application of skills; usefulness

[One Wolf]

i'm just about finished playing through (finally) fallout 2, and although i deeply enjoyed the game, it was certainly biased in regards the usefulness of skills. i had a high science and doctor skill, but rarely found myself needing them. doctor for vault city innoculations and training, and science for the skynet bot.

will AoD have a more balanced application for skills like lore and traps? i can certainly see the potential for usage.

and in bloodlines, the only social skill you really needed to get by was persuation, but seduction and whatever the other one was were never necessary for anything to my knowledge, despite being more expensive to gain ranks in than persuation.

 

[Vault Dweller]

Originally the game had a larger skill list, but anything that you couldn't use on a regular basis (for whatever reasons) was removed.

Lore, for example, is a fairly important skill because of the connection to the past, locations that could be understood (vs looted), gadgets that could be operated, and concepts that you must know to "unlock" (for the lack of a better word) dialogue options and a few extra endings. It's not a mandatory skill as you can do fine being a fighter, a thief, etc, in which case you will have a very different understanding of the events and will be motivated by different factors.

Trap is a supporting skill for someone who doesn't appreciate the brutality of close combat. A lot of trap-related activities are done in a text-adventure mode to kind of capture the atmosphere and the occupational hazzards. Usually, you either run through a trap, taking some damage and healing later, which makes traps useless (i.e. they failed to stop someone), or you are instantly dead and that just sucks because you didn't even realize what happened. Text adventure gives you enough time and descriptions to understand what you are up against and try to figure out a way to disarm a trap. Or set one up, custom tailored to a situation (you are given a choice of several traps), etc.

As for the social skills, different skills give you different results and could be used in different ways.

 

[One Wolf]

sounds good. this would ratchet up my anticipation, but at this point i don't see how that's possible. i've been spreading the word about this project amoungst my friends and on some forums, and have generated some pretty serious interest.

if you pull this off, you might find yourself wielding some fairly intense power over the nature of/future of rpgs. perhaps i'm being idealistic, but i can't seem to reason out how this project won't change everything in regards to rpgs.

i'm pretty sure that i already read this somewhere, but how are criticals handled? will it be viable to rely on a high crit skill with lesser ranks in the various weaponry?

how is reloading handled with bows/xbows? will you require a seperate action to reload a bow, or is the reload for each individual arrow already included in the AP for initiating the attack?

 

[Claw]

if you pull this off, you might find yourself wielding some fairly intense power over the nature of/future of rpgs. perhaps i'm being idealistic, but i can't seem to reason out how this project won't change everything in regards to rpgs.

Have you heard of "Ultima VII" or "Fallout"?

So, do RPGs nowadays generally feature a non-linear design, sohphisticated NPC behaviour and shedules, complex dialogue trees, interconnected quests, a variable outro, or merely the superior interface of Ultima VII?


Everyone and their dog claim to be Fallout fans, but most seem to think "setting and atmosphere" sufficiently describes the game's qualities.
In short, you're not idealistic. You're delusional.

 

[Vault Dweller]

i'm pretty sure that i already read this somewhere, but how are criticals handled? will it be viable to rely on a high crit skill with lesser ranks in the various weaponry?

Weapon skills - hit your enemies despite their pathetic attempts to dodge/block your attacks.
Critical skill - chance to add an extra effect (depends on the targeted area) if you hit them.

Critical skill help you kill faster, i.e. you can walk into a room with 3 guards and kill them before they realized what happened. Alternatively, you can rely on good Dodge/Block to survive during a longer fight.

how is reloading handled with bows/xbows? will you require a seperate action to reload a bow, or is the reload for each individual arrow already included in the AP for initiating the attack?

Separate action. Makes crossbow a very handy weapon.

 

[One Wolf]

@vd:

excellent, as i hoped.

@claw:

are you suggesting that there is no hope for future rpgs, and that new press surrounding a game that successfully implements the qualities you mentioned will do nothing to rekindle interest in rpgs of the types you mentioned?

 

[TalesfromtheCrypt]

@vd:

excellent, as i hoped.

@claw:

are you suggesting that there is no hope for future rpgs, and that new press surrounding a game that successfully implements the qualities you mentioned will do nothing to rekindle interest in rpgs of the types you mentioned?

Uh, yes I think thats pretty much what he said. And hes pretty much right. Even high-profile games as Fallout didn't have enough influence to introduce lasting changes for the better to the genre.
As Claw said, Fallout is fairly popular amongst gamers. Many of them may be not even lying about the fact that they played FO, but their are just too stupid to mention anything else then "atmosphere" and "scenario" as the main qualities. And 90 percent are even too stupid to get these aspects right, for example they don't understand the whole retrofuturistic thing or all the references to nuclear war paranoia in America during the red scare etc.

And AoD is not even popular. Its an Indie-RPG developed for a niche market, I think these days more niche then the market for hentai flash-games.
Im hoping for it to be good, so that I have personal enjoyment from playing a proper RPG again. It won't change the mainstream RPG market.

 

[Lumpy]

How about the indie RPG market? It would be possible that other indie devs might take good ideas from AoD.

 

[One Wolf]

Even high-profile games as Fallout didn't have enough influence to introduce lasting changes for the better to the genre.

is that really true? it spawned this site(?) and a few others, and carries significant name recognition to this day. not to mentioned its progeny. rpgcodex certainly changed my views on the genre. i'd never even played a rpg until a friend lent me a copy of bg2 soa and nwn, both of which kinda blew my mind. and in the process of investigating similar games, i came across a link to the codex, and read about older games like fallout/wizardry/ultima. fallout was like nothing i'd ever played, it was just so incredible. there's gotta be others like me out there, just waiting for exposure. i've been pushing these games on friends of mine with little rpg experience, and many have really appreciated them. none so far have failed to understand "retrofuturistic" in the fallouts.

and despite the less than positive trend in "mainstream" rpgs (aka action games with semi-relevant stats), there does seem to be a rising tide in demand for kickback niche rpgs. one fantastic element of the web is that it allows minority and niche members across the globe to unify to a greater or lesser extent. isn't it possible that some are coalescing around the golden days of rpgs?

and despite the disillusioned and pessimistic sentiment that is so pervasive here, you guys must have some hope, or why bother reading up on rpg news and discussion?

edit: just saw this.

As for the future, look at the indies. We now have 3 new indie companies that seem to have a chance and are developing 3 very different and interesting titles. We have the guys who did Ultima 5 - a gigantic fucking effort. I'm willing to bet that what they learned will not be wasted. I'd say that in 3 years the RPG scene will be very different.

 

[Necro]

is there one shot kills

say ur a thief, you sneak into a room with two guard guarding an archway (your behind them) could u slit one's throat and quickly get a jab into the other one before they notice anything?

or will it be like you do a normal attack maybe do double damage as its a sneak attack and then back to normal combat?

also about traps i never bother as it seems such a waste of time to stop, set up a trap, lure enemy tio trap etc.