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Max Payne 3 - Discuss!

Cadmus

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So... Gave MP3 a go.
This is a very shitty Max Payne game, or in fact, not not-a-Max Payne-at-all. I'm having zero fun with gunplay. The story is tripe, filled with forced cutscenes where protagonist fucks up (whereas the same would never happen if the player had control). The story is tripe, the characters, Max included, are shit (yeah, I get it - you drink booze and take pills. STOP FUCKING POINTING IT OUT FFS!).

But there is one interesting thing about this game.

You can kill whomever without any visible consequences. The strippers at the strip club, the favela denizens... Most memorably being the time when BOPE raids the favelas. You can shoot unarmed gang members, wounded gang members, BOPE officers who will never return fire... and an old lady at her home.

There is no "mission failed" or "game over" screen if you do so. Max doesn't give a shit.

In today's gaming environment, that's incline. However small it happens to be, in the case of this POS.

I absolutely don't understand this argument. I think the gunplay was absolutely smooth, responsive, the weapons had a punch to them if I remember correctly, the character movement was fluid, the weapon accuracy was satisfying, with the pistols being kinda old school-ishly precise for the required head-shot delivery. What more would you want? I would consider this an incline, tell me what recent game has a better gunplay.

Did the New York part feel like a Max Payne to you, at least? Or the setting wasn't the problem?

And you could always kill the hobos and bystanders in the previous Max Paynes, it's not an incline if the feature has remained the same throughout the series.

Entire Max Payne series are the best third person shooters I've played.

Yes!
(Enter the Matrix wasn't bad, either.)


I went and watched Hardboiled, finally, to educate myself and now concede the point that Max Payne is far more influenced by that (or whatever Hardboiled is influenced by) than The Matrix.


I don't understand why the loading times were so long in MP3, I didn't mind too much because I'm used to it for some reason =/
And the cutscenes were admittedly retarded at times, it felt like they randomly selected the words from the dialogue, that were displayed and highlighted (or the writers were tripping on something, I can not imagine this would be serious and thus I didn't take it seriously)

The gunplay was merely vanilla console cover shooter, enlivened by "boss battles" against generic, nameless enemies whose sole trait is wearing more armor.

The standard game combat is:
  • Click on door. Engage cutscene.
  • Door locks behind Max.
  • Max gets spotted.
  • Enemy starts shooting.
  • Max ducks behind cover.
  • Enemy ducks behind cover.
  • Control restored to player at last.
  • And then the enemy just sit there, statically exposing body parts for you to target shoot. While occasionally one will lumber slowly towards you, relying on better hp, and hoping that you're using a controller (yeah right) to get to you before you slaughter him.
At that point, you have two choices.
  1. Retreat to the a different row of cover and wait for the enemy to lumber one by one towards you, like lambs to the slaughter
  2. Wait for a long time (on hard) while your bullet meter builds up, engage it, and shoot static exposed body parts. Or, if you can see that there are no spawn points in one direction, you can jump bullet time in that direction instead - but there has to be no spawn areas there or you'll likely end up on the floor in an animation while the new spawns appear on top of you and shoot your defenseless body to death.
Maybe shooting static objects with a controller is more engaging, where it's harder to line up your shot. But as it is, the gunplay is polished, but it's polished generic console shooting against (usually six) generic, static targets in what amounts to the same retextured large closet with the same rows of chest high walls - over and over and over.

Yeah, except for when it didn't go like this. It was not the standard, maybe it happened a little too often but you make it sound like the majority of the shoot outs happened in this manner which is not true.

And sitting behind the cover, waiting for the enemies to come to you was usually the worst thing to do. Plus, often times the covers were destructible and your body parts were sticking out as well.
Maybe the viability of this tactic is dependent on the difficulty you're playing, I don't know but what I did was most of the time get the fuck out of the cover as fast as I could and kept running around, jumping while trying to head-shot everyone.

I specifically remember that fight in the offices with the SWAT-like soldiers later in the game, you started hidden behind a counter but if you tried to pop out and shoot at them, you'd get killed immediately, the best way to solve this fight was to just run and jump and try to hit everyone in the head. Same with the probably hardest fight earlier in the game in the office building of that stupid security company.
 
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Telengard

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For those who need it explicitly spelled out. The gunplay is butter smooth, but it is still vanilla console shooter gunplay. I will grant you that with a controller it might be difficult (I have read that it is one of the hardest games on xbox), but shooting static targets with a mouse is simplicity itself. Hell, since almost all combats occur close range with near-unmoving targets, you can line up headshots from behind cover, pop out, and gun enemies down before they can even fire back accurately.

On Hard, you can jump around with your unlimited jump bullet time, but some Hard enemy attacks one-shot-kill you even if you have a bank of 5 Painkillers, and some enemies can take up to four bullets to the head before they go down. So, unless you know for a fact that there isn't going to be a reinforcement spawn in a particular direction you jump in, doing a forward jump is all too likely to land in a position that leaves you pointed in the wrong direction and vulnerable to a one-shot kill from spawning enemies before the game gives you back control. So, instead, you move back and forth in the rear zone and play shooting gallery against barely moving targets, making forward leaps only when you can see that there are no entrances in one direction. Or you play it smart, retreat a bank, and gun everything down as it comes to you one at a time.

So, why play on Hard? Because the game is so mind-numbingly piss-easy (with a mouse anyway) that putting it on Normal means there is no challenge whatsoever. On Normal, you are effectively placed in God Mode Light, lacking only the Infinite Painkillers Cheat that comes later. (Infinite Painkillers. Yay, make the game even easier.) In other words, it's average generic simplified console shooter, but well-polished average generic simplified console shooter.

As for story. Yes, the earlier Max Paynes were cheesy comic book noir. But there is cheesy comic book noir and then there are abysmal failures to tell a story that make cheesy comic book noir look like a literary masterpiece in comparison. A story where everyone lacks motivation for anything they do, where characters don't hold their personalities from one scene to the next, where the bosses are just generic nameless enemies that mean nothing to you or anyone, and where the plot only proceeds through countless coincidences and Max being turned into Rockstar standard gormless, moronic, thug-for-hire with a knack for gunning people down. A "clusterfuck" is a good word for it. Too bad they shove that clusterfuck in your face so often, making it a major focus of the game, so there isn't even the excuse that one can just click past it to get to the shooty bits. Not that the shooty bits are anything to write home about anyway.
 

DalekFlay

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The only reason MP3's shooting works on a console is because they added a massive amount of auto-aim to it. Compared to most other modern shooters MP3 had a lot of vertical and fast aiming required to succeed.
 

Haba

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I absolutely don't understand this argument. I think the gunplay was absolutely smooth, responsive, the weapons had a punch to them if I remember correctly, the character movement was fluid, the weapon accuracy was satisfying, with the pistols being kinda old school-ishly precise for the required head-shot delivery.

Most of my deaths were not because of the hard enemies or any failing from my part. I either got stuck somewhere, the game didn't let me shoot with the gun I wanted to shoot with (or in the direction I wanted to shoot at) or then it was scripted. Even when playing with mouse, the controls felt clunky. Lunging around got me always striking an invisible edge somewhere. MP 1&2 have multitudes smoother controls.

I can forgive the plot, but the fact that the game isn't fun to play is kinda hard to ignore. Not to mention that with Max whining at you every 30 seconds if you take a break from killing people, you can't even look for clues in peace.
 

dnf

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ripping off The Matrix.
...except that the first game wasn't ripping off the Matrix. The devs claim that the idea of bullet time was before the Matrix came out.

Shortly speaking, go read background information before making any claims like that, idiot.

Indeed, Matrix helped Remedy to promote the game for free.

The influence you're looking for is Hardboiled.




That said, I recommend Stranglehold. You probably can buy it for peanuts and I had more fun with it than MP3. The latter wasn't a bad game, it was just not memorable as the first two. Too many cutscenes and Max is an alcoholic and drug addict. Man on Fire by Rockstar edition.
Thanks for the reccomendation. Stranglehold was a blast to play and it's better than the old skoll paynes except for weapon variety and 2 gun limit. While Payne 3 gets constantly stuck in the enviromnent, Officer Tequila takes advantage of it in a variety of ways. Too bad the game bombed injustly maligned as a Max Payne ripoff, John Woo Knows his shit when it comes to translate his movies into a game.
 

dnf

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ripping off The Matrix.
...except that the first game wasn't ripping off the Matrix. The devs claim that the idea of bullet time was before the Matrix came out.

Shortly speaking, go read background information before making any claims like that, idiot.

Indeed, Matrix helped Remedy to promote the game for free.

The influence you're looking for is Hardboiled.




That said, I recommend Stranglehold. You probably can buy it for peanuts and I had more fun with it than MP3. The latter wasn't a bad game, it was just not memorable as the first two. Too many cutscenes and Max is an alcoholic and drug addict. Man on Fire by Rockstar edition.
Thanks for the reccomendation. Stranglehold was a blast to play and it's better than the old skoll paynes except for weapon variety and 2 gun limit. While Payne 3 gets constantly stuck in the enviromnent, Officer Tequila takes advantage of it in a variety of ways. Too bad the game bombed, injustly maligned as a Max Payne ripoff, John Woo Knows his shit when it comes to translate his movies into a game.
 
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Thanks for the reccomendation. Stranglehold was a blast to play and it's better than the old skoll paynes

dumbfuck.gif
 

Keldryn

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GTA4 also has a huge level of detail and yet is able to load it all on the go with MUCH higher draw distance than MP3 to boot, and it doesn't even require loading for entering buildings. So no, it must be some other reason.

GTA4 barely has a fraction of the environmental detail that MP3 does. The GTA4 world is practically empty in comparison. The devs were trying to push the limits as to how much detail could be packed into one small area. I know this because I was there for the first part of it (as a level designer/scripter).

I quit about a month after the changeover to the GTA4 engine, so most of my experience working on the game was on the previous engine. There was a massive performance hit when we made the change, and I think that it had everything to do with the fact that the engine was written to continually stream in larger areas with lower levels of detail. It wasn't designed to handle the level of detail and object density in our environments.

As an aside, one of my friends (also a designer) who stayed on through the end told me that there is one place on his level where you can outrun the streaming system and watch all of the NPCs spawn around you. Nobody had reported it online when he told me about it (2 years ago), but I'm sure it's probably been discovered now.

But yes, some cutscenes are unskippable in order to allow enough time to load everything into memory.
 

sexbad?

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As an aside, one of my friends (also a designer) who stayed on through the end told me that there is one place on his level where you can outrun the streaming system and watch all of the NPCs spawn around you. Nobody had reported it online when he told me about it (2 years ago), but I'm sure it's probably been discovered now.
I found a part like that in the first favela mission, as I recall. I was running through some elevated rooms when all of a sudden I entered a room made of primitives with no floor, and I waited a little for everything to show up.

That last sentence of yours seems like something that probably made sense before you left. There are some cutscenes that last for two or three minutes just to load one or two rooms, though.
 

Keldryn

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I found a part like that in the first favela mission, as I recall. I was running through some elevated rooms when all of a sudden I entered a room made of primitives with no floor, and I waited a little for everything to show up.

That doesn't surprise me. I had no end of challenges scripting the gameplay in a much earlier incarnation of that level. The visual geometry was streaming in, but none of the collision or physics, so I'd have NPCs spawning on rooftops and falling through the void. My solution at that stage of development was to join all of the rooftop planes into one single object so that it stayed in memory the whole time. :)

The two favela levels had a lot more complex level geometry than say, the office building.

That last sentence of yours seems like something that probably made sense before you left. There are some cutscenes that last for two or three minutes just to load one or two rooms, though.

I was just going on what I was told by friends who stayed on to finish the game. The cutscenes aren't timed to conceal loading; they're as long as the writers wanted them to be. They're just made unskippable because the game is often loading game data in the background. We were only just getting a placeholder cutscene system (via scripting) into the game when I left.

Gunplay in MP3 was good, however the way they wrote Max and the console save system suck donkey balls.

The save/checkpoint system posed some real challenges for believable level design. There are only so many times you can have a door or gate close & lock behind the player before it gets ridiculous. Dropping down from a height beyond which Max could climb back up was at least a more natural method for the favela levels.

For those of you who are interested in futher design insights/tales, open up the SPOILER tag below:

This is a major tangent from what I replied to, but I started thinking about all of this when I was responding, so....

I only did the early scripting on the first favela level, but the second favela level was my layout, based on a short design document provided to me.

I based my level around the concept that you're just trying to get out of this hellhole; the paths twist and turn and you can go up to the rooftops or down to the streets, but as long as you're going downhill, you're on the right path. There were a few spots (for checkpoints) where multiple paths would converge and you'd get a clear visual that you were making your way down the hill -- including one spot near the end where the checkpoint has you looking back up at the hillside right at where you started so that you really got a sense as to how far you've come. I had multiple pathways where you could move back and forth between upper-level and mid-level walkways as well as the ground.

I don't see much of that original design in the final game, but that's not unsurprising, nor is it necessarily a bad thing for the game. The vision for the game changed during the course of development. Initially, some of the levels were designed as a "free roaming within a confined area" approach, while the final game was a more focused and tightly-scripted experience.

The three levels that I spent most of my time on all happened to take place in residential areas, so I wanted to take a bit of inspiration from Ultima VII and give the appearance that there are people living here, going about their daily lives -- at least until the shooting begins. I liked the idea of moving from one part of the favela to another via rooftops and interiors instead of the ground so that you would see parts of the city ahead of the enemies getting there, rather than just progressing through a mostly-abandonded area shooting everyone in sight.

The third of those levels never made it into the game, as it was based on an environment from the beginning of City of God that exists outside of Rio and not Sao Paulo, but we didn't know that until the artists took a research trip. The main enemy in the game at the time was involved in some voodoo-ish stuff, so I had a religious cult set up in a compound in this level. They were bullying and oppressing the general populace, and I had this idea that by the time Max reaches the compound at the end of the level, he could have a number of allies, depending on his actions throughout the stage. The people would be inspired to take up arms if they saw Max defending them from their oppressors or if he interacted with them in a positive way.

It wouldn't have been a good fit for the final game, but I thought it was a cool idea that added some depth while still allowing players to just run and shoot if they wanted to.
 

sexbad?

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I don't favor either possibility very much. The developers wanted long cutscenes to mask long console loading times, or they just wanted to tell the story through hours of cutscenes that coincidentally can't be skipped, hmm...

Considering there are plenty of little cutscenes that have no dialogue and, say, show the protagonist going to another side of a room, I'd posit that some of the cutscenes really are there for the former reason as well.

I like the sound of the original level design a lot, and it's unfortunate that it became much more heavily scripted and funneled later on. Also, the cult sounds like a lot of fun.
 

Wilian

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Max Payne 3 was game I'd have loved to play since the shooting mechanics are very solid, but the game apparently didn't want me to play as it kept taking control away every few minutes quite literally. Ultimately it became too frustrating and I didn't have will to go on.
 

DalekFlay

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I don't favor either possibility very much. The developers wanted long cutscenes to mask long console loading times, or they just wanted to tell the story through hours of cutscenes that coincidentally can't be skipped, hmm...

Considering there are plenty of little cutscenes that have no dialogue and, say, show the protagonist going to another side of a room, I'd posit that some of the cutscenes really are there for the former reason as well.

I like the sound of the original level design a lot, and it's unfortunate that it became much more heavily scripted and funneled later on. Also, the cult sounds like a lot of fun.

You actually CAN skip the cutscenes you know, if the loading is complete. It's just rare you notice, because the loading takes forever.
 

sexbad?

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I don't favor either possibility very much. The developers wanted long cutscenes to mask long console loading times, or they just wanted to tell the story through hours of cutscenes that coincidentally can't be skipped, hmm...

Considering there are plenty of little cutscenes that have no dialogue and, say, show the protagonist going to another side of a room, I'd posit that some of the cutscenes really are there for the former reason as well.

I like the sound of the original level design a lot, and it's unfortunate that it became much more heavily scripted and funneled later on. Also, the cult sounds like a lot of fun.

You actually CAN skip the cutscenes you know, if the loading is complete. It's just rare you notice, because the loading takes forever.
I do know that I can, but it might as well be unskippable. The "loading" must be artificially lengthened, or something. Perhaps there's some kind of restriction on what's allowed to load in, and when, so that the cutscenes will still run smoothly.
 

Ezekiel

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I like the stories of Max Payne 2 and 3 better than the original game's. I find their tones more consistent. Max Payne 1 does have an interesting enough story, but it's pretty out there, with a government conspiracy, a secret underground base you'd expect in James Bond, super soldiers and a lot of other stuff that isn't quite noir. I'm not gonna gonna go into a lot of detail about the story, since it's pretty subjective and the fans will never agree with me anyway. I also know the original doesn't want to be taken too seriously. It's almost satirical at times. The writing of Max Payne 3 is... alright. Dan Houser doesn't write very good dialogue. James McCaffrey delivers his lines well overall. His acting has improved and he sounds less monotone than in the original. Although, maybe that was intentional.

Max Payne's cities always had strong atmosphere with an impressive attention to detail, and Max Payne 3's are no exception. But I preferred the cities of the previous games because there weren't so many interruptions and the encounters weren't so segmented. Not just enemy encounters, but friendlies too. You could go near them without a cutscene and listen to some amusing dialogues. This is almost entirely gone in Max Payne 3. You can still interact with objects (clues), but you only hear Max's monologues the first time you discover them. Doesn't matter if you're replaying a level. The only solutions are deleting your save file or watching them on YouTube. It's been so long since I interacted with them that I can't possibly remember what he says.

The soundtrack is more varied and the presentation is impressive. I like the comic book panels from the first two games, but I see them as a limitation of the time. I have no problem with the cutscenes, aside from them not being skippable and being videos instead of in-engine footage. Max Payne 3 tries to pay homage to the comic book cutscenes by sometimes placing scenes over each other with tiles.

Bullet time was improved in the two sequels. Shoot dodge didn't let you jump far enough in the original, and when you landed, there weren't the satisfying body on environmental reactions from Max Payne 3. Can you slide down slanted surfaces in Max Payne 1? I don't remember. The physics and weighty animations are a huge part of Max Payne 3. Enemies react to every bullet before and after they're dead.

I like the temporary carry system from Max Payne 3 better. You see, it takes longer to switch weapons with the permanent carry system. You need to press the number key once to select the weapon type and then a few more times to select the specific weapon within that category. Switching weapons in Max Payne 3 is instantaneous. Max Payne 3 has a lot more guns and on average I use more of them by picking up and dropping them. The attachments button is a missed opportunity. It would have been nice if instead of just being able to turn laser sights off and on, you could also fire grenades with mounted launchers.

The optional zoom and the shoulder swapping are great additions, and although I don't use the cover system very much, it has been very useful to me in both single player and multiplayer.

The biggest problem of Max Payne 3's gameplay is that you don't get enough opportunities to experiment, as the action is separated by too many cutscenes and the levels are less open. My New York Minute Hardcore run had only 84 minutes of gameplay. My individual level speedruns combined are much shorter than that. You barely get any opportunities to try out the sniper rifles. In Max Payne 1, you had a few open areas for them. Max is a beast in this game. It's almost disappointing how quickly the gunfights end. As I was playing Dead Men Walking (which pits you against endless enemies in a big map) for two and a half hours yesterday, I noticed that the enemies don't know your position unless they see you. I was able to get up behind them and shoot them in the back. You never see this kind of AI in the game because the levels are so linear and the gunfights are over so quickly.

Thankfully, Max Payne 3 finally has the multiplayer that Remedy said they wanted to implement since the first game. Most people will not have the skill and PATIENCE for it. Until a few months ago, I didn't want to play the multiplayer, because I was getting killed far too quickly and often, and I hated the items other players were using. I still very much dislike the bomb suit and sawn off and I take issue with rocket launchers killing me through objects, but they're not used so often that I'm gonna quit. As I find the rocket launcher and grenade launcher cheap, I only use the ones I find on bodies. After firing the explosive, I pick up my gun again. Something I also dislike is how easily visible the name tags and health bars over enemy players are. They don't show through objects, but it still gives your position away too easily at a distance. I think the Hardcore modes remove this, but nobody plays them. I also don't like the radar, how it shows enemy positions when they make noise.

I still have a kill-death ratio of 0.9, meaning I've died more than killed. But I'm having fun. Most of the time... The multiplayer is where the mechanics really shine. It gave me a better appreciation of the different guns' recoil, accuracy, range, power and the reduced accuracy of dual wielding, among other minute details. The levels are big and open enough that you actually have an opportunity to use the sniper rifles. And they're kind of awesome, since the hip fire accuracy is high, even with the dot in the middle of the screen gone. I mean, in what but the Max Payne games can you do this with a sniper rifle? In a match with a kill ratio of 21:6, I was able to kill 11 of them without my scope, using that bolt-action rifle. Didn't matter if I was shoot dodging or running around. Didn't matter if the enemies were fifteen meters away. Most players don't realize that the sniper rifles are that accurate, since the hip fire accuracy is usually so poor in other games. I love that stuff. In fact, I wish every shooter kept the dot there when not using the scope (unless there's no dot to begin with).

The levels are also big enough that two-handed weapons have a bigger advantage over pistols, which don't have far enough range in a lot of situations.

The dodge roll is now essential, the sprint is faster, the crouch is more useful and you can actually throw grenades! Two grenades. The body armor that can be worn in one single player level (the police station) is now a useful item. You have three types of ballistic vests you can wear, whose weight affects health regeneration and stamina regeneration.

You can loot bodies for adrenaline, cash, ammo and painkillers. You can carry up to one bottle of painkillers (unless you equip "Pill Bottle" as part of your loadout), and if you have a bottle on you when you die, you go into last stand, like in single player. The difference is that last stand doesn't put you in slow motion and it doesn't just take one bullet to kill your attacker, so most of the time you will still die.

Adrenaline allows you to use slow motion. You can aim faster than other players while in slow mo. You get adrenaline for killing and, as I said before, you sometimes find it on bodies. There are a bunch of different "perks," abilities that you can use as you rack up kills, but I just use "Bullet Time," because it allows me to go into slow mo with the slow mo button instead of just while shoot dodging.

I also much prefer the manual melee in the multiplayer over the automatic, cinematic one in the single player. It's quicker and it feels powerful. But your character doesn't take the enemy's weapon out of their hands during the melee.

Segmenting the multiplayer into so many different menus was a dumb idea, however. If they had just made one menu from which you can view all the active games of all game types, like in every other decently thought out multiplayer game, people would be more inclined to play. No one wants to wait, not knowing if anyone will join. Making different lobbies for free aim and soft lock only segments the community further. Just remove lock on already. GTA IV didn't need it, Red Dead Redemption didn't need it, GTA V didn't need it and Max Payne 3 doesn't need it. I never used it in any of those games, and I'm not even that great a player.

The game also doesn't inform you of kick votes, so if you're too good and your opponents are sore losers, you can be kicked before you even know that a vote was cast against you. You need to go into the (Esc) menu and select "Vote Kick" to know if any votes are being cast.
 

Master

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Max Payne 2 with Payne Effects 3 mod is freaking insane. Those Dead Man Walking modes just kill my pc with the amount of particles and bodies flying everywhere. And the shooting itself is tightened to the max:roll: like when Max is on the ground after a shootdodge time slows down slightly so you can waste some dudes from the ground and not be a sitting duck. Beautiful. Its like Brutal Doom, but for Max Payne. You just have to turn off post processing effects because well, modders gonna mod! Thats like a goddamn rule of nature isnt it. You cant see shit with it turned on. But it doesnt matter. Why would you waste your time with MP3 next to this thing?
 

Ezekiel

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Max Payne 2 with Payne Effects 3 mod is freaking insane. Those Dead Man Walking modes just kill my pc with the amount of particles and bodies flying everywhere. And the shooting itself is tightened to the max:roll: like when Max is on the ground after a shootdodge time slows down slightly so you can waste some dudes from the ground and not be a sitting duck. Beautiful. Its like Brutal Doom, but for Max Payne. You just have to turn off post processing effects because well, modders gonna mod! Thats like a goddamn rule of nature isnt it. You cant see shit with it turned on.
The stand up animation in MP3 is fine. He stands up quicker if you continue moving after the shoot dodge, using his momentum.



If you're just lying there, then you're fair game as far as I'm concerned. Slow mo is overpowered in these games. It's a fair compromise. I appreciate the weight of the animations. It's not like you can't go into slow mo while prone.

But it doesnt matter. Why would you waste your time with MP3 next to this thing?
This?



Because it looks janky and Max Payne 2 and 3 are very different games that shouldn't be mixed. I also play the multiplayer after many, many hours in the single player because AI is predictable and pretty uncreative.
 
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Master

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1,160
No, Payne Effects. Payne Evolution sucks, i deleted it after 5 minutes.

In MP2 when you finish shootdodge if you continue to shoot (hold click) Max shoots while lying on the ground. Its a cool move but i never used it. You just want to get up and shoot while moving. But in the mod time slightly slows down and without wasting the bullet-meter. Its useful to shoot up some guys and fill the meter so when you get up you can go all out on the rest of them dudes.

Theres other things like when you enter "third degree bullet time" you get infinite slomo and infinite bullets with no reloading but only as long as you keep raking up kills. And, some crazy music kicks in thats completely inappropriate for a Max Payne game but... so damn cool.
 
Joined
May 4, 2017
Messages
631
You know, I've read many of the posts here and I don't understand if the playerbase is suffering because the story can't compare at all with the first two (understandable), if everyone hyped it too much, or if technical issues (huge loading times coupled with cutscenes) are besting the patience of most users.

For someone that played Max payne 2, and knows that the third doesn't have any link to the second when it comes to execution, is it a bad game? Were your expectations suffering because of the prequels, or just because the game is generically bad with a hint of good execution in some parts (as level design)? I'm thinking if getting this game is a good idea or not.
 

Master

Arbiter
Joined
Oct 19, 2016
Messages
1,160
Well i didnt play it. But i saw some videos on youtube. And bullet time somehow sucks. Enemies kinda just keel over and die. In MP2 you could send a guy flying across the room with a desert eagle. Does this game even use Havoc? Another thing is bullet time is too fast and enemies die too fast. Best part in MP2 was when you kill 5-6 guys in bullet time and you turn around and they are all flying in the air. And the first guy you killed, still hasnt fell to the ground. Then you right click and they all fall. Just so baddas. Im not seeing any of that in these videos.
 
Joined
Mar 18, 2009
Messages
7,341
For someone that played Max payne 2, and knows that the third doesn't have any link to the second when it comes to execution, is it a bad game?

It's a fun game when it allows you to play it. Which is not often enough. Rockstar went to great lengths to make shooting feel fun and then apparently decided that game is just too good so they slapped a shitty movie across it.
 
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Ezekiel

Arcane
Joined
May 3, 2017
Messages
5,536
Well i didnt play it. But i saw some videos on youtube. And bullet time somehow sucks. Enemies kinda just keel over and die. In MP2 you could send a guy flying across the room with a desert eagle. Does this game even use Havoc? Another thing is bullet time is too fast and enemies die too fast. Best part in MP2 was when you kill 5-6 guys in bullet time and you turn around and they are all flying in the air. And the first guy you killed, still hasnt fell to the ground. Then you right click and they all fall. Just so baddas. Im not seeing any of that in these videos.
It's the grittier tone. I know people find the word pretentious, but that's it. In reality, bodies don't fly through the air when they're shot at, as if they have no weight. But Max Payne 3 does have good reactions. The characters react to each bullet. It also has exaggerated blowback for the shotguns at least, though the bodies don't lift up into the air.

giphy.gif


This one gets his leg blown back from under him after he's already dead, causing him to land on his face:

giphy.gif

Copying the first two games would have been a mistake. They couldn't recreate what Remedy did. They would have failed and everybody would have criticized them for it. I'm glad the third is different.
 

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