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Why Pentiment is an RPG and should be on this forum

nimateb

Augur
Joined
Oct 19, 2013
Messages
123
First of all, a brief personal RPG definition.

An RPG must have a narrative. The narrative must be interactive and react to the player's actions.
Also, an RPG must be playable through a customized character that can be altered through the course of the game in ways that affect the narrative and the gameplay.

By these definitions, games like Icewind Dale have customized characters but since the narrative changes very little with the players gameplay, the game's a hybrid (tactical RPG).

Games like Mario Bros have narratives (you must save the princess) but you don't affect it through your gameplay. You can also eat a fungus to change your character but that also doesn't affect the narrative.

Pentiment on the other hand has a narrative. You can play the game with characters that have traits defined by the user through the game. The narrative recognizes this, changing their possible actions and their consecuences accordingly.


So yeah, IMO Pentiment is an RPG and should be on this forum. Shadowbanning it (throwing it into the adventure forum) is unworthy of this site.
 

Zed Duke of Banville

Dungeon Master
Patron
Joined
Oct 3, 2015
Messages
11,756
An RPG must have a narrative.
zdes09.jpg
 

vortex

Fabulous Optimist
Joined
Mar 25, 2016
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4,221
Location
Temple of Alvilmelkedic
But, should Pentiment have classes or classless system to be called an RPG?
Andreas could had been a monk, an outsider investigator, a rogue, an inqusitor ... and depending who he is gameplay and tactics would change.
 

Serus

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Jul 16, 2005
Messages
6,680
Location
Small but great planet of Potatohole
First of all, a brief personal RPG definition.

An RPG must have a narrative. The narrative must be interactive and react to the player's actions
So about 98%* of games we are talking about in rpg discussions are not CRPGs or, at the very least, they do not posses half of the requirements?
You do now that in vast, vast, overwhelming even, majority of crpg there no reactive narrative and in the very few that have it, it is mosty fake? Right?


*number taken from my ass but certainly correct in order of magnitude.
 

ropetight

Scholar
Joined
Dec 9, 2018
Messages
984
Location
Lower Wolffuckery
It is RPG in same way Hannah Gadsby's Nanette is stand up comedy special.
Quest for Glory is more RPG than this Movable Parts Book about medieval Europe for Californians.
More RPGs for you, enjoy.
 
Unwanted

SunKing

He/Him
Patron
Dumbfuck
Joined
Nov 23, 2022
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129
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Codex Year of the Donut
I agree with OP Pentiment should be classified as an rpg. Also it is a masterpiece by the great John Sawyer who is an amazing developer. Of course the trolls that dominate this board will disagree.
 

Zed Duke of Banville

Dungeon Master
Patron
Joined
Oct 3, 2015
Messages
11,756
You can use this list of requirement for a RPG and tell me how many point Pentiment score.

That's official method these days. No need to argue~
That list is heavily biased in favor of not only character-related elements but also extraneous story-related elements ("choice made by the player alters the narrative", "Character(s) interact with NPCs", "Optional quests") versus combat-related and exploration-related aspects.

Better list:
  1. Character Progression (leveling up to become more powerful)
  2. Character Customization (at least classes and attributes, though classes can be replaced by a skill-based system; party customization can substitute)
  3. Equipment (weapon, armor, other things that give active or passive benefits; better equipment makes a character more powerful)
  4. Inventory (items on hand that can be switched with equipment or consumed)
  5. Character-Skill-Based (player chooses character’s action, but success of character’s actions depends on statistics and the game system, not the action of the player)
  6. Deliberation (player has opportunity to consider character’s actions before choosing what to do; in real-time games at least a pause function)
  7. Randomness (dice-rolls or something else to remove determinism)
  8. Statistics (game system is coherent and transparent enough that player can weigh the numbers to gauge the chance of success in an action)
  9. Exploration (player has control over character’s movement through the gamespace and can make meaningful exploration decisions rather than following a linear path)
  10. Dungeons (a mythic underworld to explore; many RPGs have only a dungeon without an overworld, but it is more difficult to be an RPG with an overworld but no dungeons)
  11. Openness (players have control over their characters’ movements and objectives in the world rather than being forced into particular quests)
  12. Logistics (players must manage their characters’ resources, due to inventory limitations, encumbrance, stamina/fatigue, need for food, need for water, need for sleep, realistic lighting and a day/night cycle, Vancian magic memorization, weapon/armor deterioration and repair, etc.)
Which in turn can be grouped into character-related, combat-related, and exploration-related aspects. :M
 

laclongquan

Arcane
Joined
Jan 10, 2007
Messages
1,870,144
Location
Searching for my kidnapped sister
You can use this list of requirement for a RPG and tell me how many point Pentiment score.

That's official method these days. No need to argue~
That list is heavily biased in favor of not only character-related elements but also extraneous story-related elements ("choice made by the player alters the narrative", "Character(s) interact with NPCs", "Optional quests") versus combat-related and exploration-related aspects.
...
Which in turn can be grouped into character-related, combat-related, and exploration-related aspects. :M

Boy, the list say RPG overall, not crpg. Of course it has some bias toward that aspect~ Your list is too focus on non-storyfag aspects~ A game following YOUR list, once it's broken in storyfags aspects, will be total broken without fixing. No mods can fix it. But if it follow said reqs, if it's gone, it's mostly non-storyfags aspects that is broken. In which case, mods can fix it somewhat~

I dont particularly love pure storyfags games, but the list is developed that way simply to prevent broken storyfags game, which is numerous and unfixable~ There's a particular demand.
 

FriendlyMerchant

Guest
An rpg doesn't have to have a narrative. Character customization just isn't enough either. Pentiment is simply a casual adventure game.
 
Joined
Jan 26, 2007
Messages
522
Location
Germoney
Here's a better argument: CD Projekt.

If their catalogue of Glorified Cutscene Simulators gets a pass, why not.
 

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