I hate the way their lore was so obviously slotted in from second-hand influrnces like the Kung-fu tv series and the Bruce Lee craze. Same with the intrusion of samurai-like elements.
Maybe you could have something like the intrusion of Eastern-style lores into D&D, but if so then you have to have the appropriate type of Eastern races who are the only ones who have the knowledge, and you have to go a bit more deeply into authentic Eastern martial arts lore - either that or develop a Western-style monk lore with the extant races (kind of like a Friar Tuck type of deal, with Western monastic style lore rather than Eastern).
It's just jarring to have all that mixed up. Too much cultural appropriation